Who is Resurrected, and When?

[FreeGrace]

4 minutes ago, truth7t7 said:

When Jesus Christ returns its "Fire Time" (The End)

I've already explained the various "ends".  But you theorize.

4 minutes ago, truth7t7 said:

"Destroyed Them All"

Luke 17:29-30KJV

²⁹ But the same day that Lot went out of Sodom it rained fire and brimstone from heaven, and destroyed them all.

30 Even thus shall it be in the day when the Son of man is revealed.

2 Peter 3:10KJV

10 But the day of the Lord will come as a thief in the night; in the which the heavens shall pass away with a great noise, and the elements shall melt with fervent heat, the earth also and the works that are therein shall be burned up.

OK, here's some more explanation in Luke 17.  When King Jesus returns to earth to set up His MK, He FIRST must end the tribulation.  There's one "the end" for you.

When Jesus comes back, He will end the tribulation by finishing the battle of Armageddon.  You'd better believe there will be fire and brimstone.  

Problem solved.  Again.

[truth7t7]

8 minutes ago, FreeGrace said:

I've already explained the various "ends".  But you theorize.

OK, here's some more explanation in Luke 17.  When King Jesus returns to earth to set up His MK, He FIRST must end the tribulation.  There's one "the end" for you.

When Jesus comes back, He will end the tribulation by finishing the battle of Armageddon.  You'd better believe there will be fire and brimstone.  

Problem solved.  Again.

Yes you appear to ignore the very clear words of God's truth below "Why"?

It's fire time when Jesus is "Revealed" you deny this "Why"?

Destroyed them "All" when the son of man "Jesus" is "Revealed" 

Not 1,000 years after he's revealed as you falsely believe and teach

Will you side step this biblical fact again and again?

When Jesus Christ returns its "Fire Time" (The End)

"Destroyed Them All"

Luke 17:29-30KJV

29 But the same day that Lot went out of Sodom it rained fire and brimstone from heaven, and destroyed them all.

30 Even thus shall it be in the day when the Son of man is revealed.

Edited February 8, 2023 by truth7t7

[truth7t7]

2 hours ago, FreeGrace said:

 But you reject what was written, and I don't recall that you have explained what all John meant in that chapter.

Could you summarize what the chapter is about?

Revelation 20:1-6 Isnt A Millennial Kingdom On This Earth, Dont Be Deceived

Can you find the things claimed by those teaching a Literal 1,000 year Millennial Kingdom On This Earth in Revelation 20:1-6 below?

1.) Physical Earthly Kingdom?

2.) Physical Earthly Throne?

3.) Physical Mortal Humans?

The Above Claims (Don't Exist)

Revelation 20:1-6 Is 100% In The Lords (Spiritual) Angel, Heaven, Devil, Satan, The Souls, The Dead, God, Christ

100% Spiritual Realm, No "Literal" Time

2 Peter 3:8KJV

8 But, beloved, be not ignorant of this one thing, that one day is with the Lord as a thousand years, and a thousand years as one day.

Revelation 20:1-6KJV

1 And I saw an angel come down from heaven, having the key of the bottomless pit and a great chain in his hand.

2 And he laid hold on the dragon, that old serpent, which is the Devil, and Satan, and bound him a thousand years,

3 And cast him into the bottomless pit, and shut him up, and set a seal upon him, that he should deceive the nations no more, till the thousand years should be fulfilled: and after that he must be loosed a little season.

4 And I saw thrones, and they sat upon them, and judgment was given unto them: and I saw the souls of them that were beheaded for the witness of Jesus, and for the word of God, and which had not worshipped the beast, neither his image, neither had received his mark upon their foreheads, or in their hands; and they lived and reigned with Christ a thousand years.

5 But the rest of the dead lived not again until the thousand years were finished. This is the first resurrection.

6 Blessed and holy is he that hath part in the first resurrection: on such the second death hath no power, but they shall be priests of God and of Christ, and shall reign with him a thousand years.

[FreeGrace]

35 minutes ago, truth7t7 said:

Yes you appear to ignore the very clear words of God's truth below "Why"?

It's fire time when Jesus is "Revealed" you deny this "Why"?

I have already explained all this.

35 minutes ago, truth7t7 said:

Destroyed them "All" when the son of man "Jesus" is "Revealed"

[Oh, thanks for the reminder.  I forgot what "destroyed them all" refers to.  When Jesus returns, the entire army closing in on Jerusalem will be destroyed by Him.  Haven't you read about the battle of Armageddon?

You think you are taking me to "task" by certain phrases.  And here you are, REJECTING the entire chapter of Rev 20.  Give me a break.]

Not 1,000 years after he's revealed as you falsely believe and teach

Will you side step this biblical fact again and again?

Rather, I have been given you the PROPER explanation of all of what you say.

35 minutes ago, truth7t7 said:

When Jesus Christ returns its "Fire Time" (The End)

That directly ignores lots of Scripture.

35 minutes ago, truth7t7 said:

"Destroyed Them All"

Luke 17:29-30KJV

29 But the same day that Lot went out of Sodom it rained fire and brimstone from heaven, and destroyed them all.

30 Even thus shall it be in the day when the Son of man is revealed.

This is how Jesus will END the battle of Armageddon.

I haven't sidestepped anything or ignored anything.  That is your guilt.

[FreeGrace]

24 minutes ago, truth7t7 said:

Revelation 20:1-6 Isnt A Millennial Kingdom On This Earth, Dont Be Deceived

Can you find the things claimed by those teaching a Literal 1,000 year Millennial Kingdom On This Earth in Revelation 20:1-6 below?

1.) Physical Earthly Kingdom?

2.) Physical Earthly Throne?

3.) Physical Mortal Humans?

The Above Claims (Don't Exist)

This is what I posted:

" But you reject what was written, and I don't recall that you have explained what all John meant in that chapter.

Could you summarize what the chapter is about?"

But, no you don't do that.  You bring out your smokescreen.

24 minutes ago, truth7t7 said:

Revelation 20:1-6 Is 100% In The Lords (Spiritual) Angel, Heaven, Devil, Satan, The Souls, The Dead, God, Christ

This doesn't explain anything, and you can't prove any of that.  It's just a claim.

All you've done is spiritualize a literal passage.  Read what you wrote, slowly, and see if any of it explains anything.  Apparently you are unfamiliar with how to explain what was written.  All you did was throw words around. 

24 minutes ago, truth7t7 said:

100% Spiritual Realm, No "Literal" Time

2 Peter 3:8KJV

8 But, beloved, be not ignorant of this one thing, that one day is with the Lord as a thousand years, and a thousand years as one day.

Now, prove how v.8 relates to Rev 20.  All you have is a claim.

24 minutes ago, truth7t7 said:

Revelation 20:1-6KJV

1 And I saw an angel come down from heaven, having the key of the bottomless pit and a great chain in his hand.

2 And he laid hold on the dragon, that old serpent, which is the Devil, and Satan, and bound him a thousand years,

3 And cast him into the bottomless pit, and shut him up, and set a seal upon him, that he should deceive the nations no more, till the thousand years should be fulfilled: and after that he must be loosed a little season.

4 And I saw thrones, and they sat upon them, and judgment was given unto them: and I saw the souls of them that were beheaded for the witness of Jesus, and for the word of God, and which had not worshipped the beast, neither his image, neither had received his mark upon their foreheads, or in their hands; and they lived and reigned with Christ a thousand years.

5 But the rest of the dead lived not again until the thousand years were finished. This is the first resurrection.

6 Blessed and holy is he that hath part in the first resurrection: on such the second death hath no power, but they shall be priests of God and of Christ, and shall reign with him a thousand years.

This couldn't be MORE CLEAR as to what will occur when Jesus returns to earth.

v.1-3 explains (unlike yourself) what happens to Satan at the start of the MK.

v.4-6 explains the setting up of King Jesus' MK by the words "thrones" and "judgment" and mentions one of the groups of the saved that will be resurrected "when He comes" as 1 Cor 15:23 plainly says.  "But each in turn: Christ, the firstfruits; then, when he comes, those who belong to him."

These verses also explain that the resurrection of the saved is the FIRST resurrection, and there will be a second one 1,000 years later.  

How you ignore so blatantly v.6 is beyond me.

there.  That's how to explain Scripture.  Note the verses and EXPLAIN what they are referring to.

[Retrobyter]

20 hours ago, Keras said:

The idea that any human will receive immortality before the final Judgment, is error and contradicts scriptures like Hebrews 9:27...We die and then comes the Judgment. 

Which we are plainly told, will be after the Millennium. Revelation 20:11-15

However, I know Church teaching is that all the righteous and faithful peoples will be resurrected when Jesus Returns. I do not see that in the Bible, but there is no harm done to believe it, so rather than arguing over it, just wait and see, shall we? 

Shalom, Keras.

The Judgment is NOT just at the Great White Throne! It will be THROUGHOUT the Millennium! Don't you understand yet that the job of a King is to be a JUDGE?!

[Retrobyter]

2 hours ago, truth7t7 said:

MK = Missing Kingdom

No, Millennial Kingdom (even though it will just be the FIRST 1,000 years of the Kingdom)!

2 hours ago, truth7t7 said:

When Jesus Christ returns its "Fire Time" (The End)

"Destroyed Them All"

Luke 17:29-30KJV

²⁹ But the same day that Lot went out of Sodom it rained fire and brimstone from heaven, and destroyed them all.

30 Even thus shall it be in the day when the Son of man is revealed.

2 Peter 3:10KJV

10 But the day of the Lord will come as a thief in the night; in the which the heavens shall pass away with a great noise, and the elements shall melt with fervent heat, the earth also and the works that are therein shall be burned up.

You've skipped the whole reason for why there is any prophecy at all! 

[Diaste]

18 hours ago, Uriah said:

You seem to be saying that the resurrection at the second coming of Jesus is for the martyrs and tribbers alone. But Paul didn't know it.

I'm saying Paul may not have fully understood since we know all the Apostles died before the Revelation was given to John. Perhaps the Apostles did have insight into the full work of the Revelation but I don't know that, and it's impossible to find out at this point. 

Paul was teaching about a gathering that happens at the return of Jesus; which to my knowledge was not what the people were anticipating throughout the Gospels. They looked to the last day resurrection prior to the Olivet Discourse and the several letters of Paul. 

Because Paul knew of this gathering at the 2nd advent, does not mean he had all the knowledge associated with the gathering. 

18 hours ago, Uriah said:

When indeed. As far as I can tell your position is it will be after the thousand year of Christ reining. I also noticed Jesus didn't bother to correct the sister of Lazarus when she said she knew He would raise him. This means she expected many more than Lazarus on that day.

Of course she did, but when is the 'last day'? 

18 hours ago, Uriah said:

Have you pointed out a source in scripture that declares the last day is after the thousand years? (last day of.....?)

I don't see the 'last day' as metaphor, analogy or allegory. It's a day when there is an evening and a morning. 

There really isn't a direct statement to confirm when, unequivocally, that I am aware of. In my mind the time span is 1000 years for the millennial kingdom. I don't know how to count years without the basic unit of the year, the day.

It's said in Zech 14 the nations that survived the attack on Jerusalem are required to come to Jerusalem and worship at the Feast of Tabernacles once a year during the reign of Jesus on earth. How would one know what year, or what time of year, or the month and week of the feast, if there were not days? 

Maybe there is a way and I just don't know about it. For now I'm going to go with the fact there is a literal 1000 year reign and each of the those years are demarcated by months and weeks and days. 

So then the 'last day' isn't when Jesus arrives as there are 360,000 days to go in the Millennial Kingdom. 

Then the last day is last day of the 1000 years; when it's said in Revelation 20, "The rest of the dead did not come back to life until the thousand years were complete." 

 

 

[Diaste]

 

There isn't a direct statement here about when the last day might be. 

 

18 hours ago, Uriah said:

But Paul didn't know it.

Even though he said:

2Th 1:7- ...when the Lord Jesus shall be revealed from heaven with his mighty angels,

2Th 1:8- In flaming fire taking vengeance on them that know not God, and that obey not the gospel of our Lord Jesus Christ:

 

This is when Jesus returns.

18 hours ago, Uriah said:

2Th 1:9- Who shall be punished with everlasting destruction from the presence of the Lord, and from the glory of his power;

This doesn't tell us it's immediately upon His revealing from heaven. Rev 20:11-15 suggests the finality of the above comes after the 1000 years.

18 hours ago, Uriah said:

2Th 1:10- When he shall come to be glorified in his saints, and to be admired in all them that believe (because our testimony among you was believed) in that day.

I assume he would have been familiar with this too:

Mat 13:4o- As therefore the tares are gathered and burned in the fire; so shall it be in the end of this world.

Jesus reigns for 1000 years on earth. His arrival does not equate with the end of the world and in fact cannot. This more parallels with the GWT after the 1000 years.

18 hours ago, Uriah said:

Mat 13:41- The Son of man shall send forth his angels, and they shall gather out of his kingdom all things that offend, and them which do iniquity;

Mat 13:42- And shall cast them into a furnace of fire: there shall be wailing and gnashing of teeth

This is the second place I pointed out the lake of fire is at the beginning of the 1,000 yrs.

Where does it say this happens at the onset of the 1000 years? 

Rev 20:7-10 speaks to Satan deceiving the nations after the 1000 years. Iniquity and offensive things where clearly in the 1000 reign since the nations were once again deceived. 

 

[Diaste]

23 hours ago, Selah7 said:

Couldn’t the last day be the day when, in the twinkling of an eye, we are changed from our flesh bodies into our spiritual bodies?

Why? So this transformation is so profound it's the end of days? What about all the people living in the kingdom for 1000 years? 

How does one count years without days?

How do those in the Kingdom know when to arrive for the Feast of Tabernacles year on year if there are no months and weeks and days?

23 hours ago, Selah7 said:

 

The “dead in Christ” are those who have died believing in Christ who come with Him at His return; yes?

I don't understand.