JOSEPHUS

[Marathoner]

3 hours ago, Heleadethme said:

I agree....it can be very useful to lay a thing down, on the altar, and ask God to sift it and try it, and we try to re-examine it with fresh eyes.  I've done it before, and the Lord was faithful to teach and correct and tweek me..... and am doing it now with these end-time things.

I've come upon a stone of offense as of late, finding myself drawn to the old ways where I would stand against another in this flesh. This saying isn't found in the scriptures but there's value in the following words: familiarity breeds contempt. This speaks of our condition striving against that old man who is perishing and we ought to take heed unless we find ourselves currying his favor. 

None of us have arrived yet. The apostle Paul wrote that he hadn't arrived, either. 

Yes, one would think I would have learned to turn away from that old man but he's still there, and will persist until my time arrives and I'm delivered from him at last. That's the hope of our salvation in Christ. Until then, I must be vigilant and remember those lessons which the Lord in His mercy delivered in brokenness.  

Edited May 14, 2021 by Marathoner

[Sower]

1 hour ago, Marathoner said:

A godly and scriptural exhortation to examine ourselves. It's all too easy to seek self-validation which is how we lay the foundation of that high tower. We raise that edifice by traveling the path of least resistance, paying heed to those things which reinforce self-validation brick by brick.

Never heard of having my own 'high tower'
And I agree I don't know it all.
But I repeat this verse below to God several times daily,

The LORD is my rock, and my fortress, and my deliverer;
my God, my strength, in whom I will trust;
my buckler, and the horn of my salvation,
and my high tower.

In studying the various words of this verse, I learned they were describing  'defensive' fortifications. Not a monument/tower to my "own understanding.
I have nowhere near the knowledge of those here that study in depth
theological history, nor desire to put the time in doing so, instead sharing what I do know, to those who don't. I need understand of how to walk. How to abide.
I an concerned about a lot of this 'new understanding' floating around concerning
what the bible 'really says'. And have no problem questioning my beliefs, as I would still be in the RCC working my way to my own salvation.
Scripture speaks about the end times falling away and many false teachers.
I believe it is good to stand on the rock and trust His leading.
Never considered studying Josephus, unless it adds context, but not his beliefs.
I do not believe, for me anyway, anything newly 'discovered' will change my core beliefs or understanding of God's word.
I already have more than I use. As a steward, I need to use it, or I will lose it.
          To whom much is given, much is required.

[Starise]

5 hours ago, Justin Adams said:

I tend to agree. In my dotage I found time to actually study what some people were reported to have said. Since nearly all church doctrine comes from external ideas, I decided to investigate. That's why my 'Futurism' OP. It seems that second and third-hand understanding is just not enough. One has to go to the source, even if one has latched on to something 'palatable' and tasty, you might have to ditch it.

I believe it takes courage and honesty to overthrow some of the faulty ideas we all seem to have taken onboard - often unconsciously. Such is the flavor of the demonic.

The hurdle, for me at least, is in knowing where to look for these early 1st hand accounts. As we can see Josephus was no saint. I think it's probably rare that most Christians have more than a bible and a few references. Going to the local library is unlikely to yield results either. 

Then there is validating what we think is an accurate 1st party account. How would you do that? TBH most historical literature can only be compared to other documents written about similar things in the same time frame or in looking at archaeological digs and dating the relics. That still will not tell us anything relating to many events as they actually happened, especially interpersonal relational or certain decisions made that have nothing to do with relics or historical overviews as narrated by biased men. Much like the CNN of antiquity

[Justin Adams]

3 minutes ago, Starise said:

Much like the CNN of antiquity

That is why I like to listen to per-reviewed scholarship that is painstaking and honest. They do exist. 

[Starise]

2 minutes ago, Justin Adams said:

That is why I like to listen to per-reviewed scholarship that is painstaking and honest. They do exist. 

So long as it isn't peer reviewed at Dallas Theological seminary 

[Alive]

2 hours ago, Marathoner said:

A godly and scriptural exhortation to examine ourselves. It's all too easy to seek self-validation which is how we lay the foundation of that high tower. We raise that edifice by traveling the path of least resistance, paying heed to those things which reinforce self-validation brick by brick. 

The Lord is merciful toward us, remembering that our frame is dust. No one is beyond raising a high tower! He is faithful to demolish every high tower and vain imagining in His beloved, but this can be prove to be a painful and even humiliating experience on our part. High towers... idols... or perhaps that beam in our eye, all of which serve to blind us to our brothers, sisters, and the calling of our Lord Jesus Christ.

Words cannot express my thanksgiving toward the Lord who saves me from myself. I wrote elsewhere that I was broken by the Lord and this is best understood in the context of these high towers, idols, and forest growth blinding my eyes. The Lord demolished the camp I had painstakingly built and when His work was complete, Christ lifted me up and opened my eyes so I might see. I walked through the wreckage and cleaned up the rubble, raising a monumental pile of stubble for the fire. The Lord burned it until there nothing left but ashes. 

That's what we ought to do with the high towers, idols, and forest growth in our eyes. Sacrifice it all and make an offering to the Lord, placing it at His feet. As a reminder that I'm not incapable of raising a camp of pride once again --- I've caught myself in the act a number of times! --- the Lord is swift to humble me, reminding me of the trial I endured for 20 years. It was every bit a fiery trial!

Yes, the Lord was faithful to consume my camp with fire.   

You betcha--it is His faithfulness to bring us through those trials. A testament to His love. It is because of those experiences that we can be aware of the possible pitfalls.

And it is those experiences that allow us to recognize those things in others. Not to use as a hammer, but to minister in love. One more aspect that proves that each of us need the Body and cannot stand alone.

A man that has fallen in a ditch a few times, is more apt to avoid a ditch and is more adept at recognizing a ditch.

:-)

[Justin Adams]

1 hour ago, Starise said:

So long as it isn't peer reviewed at Dallas Theological seminary 

Actually a young man there did his Masters dissertation against his Professor. He studied what he had been told and found it in error regarding Dispensational stuff.

Steve Gregg recounts this in one of his lectures. It is revealing.

[Alive]

1 hour ago, Starise said:

So long as it isn't peer reviewed at Dallas Theological seminary 

I see humor in this--thanks for the chuckle brother.

[Jaydub]

18 hours ago, Your closest friendnt said:

Am I missing something?

Jaydub what is this that reminds you of Isaiah 53 if I may asked.

In the opening post concern has been raise over Josephus saying 

Quote

“At that time also there appeared a certain man of magic power, if it be meet to call him a man, [whose name is Jesus], whom [certain] Greeks call a son of [a] God, but his disciples [call] the true prophet. He was a man of simple appearance, mature age, black-skinned (melagchrous), short growth, three cubits tall, hunchbacked, prognathous (lit. ‘with a long face’ [macroprosopos]), a long nose, eyebrows meeting above the nose, with scanty [curly] hair, but having a line in the middle of the head after the fashion of the Nazaraeans, with an undeveloped beard.”

it specifically  reminded me of this part of Isaiah 53

He had no beauty or majesty to attract us to him,
    nothing in his appearance that we should desire him.
3 He was despised and rejected by mankind,
    a man of suffering, and familiar with pain.

What does a man with no beauty look like?

Three was nothing in his appearance that we should desire him. Because of this scripture, I believe Jesus was not a good looking man. Even an average looking man would have some characteristic that might appeal to us, maybe his eyes or his hair or his build something, but Jesus had nothing that we would desire him, no beauty

As I just said Jesus was not a good looking man, based on that scripture, which to me makes perfect sense. 

the apostles and the people around him were attracted to him because of his Words and his love, as we are today attracted to him, because of hid great love and his word, 

 

 

 

 

 

[Your closest friendnt]

5 hours ago, Jaydub said:

In the opening post concern has been raise over Josephus saying 

it specifically  reminded me of this part of Isaiah 53

He had no beauty or majesty to attract us to him,
    nothing in his appearance that we should desire him.
3 He was despised and rejected by mankind,
    a man of suffering, and familiar with pain.

What does a man with no beauty look like?

Three was nothing in his appearance that we should desire him. Because of this scripture, I believe Jesus was not a good looking man. Even an average looking man would have some characteristic that might appeal to us, maybe his eyes or his hair or his build something, but Jesus had nothing that we would desire him, no beauty

As I just said Jesus was not a good looking man, based on that scripture, which to me makes perfect sense. 

the apostles and the people around him were attracted to him because of his Words and his love, as we are today attracted to him, because of hid great love and his word, 

 

 

 

 

 

I appreciate your response.

I knew of Isaiah 53: as the description of the Messiah the Christ. 

In Isaiah 53 the Prophet described the Messiah not before he was arrested and be put to the test but after his arrest and his suffering the ordeal of carrying his Cross and being marked with the stripes of the wip and wearing the crown of thorns, and the way he was mistreated and spit on and being swear at and being spoken with unkind words,  not fit for the Son of David the Messiah everyone hoped for.

He was rejected they did not esteemed him at that time to be the Christ. 

Before his arrest many believe in him and they did not mind that he did not remind them of King Saul, a man of great statue and skillful in combat ready and fit for the Romans.

Like King David that's how Jesus was in statute, he had to be of a non threatening statute, so the Roman's won't be alarm with his claims or the claims of the people that Jesus was the Son of David.

The Romans were rather entertained just by looking at him and as he was not skilled in the war arts and without carrying a Sword. 

This how his description was that for a Warrior King he was not fit because of his "like David" statute.

Regarding the tone of his skin, the author described him not as an Oriental, neither as an Egyptian, who are quite distinct from middle East people and more particularly fro the area of Syria or Jordan or the Assyria, the upper countries of middle east, that's where Abraham came from and Sarah and Rebekah. 

The people of that area are not look alike Swedish or Norwegians, or from Denmark or from the northern part of Europe.