Talking about atheists here on Worthy

[thomas t]

13 hours ago, ayin jade said:

Matthew 7:1 One of the most misinterpreted and misapplied verses in the bible. Other verses speak to judging such as John 7:24.

John 7:24 Do not judge according to sight, but judge righteous judgment.

 

Hi Ayin,

here I agree with @angels4u.

I might add

Matthew 7:1... Jesus talking to his disciples.

John 7:24... Jesus talking to his enemies, so who do you want to be?

Paul clearing up the issue, as another poster has said:

For what have I to do to judge them also that are without? do not ye judge them that are within? 1. Cor 5:12

Thomas

 

 

[missmuffet]

12 hours ago, thomas t said:

Hi Missmuffet,

maybe they sense the mistrust you have against them?

I am really unsure of why people want to say anything about their motives. Why can't we just be workers? In business world, a shop vendor for instance never asks a customer what he or she does with the item bought... they just sell, clean up the house and then go home. Why can't Christians do the same.

Hi Firm Foundation.

Rahab the whore stays among the descendants of Jesus as cited in Matthew, beginning of the book. I think it is the very Rahab mentioned in Josua 2, unbeliever.

Also remember Jesus threatened many many believers with hell.

I think you're writing them off lightly. You give one line and it's these oneliners that could come across as careless. 

We should always give our best, as @Tzephanyahu said, listen to that one!

Thank you very much for your post Tzeph.

Thomas

 

 

 

You are an advocate for the atheist? Are you an atheist or have you ever been an atheist?

[frienduff thaylorde]

On ‎7‎/‎15‎/‎2019 at 2:54 PM, Firm Foundation said:

Explain how that works when we know that unbelievers are hell bound?

Do like peter did ,    he preached some serious stuff to the unbelieving jews ,   had them so scared and shaking in their boots , they then said WHAT must we do TO BE SAVED .

Save some with fear and others with compassion .    And let us never once follow the ideals of this seeker friendly pile of utter stink most try and do .   It don't work

Just speak as you are LED of the SPIRIT and don't worry one ounce what men think about you .    Just FOLLOW the lamb , in the end ITS HE all will be gathered before .

The goats on the left , the sheep on the right .   SO we gonna follow JESUS and not men .       Let all put those hands up and sound some praises out to the LORD .

[thomas t]

10 hours ago, missmuffet said:

You are an advocate for the atheist? Are you an atheist or have you ever been an atheist?

Hi Miss,

no I'm a believer. Actually, I've always been a believer. I grew up with the Bible. My mother gave it to me (she wasn't born again though). My sister didn't believe but I did from the first day on. So I have to rely on @Tzephanyahu's and others' accounts when I should estimate how it feels to be really atheist. But since youth time a used to get to know how unbelievers discuss (sister).

I used to be a believer, but it took me 22 years to find out that for a Christian that you call "born again" it takes to repent.

Let me leave a few more comments of your previous posts.

On 7/15/2019 at 7:27 PM, missmuffet said:

They are employees of Satan.

I find this is disparaging. It's a one liner. This stands in sharp contrast to what you're telling us here:

On 7/15/2019 at 8:09 PM, missmuffet said:

I tell the atheist who Jesus Christ is and that He loves them.

Where's the love in one-liners combining them with Satan, I'm asking myself.

 

Btw, I find Tzeph does a great job describing that provocative remarks don't rule out that you can turn into a believer afterwards.

Regards,

Thomas

 

 

[Michael37]

20 minutes ago, thomas t said:

Where's the love in one-liners combining them with Satan, I'm asking myself.

Hebrews 3:12See to it, brothers, that none of you has an evil or wicked heart of unbelief that turns away from the living God.

I posted this verse on a non-Christian forum that had Christians posting on it. Well, what an atheist backlash. How dare anyone consider their unbelieving hearts evil or wicked.

[Tzephanyahu]

Yes, if someone referred to me directly or indirectly as an "employee of satan", I would have laughed and joked in response.  But inside I would be very insulted and disillusioned with looking further into Christianity.  I could have accept I was a sinner but not an "employee of satan", that's too far.   

1 hour ago, Michael37 said:

Hebrews 3:12See to it, brothers, that none of you has an evil or wicked heart of unbelief that turns away from the living God.

I posted this verse on a non-Christian forum that had Christians posting on it. Well, what an atheist backlash. How dare anyone consider their unbelieving hearts evil or wicked.

This is taken out of context.  It is not towards atheists but to believers.  "See to it, brothers...". The subsequent verses also make it clear that the author is writing to believers, not atheists.  It's not suitable to supply this verse to an atheist.

We don't have a detailed account of how the Lord spoke with sinners and tax-collectors specifically.  But we can see that they were warm, welcoming and as "friends" of the Lord, in the eyes of others.   He ate and drank with them and they seemed eager to be around Him.   Therefore, I doubt the Lord referred to them as "employees of satan" or having an "evil, wicked heart".  On the contrary, it was the religious types, who lifted themselves up as special, whom He condemned.

Listen, I know some (most) atheists can be tough to deal with, rude and arrogant.   But how do you imagine they think of Christians who write them off to satan?  Even if that is technically true (which I don't believe it is in every case), how do you imagine that sounds to someone who is struggling to even believe in God?

Edited July 17, 2019 by Tzephanyahu

[Michael37]

2 hours ago, Tzephanyahu said:

This is taken out of context.  It is not towards atheists but to believers.  "See to it, brothers...". The subsequent verses also make it clear that the author is writing to believers, not atheists.  It's not suitable to supply this verse to an atheist.

It was actually a former Pastor who had converted from Christianity to Atheism and evolution who initially objected, and it was him I was in discussion with. I could have made that clear when I posted Hebrews 3:12 here. Basically he lost his position as a Baptist pastor because the hierachy decided they wanted all their pastors to have a University Degree. Guess what? He went to University to study for a degree and after studying evolution-based science began to doubt his faith and the Bible until he renounced Christ, much to the utter dismay of his Christian wife and extended family. Very sad, and he is vehemently opposed to the Scriptural teaching that his heart of unbelief is evil.

[thomas t]

Hi Michael.

Still, that passage doesn't apply to him. If he's outside the church than he's out of the realm Hebrews 3:12 is talking about.

You made a big mistake, in my opinion. You've attacked someone on the personal level. This happened on a public board. This is so so sad.

Thomas

P.S.:

4 minutes ago, Michael37 said:

He went to University to study for a degree and after studying evolution-based science began to doubt his faith and the Bible until he renounced Christ, much to the utter dismay of his Christian wife and extended family.

this does happen. Hopefully we can make a convincing case in the future.

[Michael37]

1 minute ago, thomas t said:

Hi Michael.

Still, that passage doesn't apply to him. If he's outside the church than he's out of the realm Hebrews 3:12 is talking about.

You made a big mistake, in my opinion. You've attacked someone on the personal level. This happened on a public board. This is so so sad.

Thomas

P.S.:

this does happen. Hopefully we can make a convincing case in the future.

No, I didn't attack him. Calm down. We had been conversing about a whole range of topics for a few years on the Freedictionary Forum,, particularly science. All very civil. He just reacted to any thought that there was a Divine Being who decided what was good and what was evil.

[thomas t]

1 minute ago, Michael37 said:

No, I didn't attack him.

I don't understand.

Last time you wrote this:

12 minutes ago, Michael37 said:

and it was him I was in discussion with.

so you wrote him that verse Hebrews 3:12? So why is that not attacking, in your opinion?

Of course you can insult using Bible verses, in my opinion.

Look I don't have anything against you personally. It's just that some among us want to outreach to the non-believers... and then we have another group posting statements like saying they have wicked hearts. How does this work together, I'm asking myself. We shouldn't work against one another. The latter shouldn't destroy the work of the former, please.

Thomas