Battle of the mind, overcoming the flesh

[Whyme]

7 minutes ago, Josheb said:

I spent 25 yours working with young men and women with developmental disabilities; IQ in the range 55 to 70. Many of them accepted Jesus as their Lord and Savior yet their cognitive abilities were not that they understood the war. Did they know Jesus?

Do please clarify exactly what must be understood about the war to show someone knows Jesus. Or.... if that's not what was meant correct it so I correctly understand.

But dont they still understand right and wrong? If so then arent they in the battle?

Edited April 27, 2021 by Whyme

[Whyme]

8 minutes ago, Josheb said:

You should check the Greek with the Romans 8 text. Our English translations insert qualifiers into the text but the Greek is very blunt: mind of flesh and mind of spirit. There is not "set" or "governed" or any other qualifier. Paul was not talking about choice or behavior in those few verses. He was writing about an ontological and existential condition. Remember not to proof-text the verse but understand it as one verse in a much, much longer narrative that covers several chapters, including the description of his own struggle, concluding with the declaration nothing can separate us from the love of God found in Christ. 

 

That is not to say we aren't supposed to think. We are. And we are to think rightly and think rightly informed by the Spirit because.... the mind of flesh is hostile to God and it does not and cannot please God. The mind of Spirit, conversely, is life. There are many verses in scripture instructing us to think well. That cannot be done with a mind of flesh. 

Hence the battle.

I didnt prooftext, i gave an interpretation based on the English translations. You will need to dumb your post down for me. I dont read Greek. Please give me your translation of the complete verse about the mind being set on the things of spirit or flesh. Thank you.

[Alive]

I have been in the Lord for 46 years and there have been many chapters in that time related to what I knew, thought I knew and hoped to know regarding the Lord and how all things work in the walk until the Change.

There are many wonderful lessons learned that are helpful.

In the end, what I have been left with in conclusion--is a very simple thing.

I 'know'---I 'know'. I can do nothing of any value whatsoever without Him. My hands are empty. I cannot get up in the morning, walk or breathe without Him--never mind comprehend what I can't see. Even understanding lacks understanding.

That last, methinks, is a good place to be.

This place requires a lifetime of screwing up of all kinds--we strive, we fight, we try until we are worn out and we give up. Its then, that we discover in some small measure, rest and the Victory...Christ.

[Alive]

I am sorry that my post is a departure from the OP--or maybe not. I do have an idea for a new OP.

:-)

later--I have to climb a ladder for a while.

[Zemke]

11 hours ago, Mike Mclees said:

This is a good post . I would sum it it up. If we don't understand the war then We never knew Jesus. If it were not for grace we would have no hope at all. That is an  absolute truth. Thank God that there is a day coming soon.   

Well thanks, Mike, but I will give you space to quantify your response. The choice of wording may have been unfortunate, especially for a message board. Stating that if we "aren't in the battle" would have been better. 

More in line with James when he wrote, "Consider it joy, my brethren, when you encounter various trials, knowing that the testing of your faith produces endurance." 

Boards in themselves are a battle field and no matter how we intend our writing to be understood it many times is chopped up to pieces. And thanks again about the response but the time spent with other brothers during the weeks of Resurrection and Passover time were wonderful this year. The Lord was gracious in our gatherings and many were saying how blessed they where by what leadership had put together.

 

 

[Starise]

I am reminded of the words from an old hymn that starts out like this-

" I am resolved no longer to linger charmed by the worlds delights, things that are higher things that are nobler, these have allured my sights."

The Chorus is- " I will hasten to Him, hasten so glad and free, Jesus- greatest highest I will come to thee."

The main thing I have found in my own life is the idea of keeping on or holding that grip on the good thoughts and spiritual things. A mind occupied on God is not occupied on sin.

STILL- If you think that you will one day arrive to a place where you made it, that's the wrong way of looking at it. It's a constant minute by minute, hour by hour kind of thing. If you think you made it and let your guard down you will  fall. The Christian life is a CONTINUAL thing. All it takes to fall is to look away from God and become distracted with something else. Of course our sinful nature doesn't really want to do that . Instead it wants to do what it wants to do. I could be wrong but I doubt any of us are capable of holding on 24/7 non stop until we go to be with the Lord. I have seen sin slowly weeded out of my life over time to the point where when I see something inside of me is revolted by it, yet another part of me wants more of it occasionally which after all of this time I don't understand sometimes why it still tries to hang on. After being in the Lord for awhile you start to think this shouldn't be a draw any longer, yet that stubborn flesh still hangs on for all it's worth sometimes.

The scriptures talk of a dog returning to it's own vomit. I know, it's a gross way of putting the point across, but that's really how I see sin now and if I fall I feel I have just returned to the vomit puddle. Whatever the vomit puddle is for you, it should cause you to look at it in disgust. Why go back there? " Things that are higher, Things that are nobler".....think on these things. And where do these thoughts always lead? If we think of whatsoever is good, whatsoever is holy? That's always going to be the Lord Jesus. What could be more holy? More noble? More good? Why Jesus of course.

Even knowing all of this we still fall sometimes. The mature believer sees the vomit puddle for what it really is. Confesses the sin and vows never to return.

[Whyme]

3 hours ago, Josheb said:

Do you know what proof-texting is? 

 

A transliteration of the Greek can be found in many Bible websites such as Bible Hub or Bible Gateway. HERE is the Greek transliteration of Romans 8: 6. You do not have to read Greek. 

Isnt proof texting the same as cherry picking? And not using the context of a verse or taking it out of context? Yes i know what it is. But i didnt do that. Now if you want to give me a translation, i'll read it. Give me a minute to read your link.

[Whyme]

3 hours ago, Josheb said:

Do you know what proof-texting is? 

 

A transliteration of the Greek can be found in many Bible websites such as Bible Hub or Bible Gateway. HERE is the Greek transliteration of Romans 8: 6. You do not have to read Greek. 

You gave me a translation for verse 6, but i was quoting verse 5.

[Whyme]

3 hours ago, Alive said:

I am sorry that my post is a departure from the OP--or maybe not. I do have an idea for a new OP.

:-)

later--I have to climb a ladder for a while.

No you are good, no worries.

[Alive]

OK--I have decided to go ahead and post this here because its relevant. This thought stream came as a result of something @Josheb posted regarding Paul and Peter. Peter making mistakes and Paul struggling and not understanding.

Neither Paul, Peter or any of the Apostles and early Church members were supermen. They were men in fleshly bodies with the very same born from above experience as we all are--with the same Holy Spirit within and Christ as our Life. Peter spent a lot of time with Jesus and Paul did as well, but this did not turn them into something different from any of us. Consider also, that their own personal revelation of Christ was also gradual, as is ours. One more point to consider; what we read of them--any of them--is not the totality of who they were as men. Fallible, sometimes doubting, tired, discouraged individuals at times yielding to the flesh rather than the Spirit.

We are and have everything they did---In Christ.

Both Paul and Peter struggled with a voice that attempted to shame them for their respective past actions and yet they walked on--each day trusting the Lord for His provisions. Their flesh and ours? The same.

A lot of folks conflate 'sins' with operating in the flesh--there is a distinction there.

Paul's Romans 7 experience will be ours to whatever extent as long as we are in these mortal bodies. Make no mistake about that.

We can experience great victory in Christ as we grow and mature In Him and as our senses are exercised to discern...its a wonderful privilege indeed.