Learn a lesson from the Great Awakening ...

[Alive]

40 minutes ago, OneLight said:

I need to interrupt here.  You do not see Jesus dealing with believers after they were saved in the letters to the seven churches?   In advance of you answering, if the answer somehow tries to indicate that they were not true believers in the first place, please explain to me how someone can lose what they never had for each incident of Jesus telling them to repent.  The only exception would be Jezebel as there is no indication that a false prophetess is saved.

I guess it all depends on where you place history on your stage of truth.  For me, I do believe history is written in such a way as to highlight major points the writer wants to make, while eliminating the minor points for the sake of the major points.  I also believe that history, not being scripture, reflects the idea of the writer only and rarely is neutral.  In other words, what is church history is not the full truth.  I don't make this claim lightly, but after years of comparing what some history says and placing it beside scripture, meaning that when history tells us what is meant in scripture, I put on my Berean glasses and go to work.

As for learning what scripture is saying, it is vitally important to allow the Holy Spirit to teach you what is true and what is not.  I hold the teaching from the Holy Spirit far above any history book for the reasons stated above.  Again, the Bereans were complimented for their not taking the words of Paul and Silas as truth until they placed it beside scripture.

May I ask why you believe the church is in such a state it is in today?  I believe one of the reasons is told to use in 2 Timothy 4:1-5 where Paul is speaking of time that will come, which I say is here now.

I charge you therefore before God and the Lord Jesus Christ, who will judge the living and the dead at His appearing and His kingdom: Preach the word! Be ready in season and out of season. Convince, rebuke, exhort, with all longsuffering and teaching.  For the time will come when they will not endure sound doctrine, but according to their own desires, because they have itching ears, they will heap up for themselves teachers; and they will turn their ears away from the truth, and be turned aside to fables.  But you be watchful in all things, endure afflictions, do the work of an evangelist, fulfill your ministry.

I italicized and underlined the verse I am addressing.  More and more people today want nothing more than a handout and to have to do nothing for it. This mindset is growing by leaps and bounds.  Everyone wants all the free stuff they can get without lifting a finger for it, not caring that someone else is paying for it.  Without hijacking this into a political debate, I'll just say think Socialism.   I am sure you you see it also.

This very same mindset can be seen in some theology circles today where it is taught that after salvation no sin you commit needs repentance as they will be held against you.  Salvation is a free gift from God, but they take this free gift and run it to the end of their lives to mean something it is not meant to mean.  They abuse the Mercy of God by not taking responsibility for their own actions.  Some do this to the point that they claim they never sin anymore.  They are being taught that they don't need repentance, they are just fine with whatever they do.  These had itching ears and they sought out someone who will say just what they wanted to hear, turning from the truth held in scripture - ignoring parts of scripture that disagrees with their theology.  Welcome to the church of the Laodiceans

 

I will get to this in the morning when I can give it the attention it deserves.

[OneLight]

1 hour ago, Justin Adams said:

2000 years ago Yeshua died for my sins. They were ALL future sins and shortcomings. They are/were all forgiven. A one time Salvation from my sin.

Sadly, the Augustinian "sin dogma" was adopted and is still taught today. It has a wicked focus on sin and so we are constantly lectured about it. The evil powers love this constant 'guilt trip' because it overshadows the Heart of God and His Messiah.

I suggest you read this and understand it well.  https://www.gospeltruth.net/aug/sinsofaug.htm
That is the basis of much of our 'sin doctrine' and an over focus on it all.

The evil powers HATE that we are forgiven for all time and try to constantly muddy our understanding of forgiveness.

See it this way: we are JUSTIFIED thru Jesus/Yeshua this means our verdict of NOT GUILTY has been passed by the Father.

Guess my explanation didn't help as you are still not seeing any part a believer plays in his role of being In Christ.  Have you informed Jesus that He was wrong to tell the believes in the seven church that they needed to repent.  Don't you think He should know that you disagree with Him too?  Oh wait, He already knows you disagree with Him.

[OneLight]

6 minutes ago, Alive said:

I will get to this in the morning when I can give it the attention it deserves.

Thank you as your replies always challenges mine without any twisting of my words to support an answer.  I appreciate when someone respects me enough to ask for clarification when not sure.

[OneLight]

39 minutes ago, Behold said:

Salvation is a Gift.  

Stop trying to keep yourself saved.  Instead, give all Credit due Christ alone for saving you and keeping you saved.

Don't try to take this credit for yourself by teaching a gospel of "abide and repent", as this is self effort, and self effort has no place "In Christ".

Have you not heard, every good work we do comes from God!  Every sin we commit comes from us.  Don't confuse the two.  Repentance comes from God as it is by the conviction of His Holy Spirit that we are moved to repent.  It's nothing I do, but Him through me.  What is on me is when I refuse to obey the Holy Spirit and refuse to repent when I sin.  Though they are intertwined through the relationship we have with God, the two are miles apart in definition.

[Debp]

4 hours ago, OneLight said:

   you claim we don't have to repent of sins after we are saved because we are justified

Are you mixing me up with some other member's posts??   Because my previous response to you said nothing about repentance.    My response to you was simply telling the difference between justification and sanctification.

 

[Behold]

30 minutes ago, OneLight said:

I'm not going to repeat over and over again the same replies to your intentional misunderstanding of what I said and/or your purposeful twisting of the meanings of my statements.  All I will say is that you are absolutely wrong about what my replies are saying, ignoring scripture I provided to you and everyone else who is asking the very same questions over and over again.  Quotes please, they don't lie!

I've not lied about you.  I just show you, you.

@OneLight... the reality is, you have been telling me, and everyone you can find on this forum, for years, that they can lose their salvation.   Your reason being, is, that you have concluded that you keep yourself saved, or you are not saved.   You will then teach your gospel, which is......"Jesus started my salvation, but to stay saved i must keep abiding and repenting".

Thats reality.  That is your gospel of self saving, of Keeping yourself saved, by what you say does it for you... "abide and repent".

Edited May 24, 2020 by Behold

[Debp]

4 hours ago, Behold said:

You posted a verse that Says God will not remember your sin.  You will add to the verse your gospel of..."well what God means is that he wont remember any , up to the Cross , but all sins you commit after you are saved, are on YOU to deal with by repenting to keep myself saved"

 

Brother, I think you meant to address another member with the above remark.

Maybe everyone needs to take a little breathe just now.   The other member also attributed words to me that I didn't say.

[OneLight]

2 minutes ago, Debp said:

Are you mixing me up with some other member's posts??   Because my previous response to you said nothing about repentance.    My response to you was simply telling the difference between justification and sanctification.

 

Please accept my apologies if I mistook the meaning of your post.  For many weeks now I have been asked the same question by many members in many different ways, and since sanctification and justification is a process one lives through until they die, I saw your post as just another way to ask the same question as it does encompass sin and repentance.  I'll reread your post and respond.

[Behold]

5 minutes ago, Debp said:

Brother, I think you meant to address another member with the above remark.

Maybe everyone needs to take a little breathe just now.   The other member also attributed words to me that I didn't say.

Thank you. , sorry.

= deleted.

Edited May 24, 2020 by Behold

[OneLight]

5 minutes ago, Behold said:

I've not lied about you.  I just show you, you.

@OneLight... the reality is, you have been telling me, and everyone you can find on this forum, for years, that they can lose their salvation.   Your reason being, is, that you have concluded that you keep yourself saved, or you are not saved.   You will then teach your gospel, which is......"Jesus started my salvation, but to stay saved i must keep abiding and repenting".

Thats reality.  That is your gospel of self saving, of Keeping yourself saved, by what you say does it for you... "abide and repent".

If you were speaking the truth about me, you would not ignore the many times where I show you who I am.  Instead, you refuse to see me and begin to tell me who you think I am.  There is no honesty in that.  You twist the meaning of the words I post to support this ongoing argument where most of my replies are correcting you of your error in judgment of me and misunderstanding of what I post.  Tell me, do you ever see yourself as being wrong or do you see yourself as perfect in every way?