Did God restore Israel in 1948?

[dad2]

8 hours ago, George said:

You asked what Kingdom is being restored with a ? .... I answered you with only Scripture to what I was referring ....

Therefore, when they had come together, they asked Him, saying, “Lord, will You at this time restore the kingdom to Israel?” And He said to them, “It is not for you to know times or seasons which the Father has put in His own authority. But you shall receive power when the Holy Spirit has come upon you; and you shall be witnesses to Me in Jerusalem, and in all Judea and Samaria, and to the end of the earth.”
Acts 1:6‭-‬8 NKJV
https://bible.com/bible/114/act.1.6-8.NKJV

That time when it is restored of course referring to His return.

[Keras]

                     

In the 36th chapter of Ezekiel, the prophet tells the story of how all the Lord’s people, faithful Christians, of Judah, Israel and people from every tribe, race, nation and language, all grafted in as true Israelites of God: are gathered, redeemed and settled into all of the holy Land. However, before then, the story unfolds;

Isaiah 41:1 - Keep silent before Me you coasts and islands....  Five steps are mentioned here by the prophet; keep silent – When ancient Israel migrated from their captivity in Assyria, they remained hidden until they regained their strength. Then, let them come near – awaken to the true gospel, evangelism from John Wycliffe to Billy Graham, etc.

Let them speak – proclaim the good news around the world.

Still to come is ‘Let us meet in the place of judgement’ Isaiah 41:8-9, Ezekiel 20:34-38, God will soon call His people back to the Land, where the administration of His commandments and Laws will be restored. Ezekiel 36:27

 

Jeremiah 3:8 Israel and Judah are divorced from God and sent into captivity for their sins.    Then God took Ezekiel in a vision to a valley full of dry bones;

Ezekiel 37:11  These bones are the whole house of Israel [All the 12 tribes] They say: our hope is gone, we are cut off. [from God]

Ezekiel 37:9-10  The Lord God says: let the winds [Gods spirit] come and breath into the slain [dead to the Gospel] that they might live. They came to life and stood up- a mighty company! [of Christians]

Ezekiel 37:12-13  I will bring you up from your graves [our present spiritually lost condition] and restore you to the Land of Israel.

 

Through Isaiah, God gives a message to the House of Israel, identifying them as a people who have lost the knowledge of their origin and forgotten their ancestors.

Isaiah 51:1-2 Listen to Me, all you who know the Law [the common Judeo-Christian Law of our countries] You who seek the Lord [Christian peoples] consider your origin, where you came from- Abraham and Sarah are your parents.  I blessed them and now you are their offspring. Galatians 6:14-16 

God is looking forward to the day when the redemptive work of the Lord Jesus is completed. His sacrifice of atonement and salvation is made available to all who accept it and acknowledge their Creator. Everyone who has the faith of Abraham, is deemed to be his offspring. Galatians 3:26-29 One of the Israel of God. Galatians 6:16 

The great awakening of all the Israelites is symbolically represented as life from the dead, for through the Resurrection of Jesus, God demonstrates His power and can then  do this; Ezekiel 37:14  I shall put My Spirit into you and you will live. [a true Godly life] Thus you will know that I, the Lord has acted and spoken. 

After that: Ezekiel 37:26-28  I shall make an everlasting covenant with Israel.   My sanctuary will be in their midst, I will be their God and they will be My people.

The New Covenant will then be made between God and His faithful Christian peoples. Hebrews 8:10-12 The Overcomers for God; what Israel means. The Glory of God will be present in the new Temple, as in ancient times. Ezekiel 43:1-4

The Return of Jesus for His Millennial reign comes a few years later.

                                                              

[dad2]

2 hours ago, Walter Goraj jr said:

 So you believe that before the world began, God saw all the people that would choose him, and in honouring their work of righteousness, and setting his will aside , Chose them. 

Yes I'm being a little facetious.  Could you share any verses that support this? 

 

No. We don't really know all the details. But the promise of eternal life was given, for sure.

Titus 1:2

 

In hope of eternal life, which God, that cannot lie, promised before the world began;

 

Also the context of Paul talking about predestinated seems to be about us a a body or group. Example from Rom 8..

 

¹ There is therefore now no condemnation to them which are in Christ Jesus, who walk not after the flesh

 

--fulfilled in us, who walk not after the flesh, but after the Spirit.

--they that are after the Spirit

--ye are not in the flesh

--he that raised up Christ from the dead shall also quicken your mortal bodies by his Spirit that dwelleth in you

--we are the children of God

--joint-heirs with Christ; if so be that we suffer with him, that we may be also glorified together

--the glory which shall be revealed in us

--And not only they, but ourselves also

--we are saved by hope

--we hope for that we see not

--helpeth our infirmities: for we know not what we should pray for as we ought: but the Spirit itself maketh intercession for us

--them who are the called

 

Then in the next verse  ...

 

 

whom he did foreknow

 

So whom was it He foreknew? Us,our,we,ourselves,them who are called etc etc.

 

So I see this as referring to those he was just talking about.

 

He knew we would choose Him. I do not see that to mean that he preprogrammed us individually so that there was no choice. I see it as God making a Way for us to come to Him, and knowing many would. Jesus is that Way. The choice is ours. When we choose Jesus that means also that He chose us.

 

Looking at the rest of the bible the context is clear. Those who will, can be saved. Those who will not are not chosen.

 

 

 

 

 

 

[dad2]

Just now, Keras said:

After that: Ezekiel 37:26-28  I shall make an everlasting covenant with Israel.   My sanctuary will be in their midst, I will be their God and they will be My people.

The New Covenant will then be made between God and His faithful Christian peoples. Hebrews 8:10-12 The Overcomers for God; what Israel means. The Glory of God will be present in the new Temple, as in ancient times. Ezekiel 43:1-4

The Return of Jesus for His Millennial reign comes a few years later.

                                                              

I do not agree that Israel is not Israel, the Jewish people. God honors His promise to us and we are raptured. He honors promises for the people, including Jews that live after that in the last seven years of wrath. He also honors all the promises to Israel, the Jews, when they are saved at the end of the tribulation. It is not mutually exclusive where He honors only one set of promises. Israel being saved takes nothing away from us. Our being saved takes nothing from them. The Jews for whom something was taken away were the unbelieving Jews. The kingdom was taken from them. Not from Jewish believers. That will be restored one day! Doing mental gymnastics and hammering the bible to try to make Israel be something else is not a proper understanding.

 

 

[George]

58 minutes ago, dad2 said:

That time when it is restored of course referring to His return.

Do you believe the Old Testament passages are connected to the Jewish people -- or have they been spiritually replaced and many of the passages speaking of Israel is actually the church?  This is probably where we differ and why we see the passages in a different light.

 

[dad2]

30 minutes ago, George said:

Do you believe the Old Testament passages are connected to the Jewish people -- or have they been spiritually replaced and many of the passages speaking of Israel is actually the church?  This is probably where we differ and why we see the passages in a different light.

 

I believe all the promises to Israel will be fulfilled. I believe that is when Jesus returns and when those Jews left alive there all get saved.  He then restores them from all over to that land and destroys all their enemies etc. I see no need for picking just one group, (church or Israel)  God honors His promises to all. The issue in this thread is how some claim that that happened in 1948.

Edited December 30, 2022 by dad2

[Keras]

2 hours ago, dad2 said:

I do not agree that Israel is not Israel, the Jewish people.

You are wrong for two reasons; The Jews are only 2/12ths of all Israel , and it is far from sufficient for accept the claims of anyone, without proper proof. 

For example, the groups from India and Africa, who claim to be Jewish, with their only support being some Jewish rites, are obviously just doing whatever they can to get out of their 'basket case' countries. 

There is also, the mathematical proof that everyone alive on earth today, have some of Abrahams genes. As Paul plainly tells us in Romans 2:29, the only true Jew, is one who has the belief in God, accepts Jesus and is truly faithful.

[George]

1 hour ago, dad2 said:

I believe all the promises to Israel will be fulfilled. I believe that is when Jesus returns and when those Jews left alive there all get saved

I believe your reading the text incorrectly.  It's not AFTER Jesus returns they come ... it WHEN they return He comes.  

for I say to you, you shall see Me no more till you say, ‘Blessed is He who comes in the name of the Lord!’ ”

Matthew 23:39 NKJV
https://bible.com/bible/114/mat.23.39.NKJV

This is a snippet from a book ...

This judgment for Israel’s unbelief will someday be reversed: “For I say to you, from now on you will not see Me until you say, ‘Blessed is he who comes in the name of the Lord!’” This statement has been understood in three main ways. The first is that “Blessed is He . . .” is a cry of a reluctant and unsaved Israel at the time of its judgment. Allegedly, Israel will be forced to acknowledge Jesus is the Messiah. John Calvin stated, “He [Jesus] will not come to them [the Jews] until they cry out in fear—too late—at the sight of His Majesty.”[464] But this view is unnecessarily pessimistic. As Graham Stanton points out, “the difficulty with this interpretation is that Psalm 118.26 which is cited in Matthew 23.39 is surely an expression of joyful praise rather than of fear or mourning.”[465] Jesus quotes Psalm 118:26a, which is positive concerning Israel’s relationship to God. The last part of Psalm 118:26 states, “We have blessed you from the house of the Lord.” This is a happy and willing declaration from people who know the Lord, not the words of a reluctant group on their way to judgment. Craig Evans claims, “The rabbis understood Psalm 118:26 in reference to the day of redemption.”[466] This negative judgment view also conflicts with various Scripture passages like Zechariah 12:10 and Romans 11:26–27 which speak of a coming positive response of the nation Israel to her Messiah.

From He will reign forever.

God bless,

George 

[Alive]

10 minutes ago, George said:

I believe your reading the text incorrectly.  It's not AFTER Jesus returns they come ... it WHEN they return He comes.  

for I say to you, you shall see Me no more till you say, ‘Blessed is He who comes in the name of the Lord!’ ”

Matthew 23:39 NKJV
https://bible.com/bible/114/mat.23.39.NKJV

This is a snippet from a book ...

This judgment for Israel’s unbelief will someday be reversed: “For I say to you, from now on you will not see Me until you say, ‘Blessed is he who comes in the name of the Lord!’” This statement has been understood in three main ways. The first is that “Blessed is He . . .” is a cry of a reluctant and unsaved Israel at the time of its judgment. Allegedly, Israel will be forced to acknowledge Jesus is the Messiah. John Calvin stated, “He [Jesus] will not come to them [the Jews] until they cry out in fear—too late—at the sight of His Majesty.”[464] But this view is unnecessarily pessimistic. As Graham Stanton points out, “the difficulty with this interpretation is that Psalm 118.26 which is cited in Matthew 23.39 is surely an expression of joyful praise rather than of fear or mourning.”[465] Jesus quotes Psalm 118:26a, which is positive concerning Israel’s relationship to God. The last part of Psalm 118:26 states, “We have blessed you from the house of the Lord.” This is a happy and willing declaration from people who know the Lord, not the words of a reluctant group on their way to judgment. Craig Evans claims, “The rabbis understood Psalm 118:26 in reference to the day of redemption.”[466] This negative judgment view also conflicts with various Scripture passages like Zechariah 12:10 and Romans 11:26–27 which speak of a coming positive response of the nation Israel to her Messiah.

From He will reign forever.

God bless,

George 

I see it this way as well. To me it is simple. When the time of the gentiles is fullfilled, He will lift the veil and they will see. How it happens is up for grabs. Scripture is crystal clear on many things, but we do not get all details….yet.

[dad2]

41 minutes ago, Keras said:

You are wrong for two reasons; The Jews are only 2/12ths of all Israel , and it is far from sufficient for accept the claims of anyone, without proper proof. 

"According to Israel's Central Bureau of Statistics, in 2008, of Israel's 7.3 million people, 75.6 percent were Jews of any background"

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Demographics_of_Israel#Jews

 

Nice try.

 

41 minutes ago, Keras said:

For example, the groups from India and Africa, who claim to be Jewish, with their only support being some Jewish rites, are obviously just doing whatever they can to get out of their 'basket case' countries. 

There is also, the mathematical proof that everyone alive on earth today, have some of Abrahams genes. As Paul plainly tells us in Romans 2:29, the only true Jew, is one who has the belief in God, accepts Jesus and is truly faithful.

God never said all ethnic Jews with direct lineage Jacob would be saved. He said all Israel would be saved. Thinking about it, I assume that means more than Jews living in the modern secular state of Israel. No?