Rightly Dividing the Word of Truth

[ChristB4us]

10 minutes ago, Arial said:

Time to let the debate on the rest. We have achieved a fully circular debate on it.

 

What I get is that you are straining  a gnat and swallowing a camel. You are trying to use something as a proof text to discount tongues, that is not a proof text for either side of that argument---nor does it matter. What the passage tells us---that the Holy Spirit helps us in our prayers when we don't even know what to pray---is what matters.

You don't need proof texts to refute tongue speaking in the church today, public or private. The other side will simply counter with theirs. The way to refute it is to know WHY they are not active today. In order to do that you must correctly handle the word in finding out why they were active in the church beginnings. I have told you and got no comment or response on it at all. There seems to be only one party here having a discussion. An argument yes. Discussion, no.

Were they straining at the gnat when they excluded the lost books from the Bible, including the Book of Enoch?

Good luck in reproving any one by the scriptures then.  If you cannot see the difference in the KJV, then neither will they. It is no wonder they cannot be reproved by you by use of the KJV when you do not even see that reproof.

It will take a miracle from God for both sides to see the truth in His words as kept in the KJV as aligning with the rest of the scriptures in truth in that KJV.

[Arial]

1 hour ago, ChristB4us said:

Were they straining at the gnat when they excluded the lost books from the Bible, including the Book of Enoch?

Good luck in reproving any one by the scriptures then.  If you cannot see the difference in the KJV, then neither will they. It is no wonder they cannot be reproved by you by use of the KJV when you do not even see that reproof.

It will take a miracle from God for both sides to see the truth in His words as kept in the KJV as aligning with the rest of the scriptures in truth in that KJV.

Have you ever reproved a tongue speaker by using translations of a scripture that doesn't even apply. People believe what they want to believe and nothing will persuade them otherwise. Do you know why tongues aren't active today? Why don't you tell them the meat of the scripture meaning? And there is no such thing as lost books from the Bible. Everything is there that God intended to be there. Or do you not trust God? Can you tell me why the book of Enoch or any of the others were excluded from the Bible canon?

[ChristB4us]

24 minutes ago, Arial said:

Have you ever reproved a tongue speaker by using translations of a scripture that doesn't even apply. People believe what they want to believe and nothing will persuade them otherwise. Do you know why tongues aren't active today? Why don't you tell them the meat of the scripture meaning? And there is no such thing as lost books from the Bible. Everything is there that God intended to be there. Or do you not trust God? Can you tell me why the book of Enoch or any of the others were excluded from the Bible canon?

So far, the Lord has not proven to anti-KJVers of the value of relying on the KJV.  I believe this is prophesy is why because of all the Bible versions out there.

Amos 8:11 Behold, the days come, saith the Lord God, that I will send a famine in the land, not a famine of bread, nor a thirst for water, but of hearing the words of the Lord: 12 And they shall wander from sea to sea, and from the north even to the east, they shall run to and fro to seek the word of the Lord, and shall not find it. 13 In that day shall the fair virgins and young men faint for thirst.

Isiaah 28:5 In that day shall the Lord of hosts be for a crown of glory, and for a diadem of beauty, unto the residue of his people, 6 And for a spirit of judgment to him that sitteth in judgment, and for strength to them that turn the battle to the gate. 7 But they also have erred through wine, and through strong drink are out of the way; the priest and the prophet have erred through strong drink, they are swallowed up of wine, they are out of the way through strong drink; they err in vision, they stumble in judgment. 8 For all tables are full of vomit and filthiness, so that there is no place clean. 9 Whom shall he teach knowledge? and whom shall he make to understand doctrine? them that are weaned from the milk, and drawn from the breasts. 10 For precept must be upon precept, precept upon precept; line upon line, line upon line; here a little, and there a little: 11 For with stammering lips and another tongue will he speak to this people. 12 To whom he said, This is the rest wherewith ye may cause the weary to rest; and this is the refreshing: yet they would not hear. 13 But the word of the Lord was unto them precept upon precept, precept upon precept; line upon line, line upon line; here a little, and there a little; that they might go, and fall backward, and be broken, and snared, and taken.

Proverbs 25:26 A righteous man falling down before the wicked is as a troubled fountain, and a corrupt spring. 27 It is not good to eat much honey: so for men to search their own glory is not glory. 28 He that hath no rule over his own spirit is like a city that is broken down, and without walls.

[Arial]

13 hours ago, ChristB4us said:

So far, the Lord has not proven to anti-KJVers of the value of relying on the KJV.  I believe this is prophesy is why because of all the Bible versions out there.

Do you really think those scriptures you quoted are prophesies  against not preferring the KJV? 

You have a thread titled Rightly Dividing the Word of Truth--an expression you get from the KJV btw, that itself is incorrect. Dividing is the English translation of an entirely different word that is not in the manuscripts. The Greek word used I have given you before and it means to cut straight, as in cut a straight furrow. Since it is the word of truth being spoken of it means to handle rightly. And then in all your assertions and defenses, all you do is actually divide the word focusing of dividing translations, and handle the word carelessly, making it say and apply to whatever you want it to.

As well there is the suggestion that those who don't put their trust in the KJV are anti KJV. And as far as I know you have not given any legitimate answer as to why the KJV is superior to others. We have a lot more ancient manuscripts to work from than were available in 1611.

[JimmyB]

16 hours ago, Arial said:

Have you ever reproved a tongue speaker by using translations of a scripture that doesn't even apply. People believe what they want to believe and nothing will persuade them otherwise. Do you know why tongues aren't active today? Why don't you tell them the meat of the scripture meaning? And there is no such thing as lost books from the Bible. Everything is there that God intended to be there. Or do you not trust God? Can you tell me why the book of Enoch or any of the others were excluded from the Bible canon?

Tongues are active today.

And there are many "books" that are not in the canon that are interesting and contain valuable thoughts.  I suggest "A New, New Testament" for a small example of these "books".

[JimmyB]

16 hours ago, ChristB4us said:

So far, the Lord has not proven to anti-KJVers of the value of relying on the KJV.  I believe this is prophesy is why because of all the Bible versions out there.

Amos 8:11 Behold, the days come, saith the Lord God, that I will send a famine in the land, not a famine of bread, nor a thirst for water, but of hearing the words of the Lord: 12 And they shall wander from sea to sea, and from the north even to the east, they shall run to and fro to seek the word of the Lord, and shall not find it. 13 In that day shall the fair virgins and young men faint for thirst.

Isiaah 28:5 In that day shall the Lord of hosts be for a crown of glory, and for a diadem of beauty, unto the residue of his people, 6 And for a spirit of judgment to him that sitteth in judgment, and for strength to them that turn the battle to the gate. 7 But they also have erred through wine, and through strong drink are out of the way; the priest and the prophet have erred through strong drink, they are swallowed up of wine, they are out of the way through strong drink; they err in vision, they stumble in judgment. 8 For all tables are full of vomit and filthiness, so that there is no place clean. 9 Whom shall he teach knowledge? and whom shall he make to understand doctrine? them that are weaned from the milk, and drawn from the breasts. 10 For precept must be upon precept, precept upon precept; line upon line, line upon line; here a little, and there a little: 11 For with stammering lips and another tongue will he speak to this people. 12 To whom he said, This is the rest wherewith ye may cause the weary to rest; and this is the refreshing: yet they would not hear. 13 But the word of the Lord was unto them precept upon precept, precept upon precept; line upon line, line upon line; here a little, and there a little; that they might go, and fall backward, and be broken, and snared, and taken.

Proverbs 25:26 A righteous man falling down before the wicked is as a troubled fountain, and a corrupt spring. 27 It is not good to eat much honey: so for men to search their own glory is not glory. 28 He that hath no rule over his own spirit is like a city that is broken down, and without walls.

The King James Bible is just one of many translations.  It is not the Word of God.  IMHO it has had its day.  I much prefer well-researched, well-translated, well-written translations is modern English, such as the NET, the NIV, and the NRSVue.

[ayin jade]

1 hour ago, JimmyB said:

The King James Bible is just one of many translations.  It is not the Word of God.  IMHO it has had its day.  I much prefer well-researched, well-translated, well-written translations is modern English, such as the NET, the NIV, and the NRSVue.

Just to clarify...

Are you saying the bible (in any of its translations) is word of man and not the word of God? Or are you just stating that you are not a kjv only person?

Im not a kjv only person but i believe the bible is God breathed scripture, the word of God.

[JimmyB]

2 minutes ago, ayin jade said:

Just to clarify...

Are you saying the bible (in any of its translations) is word of man and not the word of God? Or are you just stating that you are not a kjv only person?

Im not a kjv only person but i believe the bible is God breathed scripture, the word of God.

No, I am not saying that at all.  What I am saying is that the KJV is not the very words of God.  It is a translation, based in my opinion on an inferior set of sources compared to what we have today.

I am definitely not a KJVO person.  My preferred translations are the NRSVue, the 1978 NIV, the NET, and the NLT (in that order).

I also strongly believe that the Bible is "God-breathed scripture", the word of God.

[Alive]

I have been reading 'The King James Only Controversy' by James R. White.

It is very informative and deals with whether or not more modern translations can be trusted.

I suggest it for folks interested. White traces the development of various translations old and new and the differences between them juxtaposed against the 1611 KJV. He shows that we can trust them and why.

[JimmyB]

37 minutes ago, Alive said:

I have been reading 'The King James Only Controversy' by James R. White.

It is very informative and deals with whether or not more modern translations can be trusted.

I suggest it for folks interested. White traces the development of various translations old and new and the differences between them juxtaposed against the 1611 KJV. He shows that we can trust them and why.

I have read it also.  A very good book, well-researched and well-written.

What concerns me more than anything else about KJVO people is that they consider that one translation to be the very words of God.  I think that is because they cannot conceive of a God that communicates clearly in one's own contemporary language, even though when God came in human form He spoke Aramaic (a Jewish dialect of the common people).  Additionally, when the "books" of the New Testament were written, they were written in Koine Greek, the lingua franca of the Mediterranean region.

To our ears, 17th Century Englyshe sounds "exalted" perhaps, so it must be "of divine origin".  There is, of course, no equating that with the way God has actually communicated.