First Resurrection, is it of Time Place or Rank?

[Selah7]

1 hour ago, DeighAnn said:

ALL THE DEAD STAY IN THE GRAVES DEAD FOR ANOTHER THOUSAND YEARS

I don’t believe this, D, not at all.  

[Dennis1209]

5 hours ago, AdHoc said:

@Dennis1209@DeighAnn@Selah7@Hobie_

Hi you all. The discussion has taken on a dynamic of its own and having slept, I've been left behind a bit. I would like to address some of the points made. Naturally, and correctly, all resurrections are being drawn into the discussion. What we need to do is put each on its box of TIME and PURPOSE. But first we must establish what resurrection is for.

When Adam ate of the Tree of Knowledge of Good and Evil, God issued a command that Adam was to be barred from the Tree of Life in case he "also" at from it and lived forever. The word "also" means that he had not yet eaten from the Tree of Life. Now, this decision of God's to allow Adam (and his seed) to die is remarkable seeing as DEATH is the great and last enemy of God. God purposefully let Adam die - and all men after him. The reason is that Adam's damaged and corrupted body was not fit for God's Kingdom (1st Cor.15:50). It may be fit for David's Kingdom, but not for God's.

So resurrection is first a SOLUTION to an inevitable death. God lets the corruptible die and come to an end, and then allows His Son Jesus to enter death and then overcome it Himself (Jn.10:17-18). Resurrection is the open display of divine power needed to bring the dead to life. And so our Lord Jesus "BECOMES the Life-Giving Spirit" in 1st Corinthians 15:45. And in 15:22 our Lord promises that just as all men who came out of Adam's loins, that is, who were IN Adam, will be resurrected. Resurrection is a sovereign display of God's power to eradicate death. It does not matter whether it is Hitler or Paul the Apostle. God will defeat death.

1st Corinthians 15:23 -26 continues and gives the ORDER of Resurrection - Christ first, then those who are His AT HIS COMING. I will deal with the resurrection of the Old Testament saints from Matthew 27:52-53 shortly. But, continuing with the ORDER, "those who are His AT HIS COMING" implies at least TWO resurrections a few years apart. Why? BECAUSE Israel is His! Our Lord Jesus is Creator and Maker of all things and thus He is OWNER and King of Israel. So when scripture says; "those who are His" it means the Church AND Israel. This sequence is easily followed. the Church is planned to be resurrected BEFORE the Great Tribulation (Lk.21:36, Rev.3:10), and Israel is to be resurrected just after the Great Tribulation (Dan.12:1-2).

1st Corinthians 15:24 onward goes on to tell us that in the ORDER of resurrection, Christ must REIGN for a while while He SUBDUES God's enemies. The last enemy is not Magog. Millions will be slaughtered at the battle with Magog so death is still active. But what we want to discern is, how long is the time between HIS COMING and the last man being resurrected. It is the time from the Churches resurrection until "the REST of the DEAD" are raised at the White Throne. Revelation 20 gives this as 1,000 years. Whether you take this number literally or representatively, the fact is there is a period where the "rest of the dead" stay in Hades until that Great Judgment.

And what is another fact is that at the White Throne THERE ARE NO CHRISTIANS OR ISRAELITES RESURRECTED! They were resurrected "when He came" 1,000 years earlier. So the Bible gives THREE BASIC resurrections:

1. Christ and then 2,000 years pass
2. The Church and Israel "when He comes" and then 1,000 years pass
3. The Rest of the dead when all enemies have been subdued

That is the Grand Picture. But WITHIN this picture are DETAILS. And this is what sometimes causes confusion. Let's start with Christ's resurrection.

Christ was the fulfillment of many things. He is the Lamb, He is the Lion of Judah, He is the Temple of God and He is also the fulfillment of the "Wave Offering" of Exodus 29, Leviticus 7 and 8 etc. And in Leviticus 23, when God regulated the HARVESTS the "Wave Offering" was to be a SHEAF OF WHEAT "waved on the MORROW after the Sabbath" (v.11). God reserves the right, as Lord of the Harvest, to the Firstfruits and Tithes of each harvest. And the "morrow after the sabbath" is the day that Jesus was resurrected and became "FIRSTFRUITS of them that slept" (1st Cor,15:20). But according to John 12:24 our Lord Jesus is ONLY ONE GRAIN - and God commanded a SHEAF! So, on resurrection day our Lord Jesus was raised as THE FIRSTFRUIT and "after" He was raised, but on the same day, a contingent of Old Testament saints were raised from the dead TO COMPLETE THE SHEAF!

So, the grand picture is Christ's resurrection. But WITHIN this picture is some detail - the fulfillment of the Wave Offering. the saints resurrected just after Jesus are for God's SATISFACTION, not to fulfill some theological treatise on resurrection. They are NOT Christ, but the were resurrected within a few hours of Christ to fulfill the wishes of the Master of the Harvest - Jehovah. They are not Christ's resurrection, but they ARE PART OF IT!

So when we come to the resurrection of the Church, there is again the principle of the harvest and, as in every harvest, multiple gatherings. When we come to Israel's resurrection, there is some detail as well. There is the GRAND PICTURE and there is the detail. Don't let them work against each other. RECONCILE THEM!

Well thought out and well-spoken!

I am by no means disagreeing with you, but I have a couple of questions.

1. The wedding guests, the Old Testament saints. Where do you place them in the resurrection? Based on your three Rapture scenarios, I assume you place them at #2? If so, I agree with that, as the general resurrection before the Tribulation deals only with the church.

2. What about the many Jesus resurrected from Abraham's bosom (Hades) after His crucifixion, that were seen by many in Jerusalem? The people the apostles resurrected from the dead? How do we account for them?

My thoughts are, nothing is said they were resurrected in glorified bodies, and this comes to mind:

Hebrews 9:27 And as it is appointed unto men once to die, but after this the judgment:

The aforementioned are all after the Cross. These had to die "twice" or were taken to heaven to await their glorified bodies at the general Rapture of the church. I have thoughts of the souls' given white robes under the altar, asking how much longer.

 

[DeighAnn]

5 minutes ago, Selah7 said:

I don’t believe this, D, not at all.  

Could you maybe give a brief outline of events, I think that would help. 

Here is mine

Under the law the dead remained in the dust of the ground because the law could not forgive sin and sin is death.  Didn't matter if you were one of Gods people or not. All were treated the same when it came to death (with a few righteous in faith exceptions ex David the Lord said to MY LORD sit....)

Christ brought in the NT upon His death and resurrection, went to preach to those under the law and those who came to faith by the blood of Christ were washed clean and so graves were opened and the captivity was lead captive and all those souls resurrected in the spiritual bodies with immortality

Under GRACE there are now the SAVED and the unsaved.  When the unsaved die, they go into the grave where they will stay until Christ returns or the end of the Millennium, none of these are a first resurrection

The SAVED, don't die,  but instead pass through death by dropping of the dead flesh and rising in their spiritual bodies to go be where He is and they return with Him to sit on thrones to reign. Every one of these is a first resurrection.

When Christ returns the unsaved rise up to spend the millennium being ruled over.  at the end they stand in judgment.  Some will find their names in the book of life (just) some will not (unjust).  At this same time death and hell and the sea will give up those already condemned to death.   

Also when Christ returns the alive and remaining are changed to be FOREVER WITH THE LORD there it is.  FINALLY.  

The words that truly started it all.  BEEN trying to remember what started it.  

That is a first resurrection.  

[DeighAnn]

6 hours ago, AdHoc said:

@Dennis1209@DeighAnn@Selah7@Hobie_

Hi you all. The discussion has taken on a dynamic of its own and having slept, I've been left behind a bit. I would like to address some of the points made. Naturally, and correctly, all resurrections are being drawn into the discussion. What we need to do is put each on its box of TIME and PURPOSE. But first we must establish what resurrection is for.

When Adam ate of the Tree of Knowledge of Good and Evil, God issued a command that Adam was to be barred from the Tree of Life in case he "also" at from it and lived forever. The word "also" means that he had not yet eaten from the Tree of Life. Now, this decision of God's to allow Adam (and his seed) to die is remarkable seeing as DEATH is the great and last enemy of God. God purposefully let Adam die - and all men after him. The reason is that Adam's damaged and corrupted body was not fit for God's Kingdom (1st Cor.15:50). It may be fit for David's Kingdom, but not for God's.

So resurrection is first a SOLUTION to an inevitable death. God lets the corruptible die and come to an end, and then allows His Son Jesus to enter death and then overcome it Himself (Jn.10:17-18). Resurrection is the open display of divine power needed to bring the dead to life. And so our Lord Jesus "BECOMES the Life-Giving Spirit" in 1st Corinthians 15:45. And in 15:22 our Lord promises that just as all men who came out of Adam's loins, that is, who were IN Adam, will be resurrected. Resurrection is a sovereign display of God's power to eradicate death. It does not matter whether it is Hitler or Paul the Apostle. God will defeat death.

1st Corinthians 15:23 -26 continues and gives the ORDER of Resurrection - Christ first, then those who are His AT HIS COMING. I will deal with the resurrection of the Old Testament saints from Matthew 27:52-53 shortly. But, continuing with the ORDER, "those who are His AT HIS COMING" implies at least TWO resurrections a few years apart. Why? BECAUSE Israel is His! Our Lord Jesus is Creator and Maker of all things and thus He is OWNER and King of Israel. So when scripture says; "those who are His" it means the Church AND Israel. This sequence is easily followed. the Church is planned to be resurrected BEFORE the Great Tribulation (Lk.21:36, Rev.3:10), and Israel is to be resurrected just after the Great Tribulation (Dan.12:1-2).

1st Corinthians 15:24 onward goes on to tell us that in the ORDER of resurrection, Christ must REIGN for a while while He SUBDUES God's enemies. The last enemy is not Magog. Millions will be slaughtered at the battle with Magog so death is still active. But what we want to discern is, how long is the time between HIS COMING and the last man being resurrected. It is the time from the Churches resurrection until "the REST of the DEAD" are raised at the White Throne. Revelation 20 gives this as 1,000 years. Whether you take this number literally or representatively, the fact is there is a period where the "rest of the dead" stay in Hades until that Great Judgment.

And what is another fact is that at the White Throne THERE ARE NO CHRISTIANS OR ISRAELITES RESURRECTED! They were resurrected "when He came" 1,000 years earlier. So the Bible gives THREE BASIC resurrections:

1. Christ and then 2,000 years pass
2. The Church and Israel "when He comes" and then 1,000 years pass
3. The Rest of the dead when all enemies have been subdued

That is the Grand Picture. But WITHIN this picture are DETAILS. And this is what sometimes causes confusion. Let's start with Christ's resurrection.

Christ was the fulfillment of many things. He is the Lamb, He is the Lion of Judah, He is the Temple of God and He is also the fulfillment of the "Wave Offering" of Exodus 29, Leviticus 7 and 8 etc. And in Leviticus 23, when God regulated the HARVESTS the "Wave Offering" was to be a SHEAF OF WHEAT "waved on the MORROW after the Sabbath" (v.11). God reserves the right, as Lord of the Harvest, to the Firstfruits and Tithes of each harvest. And the "morrow after the sabbath" is the day that Jesus was resurrected and became "FIRSTFRUITS of them that slept" (1st Cor,15:20). But according to John 12:24 our Lord Jesus is ONLY ONE GRAIN - and God commanded a SHEAF! So, on resurrection day our Lord Jesus was raised as THE FIRSTFRUIT and "after" He was raised, but on the same day, a contingent of Old Testament saints were raised from the dead TO COMPLETE THE SHEAF!

So, the grand picture is Christ's resurrection. But WITHIN this picture is some detail - the fulfillment of the Wave Offering. the saints resurrected just after Jesus are for God's SATISFACTION, not to fulfill some theological treatise on resurrection. They are NOT Christ, but the were resurrected within a few hours of Christ to fulfill the wishes of the Master of the Harvest - Jehovah. They are not Christ's resurrection, but they ARE PART OF IT!

So when we come to the resurrection of the Church, there is again the principle of the harvest and, as in every harvest, multiple gatherings. When we come to Israel's resurrection, there is some detail as well. There is the GRAND PICTURE and there is the detail. Don't let them work against each other. RECONCILE THEM!

I totally missed this and am just now about to read it.  I apologize.

[Dennis1209]

5 hours ago, Selah7 said:

Hey there, Dennis …. My thoughts on this section that you posted are that in the Millennium, everyone, the good and the bad, will have been changed into their spiritual bodies.  When does the Millennium begin?  These thousand years begin when Jesus Christ returns at the 7th trump with His Saints who, by the way, have just gone through the First Resurrection.  

There won’t be an increase in population because there is no marriage or births in the Millennium.

"For when they rise from the dead, they neither marry nor are given in marriage, but are like angels in heaven.

- Mark 12:25 

Top of the afternoon to you, Selah,

Not to argue or try and persuade you, but this is a topic I have studied in detail. It would be hard for me to have my opinion swayed or altered on this subject. But as always, I’m all ears. 😊

In my studies, I have concluded several things. There will be zero non-believers that enter the millennium; successive generations will continue to sin, disobey, and start to rebel against Christ ruling.

Christ will reign and rule in the millennium with a rod of iron, and it appears King David will be His second in command. We Christians, the church, and the Old Testament saints in our glorified bodies will be priests and kings and rule and reign with Jesus. Over what and who?

There will be thousands of Messianic Jews and Gentile believers that did not die in the Tribulation and are allowed to enter the millennium. They do not have glorified bodies, but their longevity will be extended by hundreds of years. If someone dies at 100 years old, they will be considered babies. They do not have eternal life, but like it was in longevity in the first ten generations of Adam. I believe the terrible and non-believers will all be killed off at the second coming of Christ. A fresh start for the reign of Christ.

Mark 12:25 For when they shall rise from the dead, they neither marry, nor are given in marriage; but are as the angels which are in heaven.

I see the above on non-rebellious spiritual angels and us in our glorified bodies. There is no reason or purpose to procreate. On the other hand, those flesh & blood believers allowed to enter the millennium will propagate and repopulate the earth IMO.

Satan will be bound for these 1,000 years, so he cannot deceive and influence the nations. What is the purpose of Satan and his minions being chained and bound during this period? I suspect so no one can claim Satan made them do anything. Their human flesh and nature are still unrighteous, and sinful, and they are still in need of a Savior.

Just my thoughts.

[AdHoc]

33 minutes ago, Dennis1209 said:

Well thought out and well-spoken!

I am by no means disagreeing with you, but I have a couple of questions.

1. The wedding guests, the Old Testament saints. Where do you place them in the resurrection? Based on your three Rapture scenarios, I assume you place them at #2? If so, I agree with that, as the general resurrection before the Tribulation deals only with the church.

2. What about the many Jesus resurrected from Abraham's bosom (Hades) after His crucifixion, that were seen by many in Jerusalem? The people the apostles resurrected from the dead? How do we account for them?

My thoughts are, nothing is said they were resurrected in glorified bodies, and this comes to mind:

Hebrews 9:27 And as it is appointed unto men once to die, but after this the judgment:

The aforementioned are all after the Cross. These had to die "twice" or were taken to heaven to await their glorified bodies at the general Rapture of the church. I have thoughts of the souls' given white robes under the altar, asking how much longer.

 

Don't be afraid of disagreeing. It promotes thought on the subject.

1. The Wedding Feast presents no problems. Eve was taken out of Adam (Gen.2:23). Only the Church is taken out of Christ. The Church is made of believers ONLY - Old Testament or New. The Bride can only be Believers who are like Eve (Eph 5:29–30)

"23 ... bone of my bones, and flesh of my flesh: she shall be called Woman, because she was taken out of Man."

29 For no man ever yet hated his own flesh; but nourisheth and cherisheth it, even as the Lord the church: 30 For we are members of his body, of his flesh, and of his bones.

The Bride is made only of Christians and their resurrection is BEFORE the Great Tribulation and Armageddon (Revelation 19).

2. If Enoch and Elijah were taken to heaven BODILY, and our Lord Jesus is BODILY in heaven, there is no reason why all the others are not there. Hebrews 9:27 is upheld then. A man cannot die twice. There are those who advocate that those resurrected died again. I think they should reconsider. Hebrews 9:27 is emphatic, AND there is proof. Elijah was seen on the Mount of Transfiguration some 700 years later. Israel, who broke the Law, and were scattered to the "four winds" are gathered from earth (Ezekiel 37) AND heaven (Matt.24:31). Finally, there is no argument. There is not a single case of a man dying twice in the whole Bible. Students who hold this idea have not a single scripture. They invented it.

A "robe" is ones works (Rev.19:7-8). A "Tent" is a body (2nd Cor.5:1-3).

[DeighAnn]

1 minute ago, DeighAnn said:

Now, this decision of God's to allow Adam (and his seed) to die is remarkable seeing as DEATH is the great and last enemy of God. God purposefully let Adam die

We will be in some disagreement shortly but I must say
Nicely put, don't want to start off with flattery, but I like to recognize these things, 

2 minutes ago, DeighAnn said:

Resurrection is the open display of divine power needed to bring the dead to life.

What do you consider when going from spiritually dead to being made alive by coming to faith?  Do you see or consider that a resurrection of the sprit?

4 minutes ago, DeighAnn said:

1st Corinthians 15:23 -26 continues and gives the ORDER of Resurrection - Christ first, then those who are His AT HIS COMING.

1 Corinthians 15:20 But now is Christ risen from the dead, and become the firstfruits of them that slept.

1 Corinthians 15:21 For since by man came death, by man came also the resurrection of the dead.

1 Corinthians 15:22 For as in Adam all die, even so in Christ shall all be made alive.

1 Corinthians 15:23 But every man in his own order...........

Do you connect these?

Matthew 27:51 And, behold, the veil of the temple was rent in twain from the top to the bottom; and the earth did quake, and the rocks rent;

Matthew 27:52 And the graves were opened; and many bodies of the saints which slept arose,

Matthew 27:53 And came out of the graves after his resurrection, and went into the holy city, and appeared unto many.

4 minutes ago, DeighAnn said:

So when scripture says; "those who are His" it means the Church AND Israel

There is a ROOT to a TREE that has branches.  This tree has been given promises and instructions in Gods word.  They will carry on to the end of time.  

SOME of those branches were broken off, and some new branches were grafted in. 

HOW IS IT POSSIBLE FOR  THE NEW BRANCHES TO SEPARATE THEMSELVES FROM THE OTHER BRANCHES BUT NOT THE ROOT AND EMBARK ON THEIR OWN JOURNEY?  What is written that allows this?  

5 minutes ago, DeighAnn said:

This sequence is easily followed. the Church is planned to be resurrected BEFORE the Great Tribulation (Lk.21:36, Rev.3:10), and Israel is to be resurrected just after the Great Tribulation (Dan.12:1-2).

I am not going to agree.  IF this were true,  they could not have been grafted unto the same root with the original branches and made one.  There would have been no reason to knock down the wall that once separated them.  There is ONLY ONE ROOT.  So this may cause an issue.  I PROPOSE we don't bring up Israel or the church the discussion and just use what is written.  Does that sound good?  I sure hope so.  

6 minutes ago, DeighAnn said:

1st Corinthians 15:24 onward goes on to tell us that in the ORDER of resurrection, Christ must REIGN for a while while He SUBDUES God's enemies. The last enemy is not Magog. Millions will be slaughtered at the battle with Magog so death is still active.

1Corinthians 15:23 But every man in his own order: Christ the firstfruits; afterward they that are Christ's at his coming.
2000 years ago
every SAVED man since
the alive and remaining

 

1 Corinthians 15:24 Then cometh the end,
the end of the millennium in which these things take place

when he shall have delivered up the kingdom to God, even the Father; when He shall have put down all rule and all authority and power.1 Corinthians 15:25 For He must reign, till He hath put all enemies under His feet.
1 Corinthians 15:26 The last enemy that shall be destroyed is death.
Satan into lake of fire

 

1 Corinthians 15:27 For He hath put all things under His feet. But when He saith all things are put under Him, it is manifest that He is excepted, which did put all things under him.

1 Corinthians 15:28 And when all things shall be subdued unto Him, then shall the Son also Himself be subject unto Him that put all things under Him, that God may be all in all.
LORD GOD ALMIGHTY

 

7 minutes ago, DeighAnn said:

• Christ and then 2,000 years pass
• The Church and Israel "when He comes" and then 1,000 years pass
• The Rest of the dead when all enemies have been subdued

Christ and all those who died under the law - now finding forgiveness through the blood of the Lamb Slain and coming to the Lord  are the the captivity led captive  the graves opened to show death has been defeated for the SAVED.  
 

John 11:24 Martha saith unto him, I know that he shall rise again in the resurrection at the last day.

John 11:25 Jesus said unto her, I am the resurrection, and the life: he that believeth in me, though he were dead, yet shall he live:
the graves opened, the captivity led captive the END OF THE OLD COVENANT OF SIN AND DEATH
 

John 11:26 And whosoever liveth and believeth in me shall never die. Believest thou this?
THE BEGINNING OF THE NEW COVENANT under grace with the GIFT of Salvation, never die, pass through death, never see decay, never decompose because risen in spiritual body 

This is the thing about coming back for a body  AT A 'last day' 

DECOMP CAN'T RESURRECT IMMORTAL, ONLY IMPERISHABLE.  
 

 

9 minutes ago, DeighAnn said:

And in Leviticus 23, when God regulated the HARVESTS the "Wave Offering" was to be a SHEAF OF WHEAT "waved on the MORROW after the Sabbath" (v.11). God reserves the right, as Lord of the Harvest, to the Firstfruits and Tithes of each harvest. And the "morrow after the sabbath" is the day that Jesus was resurrected and became "FIRSTFRUITS of them that slept" (1st Cor,15:20). But according to John 12:24 our Lord Jesus is ONLY ONE GRAIN - and God commanded a SHEAF! So, on resurrection day our Lord Jesus was raised as THE FIRSTFRUIT and "after" He was raised, but on the same day, a contingent of Old Testament saints were raised from the dead TO COMPLETE THE SHEAF!

I don't UNDERSTAND WHERE 'HARVEST' BECOMES THE GAME PLAN FOR LIFE AND DEATH AND THE ORDER of things.  The only harvest I am aware STATED to be about the end is

Matthew 13:30 Let both grow together until the harvest: and in the time of harvest I will say to the reapers, Gather ye together first the tares, and bind them in bundles to burn them: but gather the wheat into my barn.

Which I see as 

Revelation 19:17 And I saw an angel standing in the sun; and he cried with a loud voice, saying to all the fowls that fly in the midst of heaven, Come and gather yourselves together unto the supper of the great God;

Revelation 19:18 That ye may eat the flesh of kings, and the flesh of captains, and the flesh of mighty men, and the flesh of horses, and of them that sit on them, and the flesh of all men, both free and bond, both small and great.

Revelation 19:19 And I saw the beast, and the kings of the earth, and their armies, gathered together to make war against him that sat on the horse, and against his army.

Revelation 19:20 And the beast was taken, and with him the false prophet that wrought miracles before him, with which he deceived them that had received the mark of the beast, and them that worshipped his image. These both were cast alive into a lake of fire burning with brimstone.

Revelation 19:21 And the remnant were slain with the sword of him that sat upon the horse, which sword proceeded out of his mouth: and all the fowls were filled with their flesh.

 

10 minutes ago, DeighAnn said:

So, the grand picture is Christ's resurrection. But WITHIN this picture is some detail - the fulfillment of the Wave Offering. the saints resurrected just after Jesus are for God's SATISFACTION, not to fulfill some theological treatise on resurrection.

Isaiah 26:18 We have been with child, we have been in pain, we have as it were brought forth wind; we have not wrought any deliverance in the earth; neither have the inhabitants of the world fallen.

Isaiah 26:19 Thy dead men shall live, together with my dead body shall they arise. Awake and sing, ye that dwell in dust: for thy dew is as the dew of herbs, and the earth shall cast out the dead.

Isaiah 26:20 Come, my people, enter thou into thy chambers, and shut thy doors about thee: hide thyself as it were for a little moment, until the indignation be overpast.

Isaiah 26:21 For, behold, the LORD cometh out of his place to punish the inhabitants of the earth for their iniquity: the earth also shall disclose her blood, and shall no more cover her slain.

10 minutes ago, DeighAnn said:

So when we come to the resurrection of the Church, there is again the principle of the harvest and, as in every harvest, multiple gatherings. When we come to Israel's resurrection, there is some detail as well. There is the GRAND PICTURE and there is the detail. Don't let them work against each other. RECONCILE THEM!

It's gonna take a miracle, BUT I AM WILLING TO PRAY THAT GODS TRUTH BE BROUGHT TO LIGHT,  

[DeighAnn]

11 minutes ago, Dennis1209 said:

There will be thousands of Messianic Jews and Gentile believers that did not die in the Tribulation and are allowed to enter the millennium.

There isn't a 3rd choice, is there?  With  the whole world  being deceived?    If the TIME wasn't shortened even GODS ELECT would be deceived.  How do you find any wiggle room within those confines?  

When Christ returns,  you have either taken the mark or endured to the end. What Scripture tells you there are those who can escape all this?


BUT LIKE YOU I am more than willing as I AM WANTING to find Scripture that GIVES US TRUTH in this matter.  

[AdHoc]

4 minutes ago, Dennis1209 said:

Top of the afternoon to you, Selah,

Not to argue or try and persuade you, but this is a topic I have studied in detail. It would be hard for me to have my opinion swayed or altered on this subject. But as always, I’m all ears. 😊

In my studies, I have concluded several things. There will be zero non-believers that enter the millennium; successive generations will continue to sin, disobey, and start to rebel against Christ ruling.

Christ will reign and rule in the millennium with a rod of iron, and it appears King David will be His second in command. We Christians, the church, and the Old Testament saints in our glorified bodies will be priests and kings and rule and reign with Jesus. Over what and who?

There will be thousands of Messianic Jews and Gentile believers that did not die in the Tribulation and are allowed to enter the millennium. They do not have glorified bodies, but their longevity will be extended by hundreds of years. If someone dies at 100 years old, they will be considered babies. They do not have eternal life, but like it was in longevity in the first ten generations of Adam. I believe the terrible and non-believers will all be killed off at the second coming of Christ. A fresh start for the reign of Christ.

Mark 12:25 For when they shall rise from the dead, they neither marry, nor are given in marriage; but are as the angels which are in heaven.

I see the above on non-rebellious spiritual angels and us in our glorified bodies. There is no reason or purpose to procreate. On the other hand, those flesh & blood believers allowed to enter the millennium will propagate and repopulate the earth IMO.

Satan will be bound for these 1,000 years, so he cannot deceive and influence the nations. What is the purpose of Satan and his minions being chained and bound during this period? I suspect so no one can claim Satan made them do anything. Their human flesh and nature are still unrighteous, and sinful, and they are still in need of a Savior.

Just my thoughts.

Nice.

The Church members, if dead, are resurrected in their glorious bodies (Phil.3:20-21). Church members who are alive are "changed" (1st Cor.15:50-54). The whole Church is in their resurrection bodies during the millennium and it is thhey who are called "children of the resurrection" (Lk.20:35-36)

Even if every Israelite is killed during the Great Tribulation, there will still be 144,000 in their bodies (Rev.9:4). They will live long and procreate. What is NEW is their spirit and their heart (Ezek.11:19, 36:26). The resurrected of Daniel 12:2 MIGHT be able to procreate. They are raised, not like the Christian with a body of "celestial glory", but with a body of "TERRESTRIAL GLORY". Ezekiel 44:25 is Millennial and there are "sons and daughters" of the Levites.

The judgment of Matthew 25:31-46 is that of "ALL Nations". They are judged on how they treated "the least of the Lord's brethren" during the Great Tribulation. These are the LIVING of the Nations. The dead must wait for the White Throne. Zechariah 14:16 says that these SURVIVORS of going up against Jerusalem must go to Jerusalem annually to worship Jesus. they will be in the old bodies, marry, procreate and spawn the generation that follows Magog centuries later. It is over these that the Lord reigns with a rod of iron.

It does us good to remember that only us Christians will be "Like" Christ in resurrection. What the implications of this are, I'm not sure.

[Hobie_]

11 hours ago, Selah7 said:

The events that happened on the day that Jesus was crucified is not the first resurrection of the Saints when Jesus returns.  I believe it was a miracle to show unbelievers at the time that Jesus was the Son of God.

Let’s look at what’s written:

But now Christ is risen from the dead, and has become the firstfruits of those who have fallen asleep. For since by man came death, by Man also came the resurrection of the dead. For as in Adam all die, even so in Christ all shall be made alive. But each one in his own order: Christ the firstfruits, afterward those who are Christ's at His coming.  - 1 Corinthians 15:20-23 

(No one will be resurrected UNTIL JESUS RETURNS.  We just read it at the end of 1 Corinthians 15:23.)  Read it again!

…. and look here at this next verse in Revelation:

Blessed and holy is he who has part in the first resurrection. Over such the second death has no power, but they shall be priests of God and of Christ, and shall reign with Him a thousand years.

- Revelation 20:6 

Amen...