The Difficult Sayings Of Jesus

[farouk]

20 minutes ago, Anne2 said:

Yeah, just one example of an authority structure. It certainly was not everyone reading their own bibles.

From the Reformation onwards, it was a matter of, Back to the Bible so that everyone could indeed read their Bibles...

[Marilyn C]

On 8/27/2023 at 11:44 AM, Starise said:

To a new believer or an unbeliever, some of the statements Jesus made can be reason to scratch our heads wondering what He actually was trying to put across, and it's no secret that a lot of what He said was intentionally cryptic..

I remember the first time I read the passage about Jesus where He stated we should pluck our eye out or cut off our hand if it causes us to sin, for it is better to lose an eye or hand than go to hell. Whaaaaaaat??????

I immediately went to the visual mental picture and the thought of it turned me off.

 

 

Hi Starise,

I think that we misunderstand what the Lord is saying for we don`t take into account WHO He was talking to and what their idioms were. We are so egocentric that we can tend to read God`s word as all ABOUT us when in fact it is for us to read as all ABOUT God and His purposes for - the nations, for Israel and the Body of Christ.

Speaking generally - When we read a newspaper etc do we read it as all about us? Of course not, so why do we read God`s word as all about us? 

Big problem - us and our limited view.

[Starise]

18 hours ago, Marilyn C said:

Hi Starise,

I think that we misunderstand what the Lord is saying for we don`t take into account WHO He was talking to and what their idioms were. We are so egocentric that we can tend to read God`s word as all ABOUT us when in fact it is for us to read as all ABOUT God and His purposes for - the nations, for Israel and the Body of Christ.

Speaking generally - When we read a newspaper etc do we read it as all about us? Of course not, so why do we read God`s word as all about us? 

Big problem - us and our limited view.

Hi @Marilyn C

I agee we can tend to see the bible as entirely about us, and realistically the bible was written for our benefit. Much of it describes what affects us and what God expects of us, the traits of God, the magnificance and holiness of God.

As you say, also much about His purposes indeed. But yes, the bible is certainly a book about God.

Are you thinking of any specific passages that would be examples of texts that may indicate an misapplication of meaning? 

[Marilyn C]

3 hours ago, Starise said:

Hi @Marilyn C

I agee we can tend to see the bible as entirely about us, and realistically the bible was written for our benefit. Much of it describes what affects us and what God expects of us, the traits of God, the magnificance and holiness of God.

As you say, also much about His purposes indeed. But yes, the bible is certainly a book about God.

Are you thinking of any specific passages that would be examples of texts that may indicate an misapplication of meaning? 

Hi Starise,

The Old Testament was written for the Jews first, as it pertains to them and what God was revealing to them, and then as you say `what affects us and what God expects of us....`

`Now these things became our examples, to the intent we should not lust after evil things as they also lusted.` (1 Cor. 10: 6)

People go beyond that and try and allegorize the OT to make some sort of `prophecy` for today. 

[Starise]

17 hours ago, Marilyn C said:

The Old Testament was written for the Jews first, as it pertains to them and what God was revealing to them, and then as you say `what affects us and what God expects of us....`

`Now these things became our examples, to the intent we should not lust after evil things as they also lusted.` (1 Cor. 10: 6)

People go beyond that and try and allegorize the OT to make some sort of `prophecy` for today. 

Yes it wasn't until later into my Christian walk that I learned to better apply much of the bible as some will take all of it as for them or for all of us, which will loose context, and I believe  bible out of context is one of the primary factors in biblical misunderstanding. Modern humans tend to read and absorb information in tiny caches which I think contributes to the lack of movement between books and various passages, in addition to the idea that the bible is many books and not ever a linear journey.

That Jesus came first for the Jews means that some of the things He says are directed primarily to them, but often they are applicational to all of us, for example when Jesus condemns the religious Jews in no uncertain terms that applies to every religious hypocrites of our day and cross references to passages in Peter where both Jews and Gentiles were addressed.

There seems to be a mindset that there are repititions in the bible that correllate to today, and maybe some of this is true, however . Jonathan Cahn comes to mind here as someone who writes many books on these subject. I will admit my reluctance to buy into it unless it can be shown to be a sure thing.

[farouk]

On 9/6/2023 at 11:37 AM, Mike Mclees said:

In John 6 Jesus addressed the crowds that followed Him after the feeding of the five thousand. Staring at verse 53 through 66 saying , " 

⁵³ Then Jesus said unto them, “Verily, verily I say unto you, unless ye eat the flesh of the Son of Man and drink His blood, ye have no life in you.

⁵⁴ Whoso eateth My flesh and drinketh My blood hath eternal life, and I will raise him up at the Last Day.

⁵⁵ For My flesh is meat indeed, and My blood is drink indeed.

⁵⁶ He that eateth My flesh and drinketh My blood dwelleth in Me, and I in him.

⁵⁷ As the living Father hath sent Me, and I live by the Father, so he that eateth Me, even he shall live by Me.

⁵⁸ This is that Bread which came down from Heaven, not as your fathers ate manna and are dead; he that eateth of this Bread shall live for ever.”

⁵⁹ These things said He in the synagogue as He taught in Capernaum.

The general public and many in the church  being fleshly or carnal minded cannot perceive or understand these difficult sayings. They hear but cannot hear and they see with their eyes but cannot see. We must be born again of the spirit. Jesus said  to the disciples verse 63,

"It is the spirit that quickens(makes one alive) the flesh profits nothing: the words that I speak unto you they are spirit and they are life 

 

 

 

Hi @Mike Mclees I think these words from the Lord Jesus in John 6 refer definitely to exercising faith in His blest Person and Work. (Not to 'communion', etc. There are other verses for that, showing that it's a symbolically a memorial).