The End of this Age

[truth7t7]

21 minutes ago, FreeGrace said:

I understand your point about silence.  However, there is circumstantial evidence that helps to see direction of things.

I will repeat my point about salvation during the MK.

1.  There is just one resurrection for the saved, and 1 Cor 15:23 places that resurrection at the Second Advent, which is confirmed in Rev 20:4.  

2.  If there are saved people during the MK, they would be mortals, in need of immortality to be able to live with God forever.  They must have His life to live with Him.  

3.  A saved mortal would need a body, like all believers receive at resurrection, just like that of Jesus' body.  There is no mention of any such event.

4.  So, if there were to be saved people during the MK, 1 Cor 15:23 cannot be correct.

This is process of elimination.  Or circumstantial evidence.  Not sure which.

But the evidence leads away from conversion during the MK.

Once Again:

When Jesus Christ Returns The Resurrection Takes Place, At This Time "Mortal" Becomes "Immortal", At This Time "The Last Enemy Death" In Verse 26 Is Destroyed, The Kingdom Is Delivered Up At This Time

You Don't Want To See The Last Enemy Death Destroyed Below, Because Your Pre-Determined Millennial Kingdom On Earth "Disappears" Before Your Eyes

You Act As If The Last Enemy Death Isn't Destroyed Below "Why"?

The Scripture Is Clear, Simple, Easy To Understand, And Before Your Eyes

1 Corinthians 15:23-26 & 51-54KJV

23 But every man in his own order: Christ the firstfruits; afterward they that are Christ's at his coming.

24 Then cometh the end, when he shall have delivered up the kingdom to God, even the Father; when he shall have put down all rule and all authority and power.

25 For he must reign, till he hath put all enemies under his feet.

26 The last enemy that shall be destroyed is death.

(Verses 52-54 Below Explains How The Last Enemy Death Is Destroyed, At The Second Coming And Resurrection)

52 In a moment, in the twinkling of an eye, at the last trump: for the trumpet shall sound, and the dead shall be raised incorruptible, and we shall be changed.

53 For this corruptible must put on incorruption, and this mortal must put on immortality.

54 So when this corruptible shall have put on incorruption, and this mortal shall have put on immortality, then shall be brought to pass the saying that is written, Death is swallowed up in victory.

[FreeGrace]

3 hours ago, truth7t7 said:

Once Again:

When Jesus Christ Returns The Resurrection Takes Place, At This Time "Mortal" Becomes "Immortal", At This Time "The Last Enemy Death" In Verse 26 Is Destroyed, The Kingdom Is Delivered Up At This Time

You Don't Want To See The Last Enemy Death Destroyed Below, Because Your Pre-Determined Millennial Kingdom On Earth "Disappears" Before Your Eyes

You Act As If The Last Enemy Death Isn't Destroyed Below "Why"?

The Scripture Is Clear, Simple, Easy To Understand, And Before Your Eyes

1 Corinthians 15:23-26 & 51-54KJV

23 But every man in his own order: Christ the firstfruits; afterward they that are Christ's at his coming.

24 Then cometh the end, when he shall have delivered up the kingdom to God, even the Father; when he shall have put down all rule and all authority and power.

25 For he must reign, till he hath put all enemies under his feet.

26 The last enemy that shall be destroyed is death.

(Verses 52-54 Below Explains How The Last Enemy Death Is Destroyed, At The Second Coming And Resurrection)

52 In a moment, in the twinkling of an eye, at the last trump: for the trumpet shall sound, and the dead shall be raised incorruptible, and we shall be changed.

53 For this corruptible must put on incorruption, and this mortal must put on immortality.

54 So when this corruptible shall have put on incorruption, and this mortal shall have put on immortality, then shall be brought to pass the saying that is written, Death is swallowed up in victory.

No offense, but we've been over all this too many times.  I am firmly convinced that Rev 20 is as literal and real as can be, while you dismiss it with your "spiritualized" version that allows you or anyone else to make it mean whatever you want, and to deny the reality of the chapter.

 All you've done is pit Scripture against itself, which seems obscene to me.

All Scripture is in total harmony.  None of  it contradicts any other part of it.

So, for your views to be acceptable to you, you are required to dismiss Rev 20 and make it basically meaningless.

[truth7t7]

20 minutes ago, FreeGrace said:

The "end" for all unbelievers is at the GWT judgment, which is clearly after the MK and the battle of Gog and Magog.  Then the eternal state, Rev 21.

Or, do you view Rev 21 as only spiritual as well?

(The End) for all unbelievers is at the second coming when the Lord Jesus is revealed

Luke 17:29-30KJV

29 But the same day that Lot went out of Sodom it rained fire and brimstone from heaven, and destroyed them all.

30 Even thus shall it be in the day when the Son of man is revealed.

[truth7t7]

8 minutes ago, FreeGrace said:

No offense, but we've been over all this too many times.  I am firmly convinced that Rev 20 is as literal and real as can be, while you dismiss it with your "spiritualized" version that allows you or anyone else to make it mean whatever you want, and to deny the reality of the chapter.

 All you've done is pit Scripture against itself, which seems obscene to me.

All Scripture is in total harmony.  None of  it contradicts any other part of it.

So, for your views to be acceptable to you, you are required to dismiss Rev 20 and make it basically meaningless.

Yes you use your continued claim of Revelation 20 being literal, and give complete disregard to the many scriptures that prove your future MK to be false, Daniel 12:1-2 below is one of many

"Yes" Daniel 12:1-2 is a "Parallel" teaching of the GWTJ seen in Revelation 20:14-15 that you post above

Daniel goes into great detail on the events and timing, 

1.)Daniel states below that there will be a time of great trouble never experienced before in history (The Great Tribulation) and he uses the words "At That Time"

2.) Daniel clearly states that at this time (The Book Of Life) is opened in (Final Judgement), "Everyone That Shall Be Found Written In The Book"

3.) Daniel clearly shows that the resurrection of "All" takes place at this time, "Everlasting Life" "Everlasting Contempt"

Conclusion: Daniel clearly teaches that at the time of the great tribulation that the resurrection of "All" takes place in the final judgement, the book of life will be opened "Once"

Daniel 12:1-2KJV

1 And at that time shall Michael stand up, the great prince which standeth for the children of thy people: and there shall be a time of trouble, such as never was since there was a nation even to that same time: and at that time thy people shall be delivered, every one that shall be found written in the book.

2 And many of them that sleep in the dust of the earth shall awake, some to everlasting life, and some to shame and everlasting contempt.

[truth7t7]

22 minutes ago, FreeGrace said:

No offense, but we've been over all this too many times.  I am firmly convinced that Rev 20 is as literal and real as can be, while you dismiss it with your "spiritualized" version that allows you or anyone else to make it mean whatever you want, and to deny the reality of the chapter.

 All you've done is pit Scripture against itself, which seems obscene to me.

All Scripture is in total harmony.  None of  it contradicts any other part of it.

So, for your views to be acceptable to you, you are required to dismiss Rev 20 and make it basically meaningless.

No Offense, But Jesus Returns In Fire And Final Judgement (The End) No MK Following As You Claim, The "Literal" Fire As Seen Beliw, That You Completely Ignore And Disregard "Why"?

There Will Be No 1,000 Year Millennial Kingdom Upon This Earth, Jesus Christ Returns In Fire And Final Judgement, Dissolving This Existing Earth By Fire, Immediately After The Tribulation

This Existing Heaven And Earth Will Be (Replaced) By The New Heaven, Earth, Jerusalem, A New Creation, At The Return Of Jesus Christ

(Behold, I Make All Things New)

2 Peter 3:10-13KJV
10 But the day of the Lord will come as a thief in the night; in the which the heavens shall pass away with a great noise, and the elements shall melt with fervent heat, the earth also and the works that are therein shall be burned up.
11 Seeing then that all these things shall be dissolved, what manner of persons ought ye to be in all holy conversation and godliness,
12 Looking for and hasting unto the coming of the day of God, wherein the heavens being on fire shall be dissolved, and the elements shall melt with fervent heat?
13 Nevertheless we, according to his promise, look for new heavens and a new earth, wherein dwelleth righteousness.

Revelation 21:1-5KJV
1 And I saw a new heaven and a new earth: for the first heaven and the first earth were passed away; and there was no more sea.
2 And I John saw the holy city, new Jerusalem, coming down from God out of heaven, prepared as a bride adorned for her husband.
3 And I heard a great voice out of heaven saying, Behold, the tabernacle of God is with men, and he will dwell with them, and they shall be his people, and God himself shall be with them, and be their God.
4 And God shall wipe away all tears from their eyes; and there shall be no more death, neither sorrow, nor crying, neither shall there be any more pain: for the former things are passed away.
5 And he that sat upon the throne said, Behold, I make all things new. And he said unto me, Write: for these words are true and faithful.

Matthew 24:29-30KJV
29 Immediately after the tribulation of those days shall the sun be darkened, and the moon shall not give her light, and the stars shall fall from heaven, and the powers of the heavens shall be shaken:
30 And then shall appear the sign of the Son of man in heaven: and then shall all the tribes of the earth mourn, and they shall see the Son of man coming in the clouds of heaven with power and great glory.

1 Corinthians 3:13KJV
13 Every man's work shall be made manifest: for the day shall declare it, because it shall be revealed by fire; and the fire shall try every man's work of what sort it is.

Luke 17:29-30KJV
29 But the same day that Lot went out of Sodom it rained fire and brimstone from heaven, and destroyed them all.
30 Even thus shall it be in the day when the Son of man is revealed.

2 Thessalonians 1:7-9KJV
7 And to you who are troubled rest with us, when the Lord Jesus shall be revealed from heaven with his mighty angels,
8 In flaming fire taking vengeance on them that know not God, and that obey not the gospel of our Lord Jesus Christ:
9 Who shall be punished with everlasting destruction from the presence of the Lord, and from the glory of his power;

Malachi 3:2KJV
2 But who may abide the day of his coming? and who shall stand when he appeareth? for he is like a refiner's fire, and like fullers' soap:

Psalm 46:6KJV
6 The heathen raged, the kingdoms were moved: he uttered his voice, the earth melted.

Psalm 50:3KJV
3 Our God shall come, and shall not keep silence: a fire shall devour before him, and it shall be very tempestuous round about him.

Psalm 97:5KJV
5 The hills melted like wax at the presence of the Lord, at the presence of the Lord of the whole earth.

Isaiah 66:15KJV
15 For, behold, the Lord will come with fire, and with his chariots like a whirlwind, to render his anger with fury, and his rebuke with flames of fire.

Zechariah 14:12KJV
12 And this shall be the plague wherewith the Lord will smite all the people that have fought against Jerusalem; Their flesh shall consume away while they stand upon their feet, and their eyes shall consume away in their holes, and their tongue shall consume away in their mouth.

Nahum 1:5-6KJV
5 The mountains quake at him, and the hills melt, and the earth is burned at his presence, yea, the world, and all that dwell therein.
6 Who can stand before his indignation? and who can abide in the fierceness of his anger? his fury is poured out like fire, and the rocks are thrown down by him.

Revelation 20:9KJV
9 And they went up on the breadth of the earth, and compassed the camp of the saints about, and the beloved city: and fire came down from God out of heaven, and devoured them.

Edited March 9, 2023 by truth7t7

[The Light]

26 minutes ago, FreeGrace said:

I don't try to pin Christ's Second Advent to any of the judgments.  1 Cor 15:23 is about the resurrection and glorification of all believers.  In the OT there were only 2 prophecies regarding the "coming" of the Messiah.

1.  First Advent;  as a baby to grow up and become the Suffering Servant and Savior

2.  Second Advent; as King of kings and Lord of lords, ruling the nations with a rod of iron.

Ok. I agree with this.

26 minutes ago, FreeGrace said:

So, all references to the "coming" of Christ in the NT refers specifically to the end of the Tribulation when the King returns to earth for the MK.

What you are saying here is not correct. The tribulation is over at the 6th seal. You don't consider the 6th seal and the 7th trumpet to be the same, do you? Once I figure out what you believe it will be easier to communicate.

26 minutes ago, FreeGrace said:

I'm not sure what you mean by "all the other comings of Christ".  Please clarify.

There are five more comings of Christ that I am aware of.

1. The barley harvest, 2. The wheat harvest, 3. The first fruits of the fruit harvest, 4. The fruit harvest and 5. The second advent. 

[OneLight]

57 minutes ago, FreeGrace said:

  When I asked for evidence that "strongly suggests" some will get saved during the MK, I meant "use Scripture".  

All are great verses, of course.  Yet, none reference the MK.  Of course any mortal who places their faith in Christ will be saved.  Regardless of when, on the humanity timeline.

Really?  The fact that Jesus came to die for our sins and we have salvation only through Him, and He never changes, doesn't include the MK in your eyes?  I'd rethink that if that is the case.

[truth7t7]

1 hour ago, The Light said:

There are five more comings of Christ that I am aware of.

1. The barley harvest, 2. The wheat harvest, 3. The first fruits of the fruit harvest, 4. The fruit harvest and 5. The second advent. 

"False"

There is one future coming of Jesus Christ, it will be in fire and final judgement (The End)

Edited March 9, 2023 by truth7t7

[Revelation Man]

15 hours ago, kenny2212 said:

All resurrected believers of all earth's time periods rule and reign with Christ in the Millennial Kingdom.

WRONG........Unless God is a liar. Why is it so hard to comprehend what the scriptures say?

Rev. 20:1 And I saw an angel come down from heaven, having the key of the bottomless pit and a great chain in his hand. 2 And he laid hold on the dragon, that old serpent, which is the Devil, and Satan, and bound him a thousand years (Satan is bound 1000 yrs.)

3 And cast him into the bottomless pit, and shut him up, and set a seal upon him, that he should deceive the nations no more, till the thousand years should be fulfilled: and after that he must be loosed a little season.

This below shows the Church WILL NOT reign on earth with Jesus

4 And I saw thrones, and they sat upon them(The Church is given Judgment, after we come back from Heaven with Jesus), and judgment was given unto them(us The Church): and I saw the souls of them that were beheaded for the witness of Jesus, and for the word of God, and which had not worshipped the beast, neither his image, neither had received his mark upon their foreheads, or in their hands; and "they" lived and reigned with Christ a thousand years.

THEY is very SPECIFIC, and I know I have pointed this out to you before, but people just close their eyes at ties and play pretend. So who is the THEY..........which ONLY THEY.........Live and Reign with Christ Jesus on this earth for 1000 year? We scriptures says its ONLY THOSE who DIED via REFUSING the Mark of the Beast. Read it again, and again, and again, it never changes brother. As a guy called to prophecy its my job to notice these things. I am not just horsing around, its my calling of 37 years. 

Jesus will not need everyone on earth who get saved to rule with hm via our Glorious Bodies. That would make no sense, it would be a waste of time, ONLY THOSE killed by the Beast fir REFUSING to take the Mark of the Beast will live and reign on earth with Jesus, its like sticking a finger in Satan's eyes, and some people who were not killed but were not of God, who made it to the 1000 year reign of Jesus (that will happen). They will live under Jesus Rod of Iron Rule.

The Billions of Church who were Raptured will no doubt, IMHO, go back to Heaven, in our Glorious Bodies and finish building the New Jerusalem during Jesus 1000 year reign. That is why when New Jerusalem descends it is called the Bride of Christ, we descend in New Jerusalem. Jesus is not married to  an inanimate Object.

The Holy Bible SPECIFIALLY says ONLY those who are Martyrs because they refused the Mark of the Beast live and reign on earth with Jesus for his 1000 year reign. 

 

NOW OVERCOME THOSE FACTS !!

 

[The Light]

1 hour ago, truth7t7 said:

"False"

There is one future coming of Jesus Christ, it will be in fire and final judgement (The End)

After you figure out that there is a 1000 year millennial kingdom on the earth, feel free to get back to me.

Edited March 9, 2023 by The Light