When was Satan cast out of heaven down to the earth?

[Montana Marv]

20 hours ago, Charlie744 said:

No, he was baptized in the Jordan on the first day of the 70th week. 
 

The Messiah will come after the 7 and the 62 weeks are completed. The final week was specifically set aside for the Messiah to fulfill His God given mission revealed in 9:24.

He indeed fulfilled all 6 of them despite being “cut off” in the midst of the 70th week. 
 

It was the Messiah who confirmed the New Covenant DURING the last 7 years of the prophecy.

It was the Messiah, as a result of being the perfect sacrificial lamb of God caused the end of the need for any further animal sacrifices and offerings. They were no longer needed. 
 

The AOD, or the abomination that causes desolation has nothing to do with 70 AD destruction of the Temple, the Sanctuary, etc. They were already destroyed once and could not reach the definition of an “abomination.”

The abomination is actually the cross! The crucifixion of our God is the most unique and horrifying event in the history of man. NOTHING could or will come close than His crucifixion. 
 

God’s chosen people not only rejected their Messiah but they murdered Him. This act would now cause a 2000 year separation between His people and their God.

Thus, the abomination caused them to become entirely desolate from their God. The Jews were punished at the time of Babylon. Everything is Israel was completely destroyed and its people were taken away.

Fast forward 600 years and now we have the most abominable act that could ever take place on the earth. Consequently, the punishment would have to exceed the mere destruction of brick and mortar, etc.

God would make desolate His people from His presence for some 2000 years. 
 

Only when God decides to remove the blindness from their eyes and they recognize the one they had pierced will they be once again in His presence. After the time of the Gentiles is fulfilled, God will give His people a “Damascus” like experience and for the following 3.5 years they will preach the Word of God AND the Testimony of Jesus to the world. Then the Messiah can and will return. 
 

There is no 7 year tribulation. Everything that was to be fulfilled DURING the 70th week was fulfilled by Jesus. 

 

 

Israel still sins, transgresses, does not have everlasting righteousness,  they have achieved none of the six.

BTW Scripture says the Anointed One has nothing is Cut off, dies after the 69th Week. No mention of the 70th Week until v27, well after Christ's death. The sequence of v27 can then be applied correctly. 

Now this gives plenty of time for the 70th Week.  And a midpoint when the A/D comes forth. A time for those of Judea to flee. A time for the S. T. B judgments to come forth. And then Armageddon followed by the 2nd Coming. 

In Christ

Montana Marv 

[Charlie744]

21 minutes ago, Montana Marv said:

Israel still sins, transgresses, does not have everlasting righteousness,  they have achieved none of the six.

BTW Scripture says the Anointed One has nothing is Cut off, dies after the 69th Week. No mention of the 70th Week until v27, well after Christ's death. The sequence of v27 can then be applied correctly. 

Now this gives plenty of time for the 70th Week.  And a midpoint when the A/D comes forth. A time for those of Judea to flee. A time for the S. T. B judgments to come forth. And then Armageddon followed by the 2nd Coming. 

In Christ

Montana Marv 

Thanks Marv for your response. 
 

1) The 6 requirements in 9:24 were given to the Messiah to fulfill by His Father. Only God could fulfill them.. they don’t speak of Israel. 
 
2) Only God can forgive sin. By the cross, He made it so that our sin will not be remembered or seen by God should we believe in Jesus and what He did for us at the cross. 

3) Jesus came to pay the price for our transgressions. He did NOT come to take away our sin nature. That will only take place when we are with Him in heaven. 
 

4) Jesus did not come to rule on earth, but to establish His Church. It is a spiritual church not a physical one. 
 

5) Daniel tells us that “UNTIL THE MESSIAH, there will be 7 and 62 weeks… He will only arrive AFTER the completion of the 69 weeks. 
After the 69th week is the beginning of the 70th week. Thus, Jesus would be baptized in the Jordan and anointed by His Father that day. This would begin His ministry and the final 7 years or the prophecy. 
 

6) Do you think it is a coincidence that Daniel tells us that He will be cut off in the midst of the week? This is exactly what happened to Jesus. He would go to the cross literally on the 4th Passover that occurred exactly 3.5 years AFTER the beginning of the 70th week of the prophecy. 
 

7) Despite being “cut off” halfway during the last week of the prophecy He was given to fulfill His 6 requirements, He would be heard on the cross, “it is finished.” He would fulfill all 6 BEFORE the cross. The 6 elements in 9:24 are not worldly or physical things to be completed but spiritual things that only God could fulfill. 
 
8) the intentional corruption of Daniel 9:24-27 was designed by the little horn of Daniel 7&8 (papacy) in the late 16th century. They were very successful in promoting and teaching these evil / false misinterpretations to the world. They have been doing this in our schools over the past many generations of children. 
 

9) The covenant mentioned is the New Covenant mentioned in Jeremiah 31:31-34. No one but God can make a covenant with His people. Jesus CONFIRMED the covenant- meaning there was already one in place (Mt. Sinai).

10) Jesus CONFIRMED the Covenant DURING the last week of the 70 weeks of years prophecy. 
 
11) His serving as the Lamb of God who would take away the sin of the world would eliminate any further need for animal sacrifices or offerings. 
 

12) He would deal up the vision- this means He would complete or finish the prophecies that were mentioned in Daniele rejection and other OT books of the Bible that spoke of His first, His death and resurrection. 

14) also, because of the most horrible act committed against God, the Jews rejection and crucifixion of their Messiah, He would become “desolate” with His people for the next 2000 years. He (the cross) is the abomination that will cause complete desolation with Hus people for the time of the Gentile (2000 years). 
 
The Scriptures, especially the Book of Daniel is all about God and His plan to restore us back in the Garden once again. 
 

[JoeCanada]

On 6/16/2024 at 9:04 PM, Montana Marv said:

Dan 9:26 - After the (7 Sevens) and 62 - Sevens, the Anointed One will be cut off and have nothing.  Christ dies at the end of the 69th Week.

In Christ

Montana Marv

I have to agree with you Marv.

Dan 9:25 says : “So you are to know and discern that from the issuing of a decree to restore and rebuild Jerusalem until Messiah the Prince there will be seven weeks and sixty-two weeks...."

Until Messiah the Prince....

When did Jesus officially declare Himself to be the  Christ, the Messiah?

Mark 14... "They led Jesus away to the high priest; and all the chief priests and the elders and the scribes *gathered together. 

             ... "Now the chief priests and the whole Council kept trying to obtain testimony against Jesus to put Him to death, and they were not finding any.

              ... "For many were giving false testimony against Him

               ..."the high priest was questioning Him, and saying to Him, “Are You the Christ, (Messiah) the Son of the Blessed One?”

                ... "And Jesus said, “I am...

Many will argue that it was at His baptism or when He rode into Jerusalem on a donkey, but it was at His arraignment before Caiaphas that He declared Himself to be the Messiah, in front of the high priest, the chief priests, the elders, the scribes, the whole council of Israel, as well as the Roman officials and the officers in the courtyard within hearing distance..... and the many citizens of Jerusalem.

Dan 9:26 ... "Then after the sixty-two weeks the Messiah will be cut off and have nothing

A person could insert any amount of time "after the sixty-two weeks" and build a case ... but to me it means what it says. 'AFTER SIXTY-TWO WEEKS' ...

............... WHEN THE SIXTY-TWO WEEKS HAVE ENDED

[BlindSeeker]

1 minute ago, JoeCanada said:

You must always be willing to truly consider evidence that contradicts your beliefs, and admit the possibility that you may be wrong.

Intelligence isn't knowing everything, it's the ability to challenge everything you know.

Nice quote...

[Charlie744]

5 minutes ago, JoeCanada said:

I have to agree with you Marv.

Dan 9:25 says : “So you are to know and discern that from the issuing of a decree to restore and rebuild Jerusalem until Messiah the Prince there will be seven weeks and sixty-two weeks...."

Until Messiah the Prince....

When did Jesus officially declare Himself to be the  Christ, the Messiah?

Mark 14... "They led Jesus away to the high priest; and all the chief priests and the elders and the scribes *gathered together. 

             ... "Now the chief priests and the whole Council kept trying to obtain testimony against Jesus to put Him to death, and they were not finding any.

              ... "For many were giving false testimony against Him

               ..."the high priest was questioning Him, and saying to Him, “Are You the Christ, (Messiah) the Son of the Blessed One?”

                ... "And Jesus said, “I am...

Many will argue that it was at His baptism or when He rode into Jerusalem on a donkey, but it was at His arraignment before Caiaphas that He declared Himself to be the Messiah, in front of the high priest, the chief priests, the elders, the scribes, the whole council of Israel, as well as the Roman officials and the officers in the courtyard within hearing distance..... and the many citizens of Jerusalem.

Dan 9:26 ... "Then after the sixty-two weeks the Messiah will be cut off and have nothing

A person could insert any amount of time "after the sixty-two weeks" and build a case ... but to me it means what it says. 'AFTER SIXTY-TWO WEEKS' ...

............... WHEN THE SIXTY-TWO WEEKS HAVE ENDED

Hey Joe, I agree with you that the Messiah arrived AFTER the end of the 62 weeks, which came AFTER the first 7 weeks or a total of 69 weeks. 
 

So, He indeed was baptized by John in the Jordan on the first day of the 70th week. He was also Anointed by His Father the exact same time (dove came down and they heard a voice from heaven…)

The prophecy is not when Jesus openly declared He is the Messiah, it is when He arrives after the 69th week. 
 

Then, Jesus began His 3.5 year ministry that began on the first day of the last week. 
 

The verses you quoted re: Caiaphas, the elders, riding in on a donkey came at the end of His ministry. He preached throughout Israel for 3.5 years until He attended His 4th and final Passover in Jerusalem when He would be crucified. 
 

All of this took place DURING the first 3.5 years of the last 7 years. 
 

After 7 and 62 (69) weeks Jesus would arrive to he His ministry.

After the completion of the same 62 week section He would be cut off. He was indeed crucified AFTER the 62 week section of the prophecy - 3.5 years after the end of the 62 week section. 
 

God specifically wrote this prophecy in this manner because it can / should be used only one way. He told us when He would arrive, when He would be cut off and then He confirmed exactly when it would occur- in the midst of the week. 
 

 

[JoeCanada]

55 minutes ago, Charlie744 said:

Hey Joe, I agree with you that the Messiah arrived AFTER the end of the 62 weeks, which came AFTER the first 7 weeks or a total of 69 weeks. 
 

So, He indeed was baptized by John in the Jordan on the first day of the 70th week. He was also Anointed by His Father the exact same time (dove came down and they heard a voice from heaven…)

The prophecy is not when Jesus openly declared He is the Messiah, it is when He arrives after the 69th week. 
 

Then, Jesus began His 3.5 year ministry that began on the first day of the last week. 
 

The verses you quoted re: Caiaphas, the elders, riding in on a donkey came at the end of His ministry. He preached throughout Israel for 3.5 years until He attended His 4th and final Passover in Jerusalem when He would be crucified. 
 

All of this took place DURING the first 3.5 years of the last 7 years. 
 

After 7 and 62 (69) weeks Jesus would arrive to he His ministry.

After the completion of the same 62 week section He would be cut off. He was indeed crucified AFTER the 62 week section of the prophecy - 3.5 years after the end of the 62 week section. 
 

God specifically wrote this prophecy in this manner because it can / should be used only one way. He told us when He would arrive, when He would be cut off and then He confirmed exactly when it would occur- in the midst of the week. 
 

 

Hey Charlie,

"“So you are to know and discern that from the issuing of a decree to restore and rebuild Jerusalem until Messiah the Prince"

We know that the 70 week prophecy was written for the Jews, Daniel's people.

So how would the Jews 'know' who the Messiah was?

The prophecy doesn't say 'when He arrives'. 

 And there were only a few present at His baptism and  His anointing by the Holy Spirit.  

Also Jesus' 3 1/2 year ministry is hotly debated and challenged.

So, since the Jews had the scrolls from the the prophets and they studied them, they only knew Jesus was the Messiah the Prince when He declared it to them....

.............................. at His trial.  

[Charlie744]

5 minutes ago, JoeCanada said:

Hey Charlie,

"“So you are to know and discern that from the issuing of a decree to restore and rebuild Jerusalem until Messiah the Prince"

We know that the 70 week prophecy was written for the Jews, Daniel's people.

So how would the Jews 'know' who the Messiah was?

I hope I am not misunderstanding your question, but that is exactly what verse 25 reveals. 

In verse 24, God provides us with the total period of this particular prophecy - it will last 70 years (70 weeks of years or 490 literal years).

Then, in verse 25, He tells us the Messiah will arrive AFTER the completion of the 7 and 62 weeks (first two timed sections within the 70 weeks of years prophecy), is completed. 

I believe it is safe to say that the Jews were expected their Messiah to arrive around the time that He actually did come, but they did not recognize Him. Their timing was right but they were expecting a King David like Messiah who would come on some great white horse to defeat the Romans. This particular figure in the desert was just not what they were looking for....

But this too was prophesied in the OT. - He would not be recognized, He would be seen in a common manner, nothing that would give away His divinity or majesty - He indeed purposely blinded their eyes from recognizing He was God on earth.

Despite all of His teachings, the miracles, the raising of the dead and the return of sight to the blind would still not be enough proof for them to accept He was their Messiah. Even after He disclosed He was the Son of Man, no one believe Him - but that is the way He designed His plan of salvation.

Only after the cross would He instruct them to search the Scriptures to learn and find they did indeed speak of Him. 

There was not ONE person who believed He was our Lord and Savior.  Even after His death, they immediately ran to His grave to perform the burial practices... but they were also shocked He was not there.

But He did leave us with the tremendous prophecies found in Daniel that would allow us to understand what and who these prophetic verses were speaking about. And I can assure you, they are not speaking about some mythical anti-Christ figure that would come some 2000 years in the future.

Jesus Himself told us to go back to the Book of Daniel - they are all about Him.

Thanks Joe, good to hear from you again and I look forward to your thoughts - agree or not, no problem. Charlie

 

 

 

 

5 minutes ago, JoeCanada said:

The prophecy doesn't say 'when He arrives'. 

 And there were only a few present at His baptism and  His anointing by the Holy Spirit.  

Also Jesus' 3 1/2 year ministry is hotly debated and challenged.

So, since the Jews had the scrolls from the the prophets and they studied them, they only knew Jesus was the Messiah the Prince when He declared it to them....

.............................. at His trial.  

 

[Montana Marv]

On 6/17/2024 at 12:45 PM, Charlie744 said:

1) The 6 requirements in 9:24 were given to the Messiah to fulfill by His Father. Only God could fulfill them.. they don’t speak of Israel. 

You are wrong, they do speak of Israel :  Seventy Sevens are decreed for your people (Israel) and your holy city (Jerusalem) TO: the six.  Two not one. (people and city)  Zech 13:1 - On that day a fountain will be opened to the house of David, and the inhabitants of Jerusalem, to cleanse them from sin and impurity.

On 6/17/2024 at 12:45 PM, Charlie744 said:

2) Only God can forgive sin. By the cross, He made it so that our sin will not be remembered or seen by God should we believe in Jesus and what He did for us at the cross. 

Yes, but when does Israel benefit?  Zech 13:4 - On that Day every prophet will be ashamed of his prophetic vision. (one of the six)

On 6/17/2024 at 12:45 PM, Charlie744 said:

5) Daniel tells us that “UNTIL THE MESSIAH, there will be 7 and 62 weeks… He will only arrive AFTER the completion of the 69 weeks. 
After the 69th week is the beginning of the 70th week. Thus, Jesus would be baptized in the Jordan and anointed by His Father that day. This would begin His ministry and the final 7 years or the prophecy. 

No; Scripture says the Anointed One is cut off after the 62 - Sevens.  No mention of a ministry.  Cut off, dies.

On 6/17/2024 at 12:45 PM, Charlie744 said:

6) Do you think it is a coincidence that Daniel tells us that He will be cut off in the midst of the week? This is exactly what happened to Jesus. He would go to the cross literally on the 4th Passover that occurred exactly 3.5 years AFTER the beginning of the 70th week of the prophecy. 

Scripture does  not support what you imply.  No midst of the week is there.  His death  separates the 69th Week from the 70th Week.

On 6/17/2024 at 12:45 PM, Charlie744 said:

8) the intentional corruption of Daniel 9:24-27 was designed by the little horn of Daniel 7&8 (papacy) in the late 16th century. They were very successful in promoting and teaching these evil / false misinterpretations to the world. They have been doing this in our schools over the past many generations of children. 

What corruption is there.  Did the Holy Spirit get something wrong.

On 6/17/2024 at 12:45 PM, Charlie744 said:

) The covenant mentioned is the New Covenant mentioned in Jeremiah 31:31-34. No one but God can make a covenant with His people. Jesus CONFIRMED the covenant- meaning there was already one in place (Mt. Sinai).

Scripture does not imply that.  "He will confirm a covenant with many for One Week"; Christ did no such thing at his Baptism.  None of the 4 Gospels support this claim of yours.

On 6/17/2024 at 12:45 PM, Charlie744 said:

10) Jesus CONFIRMED the Covenant DURING the last week of the 70 weeks of years prophecy. 

You do not follow sequence.  The prince to come (Titus) destroyed the city and sanctuary in 70 A.D. Then at some later date v. 27 comes in to play.  There is a break when the Anointed One is cut off. Titus destroys the city, then another in the future confirms an older covenant (establishes Temple sacrifices and offerings).

On 6/17/2024 at 12:45 PM, Charlie744 said:

14) also, because of the most horrible act committed against God, the Jews rejection and crucifixion of their Messiah, He would become “desolate” with His people for the next 2000 years. He (the cross) is the abomination that will cause complete desolation with Hus people for the time of the Gentile (2000 years). 

Not supported by Scripture.  But In Matt 24:15 ; Jesus tells those in Judea to flee to the mountains when they see the A/D spoken of in Daniel, then there will be distress unequaled, a warning to nursing mothers. Immediately afterward, not over a 2000 year period.

No; He (the Cross) is the redemption of mankind, it is the Worthy Christ bearing the sins of the world.. (not an abomination)...  Our being Crucified with Christ is not an abomination.  You are dead wrong.

Do I need to go any further

In Christ

Montana Marv

[Montana Marv]

3 hours ago, JoeCanada said:

Dan 9:25 says : “So you are to know and discern that from the issuing of a decree to restore and rebuild Jerusalem until Messiah the Prince there will be seven weeks and sixty-two weeks...."

The Anointed One was cut off (died) at the end of the 62 Weeks,  you left that out.

In Christ

Montana Marv

[Charlie744]

20 minutes ago, Montana Marv said:

You are wrong, they do speak of Israel :  Seventy Sevens are decreed for your people (Israel) and your holy city (Jerusalem) TO: the six.  Two not one. (people and city)  Zech 13:1 - On that day a fountain will be opened to the house of David, and the inhabitants of Jerusalem, to cleanse them from sin and impurity.

Thanks Marv for your response. I think we might have to continue this discussion a little longer... not to change your interpretations, but at least I may have to explain my thoughts better since your responses reveal some agreement and some differences.

Ok, the 70 weeks do indeed speak to Israel... meaning, they are GIVEN to Israel and apply ONLY to Israel because they are the only party that must be restored back to Jerusalem. The 70 weeks prophecy is all about the restoration of His people and the city. But, as I had mentioned, God would purposely section the 70 weeks into 3 separate sections to reveal and identify those elements of the "restoration" that will be fulfilled and completed by the Jews (first 49 years they will complete the physical elements - Temple, Sanctuary, walls, streets, etc.) God had given this responsibility to His people.

Fast forward to the next time element - that of the last 7 weeks. Here, God purposefully skips over the largest section (the middle section that totaled 62 weeks) and told us the timing when the Messiah would arrive WITHIN this 70 week prophecy. It would be AFTER the completion of the 7 and 62 week sections. This was done on purpose because by mentioning both separate time elements WITHIN the prophecy, there is / should not be any dispute on His arrival. 70 always comes after 69.

But God is not simply revealing the details of the 70 weeks for chuckles. He is telling us that every piece of furniture that was taken away or destroyed by the Babylonians MUST be fully restored. And remember, the very first piece of furniture taken away was the Ark by Jeremiah to prevent them from taking it to Babylon. 

So, God would design a "restoration" plan that would restore everything that was taken away in the reverse order they were taken. This means, He purposely set aside the last week of the 70 weeks for His Messiah to return. Jesus would symbolically and literally be the restoration of the ARK. He would be the presence of God in the Sanctuary. Now, the restoration is complete - the Jews are fully restored in Jerusalem, the city, the walls, the streets, etc., were fully restored. The Levitical system including all the ceremonies would be reinstated... the ONLY piece to be fully restored would be the Ark of the Covenant - Jesus. 

He certainly did arrive AFTER the completion of the 69 weeks and He definitely was baptized in the Jordan on the very first day of the beginning of the 70th week. Obviously, this would begin His ministry. For 3.5 years He would preach the Word of God throughout Israel and in the"midst of the week" He would be rejected and crucified by His people.

Unfortunately, because of their "abominable" act, they would be made desolate from their God for the next 2000 years. That was their punishment. The Temple was also destroyed by Titus in 70 AD, however, that really have no longer any significance in God's plan of salvation. Jesus became our Temple, our sacrifice, our High Priest and our Savior. The physical Temple and the Levitical ceremonies were no longer necessary - they were thrown to the ground and would never have any importance in His plan of salvation - He had done away with all of them.
 

20 minutes ago, Montana Marv said:

Yes, but when does Israel benefit?  Zech 13:4 - On that Day every prophet will be ashamed of his prophetic vision. (one of the six)

Marv, it was God's very own plan to blind the eyes of His people from recognizing them. The Jews had no choice in the matter. The Jews would be sacrificed so the Gentiles could be grafted in to His Kingdom. The verse in Zechariah, I believe, speaks to the end times when God will remove the blindness from their eyes. It will be akin to the Damascus experience of Paul. They will recognize the one they pierced through His divine effort and they will go out into the world preaching the Word of God and the Testimony of Jesus for 3,5 years and then bring in the Messiah.

20 minutes ago, Montana Marv said:

No; Scripture says the Anointed One is cut off after the 62 - Sevens.  No mention of a ministry.  Cut off, dies.

Yes, the Messiah would be cut off AFTER the second section of the three part prophecy was completed. Thus, the first 7 had to be completed first, then the 62 weeks were completed. Now, there is only one week left in the prophecy. Within the last 7 years there are two important events: Jesus arrives on the first day of the 7 years, and He is crucified exactly 3.5 years later (in the midst of the week).

20 minutes ago, Montana Marv said:

 

 

Scripture does  not support what you imply.  No midst of the week is there.  His death  separates the 69th Week from the 70th Week.

Sure it does... see above.

20 minutes ago, Montana Marv said:

What corruption is there.  Did the Holy Spirit get something wrong.

Oh this... this represents the intentional corruption of these prophecies in Daniel chapter 9 by the little horn of Daniel 7. Meaning, he would intentionally misinterpret these prophecies inj 9:24-27 so they DO NOT SPEAK OF THE MESSIAH BUT INSTEAD, they intentionally created a futuristic scenerio where much of these verses were thrown some 2000 years into the future ...

20 minutes ago, Montana Marv said:

Scripture does not imply that.  "He will confirm a covenant with many for One Week"; Christ did no such thing at his Baptism.  None of the 4 Gospels support this claim of yours.

Jesus did not confirm the new covenant at His baptizm. It was confirmed when He went to the cross. His Father required of Him to fulfill the 6 elements in 9:24. Remember I mentioned that each of the 3 sections had their own assigment and purpose for a complete restoration... well, these 6 were assigned to Jesus to fulfill in the last week of the prophecy - only Jesus could fulfill this requirements from His Father... the Jews were on the transgresssion side of things...and by the way, these 6 could only be fulfilled by God and they had to be fulfilled by the cross in order for the Gentiles to be saved. The Gentiles would fall under His sacrifice as well.

20 minutes ago, Montana Marv said:

You do not follow sequence.  The prince to come (Titus) destroyed the city and sanctuary in 70 A.D. Then at some later date v. 27 comes in to play.  There is a break when the Anointed One is cut off. Titus destroys the city, then another in the future confirms an older covenant (establishes Temple sacrifices and offerings).

No, it does not work that way. I believe if you look into the chiastic structure of chapter 9, you will find how they are indeed structured - God does not necessarily give His prophecies in chronological order. And that is definitely found in many other chapters in Daniel.

By the way, Titus did indeed destroy the Temple and everything in Israel in 70AD, but he is NOT the prince ... he represents the "people" of the prince to come. The prince to come is the little horn who comes later after the demise of pagan Rome (papacy).

 

20 minutes ago, Montana Marv said:

Not supported by Scripture.  But In Matt 24:15 ; Jesus tells those in Judea to flee to the mountains when they see the A/D spoken of in Daniel, then there will be distress unequaled, a warning to nursing mothers. Immediately afterward, not over a 2000 year period.

The cross IS THE ABOMINATION THAT CAUSES DESOLATION. The most egregious or abominable act that could ever be done against our God is to reject Him and then crucify Him. Nothine the Jews could have done that would have been a greater transgression against thier Messiah. As a direct result of their crucifying  their own Messiah, God would make them desolate for 2000 years. The abomination (the crucifying of our Messiah) caused a complete desolation of the Jews from their God for the next 2000 years - They would not have access to Him until the time of the Gentiles is over.

In Luke, Jesus told them to flee to the mountains when they see these things.... Jesus is predicting His crucifixion and He knows in 70 AD what will take place. 

 

20 minutes ago, Montana Marv said:

No; He (the Cross) is the redemption of mankind, it is the Worthy Christ bearing the sins of the world.. (not an abomination)...  Our being Crucified with Christ is not an abomination.  You are dead wrong.

 

Yes, of course Jesus is the Lamb of God who takes away the sin of the world, but the cross also represents the most abominable act on the part of the Jews against their God. Remember, this is God's plan of salvation for all mankind. He willingly went to the cross but within that plan He knew the Jews would reject Him and crucify Him... there was no other way for our salvation.

20 minutes ago, Montana Marv said:

 

 

Do I need to go any further

Yes, you do... please consider these interpretations.... that is all I would ask. Thanks for your response, Charlie

20 minutes ago, Montana Marv said:

In Christ

Montana Marv