Would someone still be saved if they didnt believe this..?

[AnOrangeCat]

21 hours ago, Figure of eighty said:

Alot of christians dont believe in hell bc they feel its too mean or cruel of a punishment some dont believe in tongues or the holy spirit either. If they follow God and his commands and believe in hi m would they still go to heaven.?

As a general rule I believe we're allowed to be wrong on certain things as long as we're believing in Jesus and making some effort to live as He wants us to. Beliefs on Hell are divided and divisive. From my own study I feel that there's a case that can be made for both annihilation and eternal Hell, so it pays to be humble rather than aggressive or demeaning when speaking on the issue. Jesus spoke on Hell more than anyone else in the Bible so the fact that Hell exists probably shouldn't be in question. It's the nature of Hell where there's room for debate.

But there's a catch. James tells us that those who teach are judged more strictly, which aligns with Jesus saying to whom much is given much is required and Paul warning us not to cause our brothers and sisters in Christ to stumble. This stumbling is the point where I take note.

I've been around the block long enough to have seen people ask things like "Is doing this a sin?", "Does suicide send you to Hell?" and so on. While this isn't always the case I find that there can be a certain element of seeking permission in such cases. If I were to assert a position where Hell didn't seem as bad as someone initially thought, and then that causes them to grow lax or fall into sin, then by my estimation I played a part in causing them to stumble. So any discourse on the topic, IMO, needs a disclaimer that we can't be 100% certain. All we can do is share opinions and make cases from our understanding of scripture.

So my advice is to read up on eternal conscious torment and annihilationism. Take your time, read the verses and the areas around them for context, think on it, and then revisit as often as you need to. It could get uncomfortable. Take a break if you need to, but keep at it. Even if you reach an incorrect conclusion God will know you did your due diligence and made an honest mistake.

All that said I also think that so long as you're in a good place in your relationship with God it's okay to just not dwell on the topic so much. I have an opinion, but one way or another I trust that Hell will make sense when my earthly life is over. So the specifics of it aren't really crucial to my personal theology.

[FreeGrace]

On 2/17/2025 at 10:29 AM, Figure of eighty said:

Alot of christians dont believe in hell bc they feel its too mean or cruel of a punishment some dont believe in tongues or the holy spirit either. If they follow God and his commands and believe in hi m would they still go to heaven.?

Look at it this way:  If someone doesn't believe in hell, then why would they place their faith/trust in the finished work of Christ on the cross?  What would be the reason?  And why would they say they are "saved" if there is nothing to be saved FROM?

I guess you'll have to ask these deniers of hell the basis for their claim that they are "saved" or "Christians".  Probably most of them will indicate something simple like, "it's better to be good than bad", but have no reason to support that if there will be no consequences for sin.  

Of course, it is quite possible for saved people to deny a lot of what the Bible teaches.  But to deny the ultimate consequence of sin certainly puts the finished work of Christ on the cross as immaterial.

And denal of hell is what all atheists believe.  They claim at death, they cease to exist.  No more consciousness.  So those saved people have a view that is parallel to atheists.  Maybe pointing that out to them will wake them up to the truth.

[other one]

1 minute ago, FreeGrace said:

Look at it this way:  If someone doesn't believe in hell, then why would they place their faith/trust in the finished work of Christ on the cross?

Because Jesus is the greatest thing in the world and I want to spend eternity interfacing with him.     He is not a fire insurance policy to me.

[FreeGrace]

6 minutes ago, other one said:

Because Jesus is the greatest thing in the world and I want to spend eternity interfacing with him.     He is not a fire insurance policy to me.

But the clear issue remains: what, exactly, are you being saved FROM when you place your faith in Christ?  An eternity apart from God, being tormented.

[other one]

Just now, FreeGrace said:

But the clear issue remains: what, exactly, are you being saved FROM when you place your faith in Christ?  An eternity apart from God, being tormented.

since there is a lot of discussion about the tormented part, and since it doesn't concern me at all, I don't really care to deal with it.   It's like saying if you jump out of an airplane without a parachute, one is almost sure to die.    Well since I have no intention of jumping, it doesn't concern me at all.

[Deborah_]

15 minutes ago, FreeGrace said:

Look at it this way:  If someone doesn't believe in hell, then why would they place their faith/trust in the finished work of Christ on the cross?  What would be the reason?  And why would they say they are "saved" if there is nothing to be saved FROM?

Do you think that people become Christians only out of fear? 

Some of us become followers of Christ because we have met Him and discovered that He loves us - and an experience of that love is sufficient for us to turn from our idols and worship Him. Later on we discover that we had been going to Hell and He has saved us from that fate - which is an added bonus, but not the reason for us coming to faith in the first place.

[FreeGrace]

11 minutes ago, other one said:

FreeGrace said:

But the clear issue remains: what, exactly, are you being saved FROM when you place your faith in Christ?  An eternity apart from God, being tormented.

since there is a lot of discussion about the tormented part, and since it doesn't concern me at all, I don't really care to deal with it.   It's like saying if you jump out of an airplane without a parachute, one is almost sure to die.    Well since I have no intention of jumping, it doesn't concern me at all.

Since salvation is all about being SAVED, what do you believe you are being saved FROM then?  Thanks.

[FreeGrace]

3 minutes ago, Deborah_ said:

FreeGrace said:

Look at it this way:  If someone doesn't believe in hell, then why would they place their faith/trust in the finished work of Christ on the cross?  What would be the reason?  And why would they say they are "saved" if there is nothing to be saved FROM?

Do you think that people become Christians only out of fear? 

Of course many do.  And why not?  Do you not believe that there will be a conscious eternity apart from God for all unbelievers?

3 minutes ago, Deborah_ said:

Some of us become followers of Christ because we have met Him and discovered that He loves us - and an experience of that love is sufficient for us to turn from our idols and worship Him. Later on we discover that we had been going to Hell and He has saved us from that fate - which is an added bonus, but not the reason for us coming to faith in the first place.

It seems then, that the initial "coming to faith" has nothing to with salvation.  Am I understanding you correctly?

Recall the jailer's question and Paul's answer, which is theology 101.

jailer:  what must I do to be saved?

Paul:  believe on the Lord Jesus Christ and you will be saved.

The jailer certainly was aware of something in eternity to be saved from.

[chirpy]

salvation is not a mental acknowledgement of God/Jesus,  it is attitude of the heart.  Our heart acknowledges God/Jesus as the power and source of salvation resulting in our love, gratification and change.  And yes fear, fear of disappointing, of embarrassing our Lord by living a life that does not glorify or bring honor to our savior.  We want to please, and yes we stumble and yet know we are still loved.

[Deborah_]

1 hour ago, FreeGrace said:

Do you not believe that there will be a conscious eternity apart from God for all unbelievers?

I believe in Hell, yes.

 

1 hour ago, FreeGrace said:

It seems then, that the initial "coming to faith" has nothing to with salvation.  Am I understanding you correctly?

Of course coming to faith is equivalent to being saved. But faith isn't something intellectual - it's trust in the person of Jesus. You can trust in Him and be saved by Him without understanding all the ins and outs of Christian theology. As Paul said to the jailer, if you believe in Jesus you will be saved. Whether or not you understand all about sin and Hell.