Is it inappropriate to judge another?

[tatwo]

This layout was done for the hungry in the house...its a meal, the desert and a fine wine as well...not everyone will like the taste...nor be able to chew or digest...but then again I am not sent to everyone...but to the House of the Living God. This will require time in reading...studying...prayer and communication...if you are already comfortable with your life in God and already know all you need to know...you should still read all of this for you it will be a refresher. If you are hungry for more of the Lord Yahshua Christ...you will find Him in this somewhere...I hope.

I have for years believed that there was a significant difference of character between someone in the Body of Christ and everyone else? Often times that is not readily observable in the spiritually immature…so I am not including them in this statement. However for the mature and maturing saints there is…that alone is a scripturally based Spirit enlightened “judgment” or “assessment” if you don’t like the word “judgment.”

The mature son of God is mature because of growth by exercising “spiritual discernment” and Paul writes about this in Hebrews chapter 5. Additionally have you [the reader] considered Paul’s work in 1^st Corinthians chapter 2 in terms of the difference between the carnal man and the spiritual man?

It is based in “judgment…spiritual judgment”…by default the spiritual man judges the carnal or natural man…he simply must as a part of his spiritual walk. They are fed from two very different fountains if you will…the difference is illuminated to the mature spiritual man…by virtue of the wisdom of God via the Holy Spirit. Which wisdom enables the spiritual man to interpret spiritual thoughts from the mind of God? Something the natural or carnal man has zero access to…something they don’t even realize exists.

This “we aren’t supposed to judge others” mentality is a veiled attempt to side step scriptural, spiritual and loving accountability. It seems like the “don’t judge me and I won’t judge you” belief which has its basis in nothing more than…”everyone doing what’s right in their own eyes”…leads to division and disintegration among church members…apostasy.

Paul made it clear…“but just as it is written, "THINGS WHICH EYE HAS NOT SEEN AND EAR HAS NOT HEARD, AND which HAVE NOT ENTERED THE HEART OF MAN, ALL THAT GOD HAS PREPARED FOR THOSE WHO LOVE HIM.” Paul’s judgment between the fleshly man… “eye, ear and heart” all in reference to the natural man…”those who love Him”…the spiritual man.

How do those who “love God” understand what “God has prepared for them”…most do not seem to be too concerned about this? Paul wrote this…“For to us God revealed them through the Spirit; for the Spirit searches all things, even the depths of God.” The Holy Spirit of God reveals our Fathers desires for us via His Holy Spirit to our spirit…the natural man cannot avail himself of this in his carnal state.

Paul furthers this Truth by asking this question…“For who among men knows the thoughts of a man except the spirit of the man which is in him? A man’s spirit knows what a man is thinking…“Even so the thoughts of God no one knows except the Spirit of God.”  The thoughts of God which are known by His Spirit…this aligns perfectly with the thoughts of a man are known by the spirit of man.

Continuing on in 1^st Corinthians chapter 2…“Now we have received, not the spirit of the world, but the Spirit who is from God” this is a clear separation between the carnal man who has the spirit of the world…and the spiritual man who has the Spirit of God. Why is this distinction so important? “so that we may know the things freely given to us by God” referencing back to verse 9.

Then Paul…referring to the things “freely given to us by God”…goes on to say…“which things we also speak, not in words taught by human wisdom, but in those taught by the Spirit, combining spiritual thoughts with spiritual words.” Brothers and sisters…we are given access to the very mind of God so that we can understand what God’s will for our lives is…so that He could help us live it out. That is the only life He will empower.

This wisdom is a “heavenly & spiritual” wisdom…taught to us by the Holy Spirit…not mere carnal human wisdom. God’s wisdom in “thought – thinking”…taught to our spirits by the Holy Spirit of God…that we would “speak the spiritual words” of God. This is a heavenly language spoken among the maturing and mature members of the Body of Christ.

Moving to verse 14…“But a natural man does not accept the things of the Spirit of God, for they are foolishness to him; and he cannot understand them, because they are spiritually appraised.” This is the crux of this teaching here…the natural carnal man does not have the Holy Spirit so he can never understand the things of God in that condition…in fact they are foolishness to him.

This is judgment brothers and sisters…if you do not discern by the Holy Spirit of the Living God in Christ…whether a “man is carnal or spiritual” there’s not much chance of you being able to reveal our Father to them…and worse…what if you are seduced by them?

In verse 15 Paul lays down the litmus test for spiritual judgment…“But he who is spiritual appraises all things, yet he himself is appraised by no one.” Appraises there means…interrogate, scrutinize, examine, question…to judge. Conversely the spiritual man is judged by no one but the Holy Spirit. This is a paramount spiritual truth…without which…one is deceived.

Paul finishes verse 16 by reminding us that those filled with the Holy Spirit “have the mind of Christ.”

Ok…now apply this judgment to the carnal natural men of this world…especially those who rule in this world. These men are “void the wisdom of God”…because they are carnal, natural…focused upon the temporal.

I am suggesting that you apply the wisdom of the Holy Spirit of God…in your “appraisal” of the men and women in any…including the current presidential administration that are to run this country. If you don’t have the Holy Spirit…you are just like them and you believe them…if you do have the Holy Spirit…engage with the “living Word who is alive” and understand that…carnal natural humans do not have the things of God in their minds…in anything they do. They are not representatives of the Kingdom of God.

If you blindly follow or put your trust them and their words as Truth…I have shown you here…that "Truth" is not available to them…they are liars by virtue of their association with darkness this includes rebellion and disobedience towards God...for using their wealth and power to build their own kingdoms…to fill their own belly’s. They are not in the temple of God brothers and sisters…their wisdom is earthly, sensual and carnal…they are “mere men.”

If you trust in them to do “righteously and act holy” as we are raised to do…you will be deceived beloved of the King…hear me this day. Do not be deceived…these men and women are scheming and scamming according the powerful dark influence that yet rules from the second heavens.

Just because you don’t see this…does not mean that it is not happening…I have seen some of the schemes they are striving to play out…with their dragon inspired power and authority…which is what? Deception...that is unfathomable to the carnal natural mind of men. It takes a significant amount of grace which is abundant, prayer, study, learning and obedience to the walking out of our high calling to learn to discern and then disarm the schemes of the enemy.

If your hope is in these men and women to do right on your behalf…merely look at the filth and corruption that has been kicked up by men of the same ilk…all belonging to the governments many of you so faithfully vote for. Elon seems bored with ruling of countless billions of $$$$...He wants the helm of a ship that allows him to rule trillions of $$$. The American people are being pilfered and swindled out of everything they have…this is the work of the dragon’s team and his beast.

The acts of the present administration should have already alerted you to these spiritual judgments. I am watching to the best of my ability and according to my call…you may not see it…however I do. I hope to bring forth some of these things Lord willing. Don’t trust my words…take them to your alter and ask the Lord Yahshua to prove them for what they are…judge me.

He is here…the Lord Yahshua Christ is here on the earth today…in the Spirit of God…the Holy Spirit of Truth…which is abiding in His spiritual temple…His people…His Body of course. He is bringing fresh bread and living water straight from the mind and throne of God for His people…His family. Seek Him out today…seek Him on these very issues I brought forth here.

Some very difficult and challenging times are now upon us…they will increase like birth pangs on a pregnant woman…that’s because Christ the Son of the living God is soon to be revealed to creation…there has never been anything like Him before…men and women from every tribe, tongue, people and nation…assembled by the Holy Spirit as one man called Christ…and He will be right here on earth. Do not be afraid…do not be timid…do not hide in fear…seek God…you will find Him. If you want to discuss the matter further just say so openly in the forum or privately in a PM.

Tatwo...:)

[Michael37]

Sometimes the Holy Spirit gives me judgments that are not for disclosure, even to those closest, or in positions of leadership. When I ask what I'm supposed to do about them, various Scriptural answers come to bear.

One judgment I can disclose is the systemic manifestation of denominational pride. We should discern this in our assemblies and address it if led to, otherwise practice not casting our pearls where they will be trampled. 

Good topic. Hope it tracks well.

[AnOrangeCat]

2 hours ago, tatwo said:

I have for years believed that there was a significant difference of character between someone in the Body of Christ and everyone else? Often times that is not readily observable in the spiritually immature…so I am not including them in this statement. However for the mature and maturing saints there is…that alone is a scripturally based Spirit enlightened “judgment” or “assessment” if you don’t like the word “judgment.”

2 hours ago, tatwo said:

This “we aren’t supposed to judge others” mentality is a veiled attempt to side step scriptural, spiritual and loving accountability. It seems like the “don’t judge me and I won’t judge you” belief which has its basis in nothing more than…”everyone doing what’s right in their own eyes”…leads to division and disintegration among church members…apostasy.

I think with these two things you've hit on something important and central to the idea of judging people. I get the impression that our modern sense of judging someone isn't quite the same as what's spoken of in the Bible. These days people seem to equate judging a person with simply having an opinion of them. When Jesus told us not to judge in Matthew 7 the context for this seems to be more a warning against hypocrisy and a reminder to forgive rather than an actual prohibition against judgment.

If we look elsewhere in the Bible we see in Matthew 18:15-17 Jesus lays down a protocol that begins with approaching someone privately, bringing two or three if that doesn't work, and then bringing it before the church as a whole. If the target doesn't listen to the church then it's time to expel them. Paul similarly said to shun the man in I Corinthians who was involved in incest. So we see both Jesus and Paul providing a context where judging is not only acceptable but needed. If the body of Christ doesn't divorce itself from those who misrepresent it or spread false teaching then it reflects poorly on the church and can give people mistaken impressions on what is and isn't acceptable. We're always to forgive, but when judgment is needed I don't think we need to mince words about it.

I'm also reminded of Jesus telling us to be as harmless as doves but as wise as serpents. That necessitates forming opinions on people and acting accordingly, ideally with discernment. There's a whole world full of scammers and people who want to do harm. I believe God would certainly prefer it if we use the time and resources we put to His purposes wisely rather than casting our pearls before swine.

3 hours ago, tatwo said:

The acts of the present administration should have already alerted you to these spiritual judgments. I am watching to the best of my ability and according to my call…you may not see it…however I do. I hope to bring forth some of these things Lord willing. Don’t trust my words…take them to your alter and ask the Lord Yahshua to prove them for what they are…judge me.

We should be able to discern people by their fruit. Admittedly in this age some people have gotten very good at hiding their fruit behind lies and misinformation, and cultural factors have made people want to believe certain things. My thoughts on the current powers that be largely align with yours, though I don't especially push people on it. It's easy to believe the misinformation, and our two parties are both full of objectionable agendas. Current affairs are very much a solid reminder not to put our trust in governments.

[Sower]

2 hours ago, tatwo said:

If you blindly follow or put your trust them and their words as Truth

Jesus is my savior. Not government. Not Trump. I thank God the Biden/Harris mob has been removed. God is still on the throne!
I can say, I am proud, did I say proud, yes proud to be an American. I am blessed beyond measure to be an American citizen.
EVERY American citizen is blessed to live in this country, whether they know it/believe it or not.

America is where I reside now, in this earthen body, temporarily. Some day in the near future I will be called home.
Till then I have to live with all the lost and dying, some friends, neighbors, and even relatives. This is sad.
Coming home from 2 combat tours in the military, I learned to never trust anybody, fully, much less government.

I have employed the lost. I buy from the lost. I have lost friends. I trust some lost more than some saved.  This also is sad.
When in my business I've had to hire sub contractors. I hired the best in the trade I needed. Some were saved, some were not.
I needed men who were professionals, who were good craftsmen. Being a christian sub did not influence my choice. More sad.
Remember our christian President Jimmy Carter?

I hired those who knew the job and performed well. I believe God was pleased in my being a good steward of my business.
I voted for the man, Trump,  who knew his job and performed well. I DID NOT vote for a savior of any kind. I'm tired of hearing this "savior" mantra here. This forum is the ONLY place I've heard the Trump comparison with savior. Stop putting wood on the fire and it dies out.  Yes?

I've read Watchman Nee's 'The Spiritual Man' a couple of times, and pass the book to others. I understand it reasonably well.
The more I abide, spirit led, desiring to do the 'right' thing, confessing every sin, the more I see the good in people.
I know everybody I meet is fighting battles I know nothing about.
I try to think on whatsoever things are pure honest true lovely just praise worthy honorable etc

My trust is not in Trump nor the government, nor any person, pastor friend etc.  I Trust the Lord.
I rarely listen to political dialog on media, and now especially on this forum. Majority of the political threads here get pretty carnal.

I judge everybody all the time. Mentally. Just like the food I eat, work I do, people I talk to etc. Evaluate all, to make decisions.
I realize the lost do not comprehend the things of God nor could they. But they can hear his word, and it is very sharp.
It can cut to the marrow, as it did me in my lost condition, and that word was watered and a child was born.
You have to encounter the lost if you desire to share the good news. I remember that ole faithful brother who shared it with me.

Trump needs Jesus just like you, tatwo, and me. I pray for him that God grants him salvation mercy. Not run him down.
I also pray for many 'christians' here on this forum, as I have quietly mentally evaluated (judged) their behavior. My bad?
I understand spiritual discernment and the holy spirit's promptings to clarify. Not as good as some here claim it could be.

"What has been will be again,
    what has been done will be done again;
       there is nothing new under the sun"

I concentrate on the here and now, another day the Lord has granted me, to try and sow some seed whenever possible.
We were created unto good works and not to focus on the 'worlds' who's who's fighting deceiving slandering etc etc..
It'd be cool to see a thread that lift's up our leaders in prayer for a change, asking for God's best blessings to cover them.

Wouldn't it?   Thanks tatwo..

 

[missmuffet]

2 hours ago, Michael37 said:

Sometimes the Holy Spirit gives me judgments that are not for disclosure, even to those closest, or in positions of leadership. When I ask what I'm supposed to do about them, various Scriptural answers come to bear.

One judgment I can disclose is the systemic manifestation of denominational pride. We should discern this in our assemblies and address it if led to, otherwise practice not casting our pearls where they will be trampled. 

Good topic. Hope it tracks well.

I would give my judgments to God and ask Him if they are appropriate. Can you define to me what systemic manifestation of denominational pride is? Just dumb it down a bit for me

[missmuffet]

24 minutes ago, Sower said:

Jesus is my savior. Not government. Not Trump. I thank God the Biden/Harris mob has been removed. God is still on the throne!
I can say, I am proud, did I say proud, yes proud to be an American. I am blessed beyond measure to be an American citizen.
EVERY American citizen is blessed to live in this country, whether they know it/believe it or not.

America is where I reside now, in this earthen body, temporarily. Some day in the near future I will be called home.
Till then I have to live with all the lost and dying, some friends, neighbors, and even relatives. This is sad.
Coming home from 2 combat tours in the military, I learned to never trust anybody, fully, much less government.

I have employed the lost. I buy from the lost. I have lost friends. I trust some lost more than some saved.  This also is sad.
When in my business I've had to hire sub contractors. I hired the best in the trade I needed. Some were saved, some were not.
I needed men who were professionals, who were good craftsmen. Being a christian sub did not influence my choice. More sad.
Remember our christian President Jimmy Carter?

I hired those who knew the job and performed well. I believe God was pleased in my being a good steward of my business.
I voted for the man, Trump,  who knew his job and performed well. I DID NOT vote for a savior of any kind. I'm tired of hearing this "savior" mantra here. This forum is the ONLY place I've heard the Trump comparison with savior. Stop putting wood on the fire and it dies out.  Yes?

I've read Watchman Nee's 'The Spiritual Man' a couple of times, and pass the book to others. I understand it reasonably well.
The more I abide, spirit led, desiring to do the 'right' thing, confessing every sin, the more I see the good in people.
I know everybody I meet is fighting battles I know nothing about.
I try to think on whatsoever things are pure honest true lovely just praise worthy honorable etc

My trust is not in Trump nor the government, nor any person, pastor friend etc.  I Trust the Lord.
I rarely listen to political dialog on media, and now especially on this forum. Majority of the political threads here get pretty carnal.

I judge everybody all the time. Mentally. Just like the food I eat, work I do, people I talk to etc. Evaluate all, to make decisions.
I realize the lost do not comprehend the things of God nor could they. But they can hear his word, and it is very sharp.
It can cut to the marrow, as it did me in my lost condition, and that word was watered and a child was born.
You have to encounter the lost if you desire to share the good news. I remember that ole faithful brother who shared it with me.

Trump needs Jesus just like you, tatwo, and me. I pray for him that God grants him salvation mercy. Not run him down.
I also pray for many 'christians' here on this forum, as I have quietly mentally evaluated (judged) their behavior. My bad?
I understand spiritual discernment and the holy spirit's promptings to clarify. Not as good as some here claim it could be.

"What has been will be again,
    what has been done will be done again;
       there is nothing new under the sun"

I concentrate on the here and now, another day the Lord has granted me, to try and sow some seed whenever possible.
We were created unto good works and not to focus on the 'worlds' who's who's fighting deceiving slandering etc etc..
It'd be cool to see a thread that lift's up our leaders in prayer for a change, asking for God's best blessings to cover them.

Wouldn't it?   Thanks tatwo..

 

Yes, God is in control in this world we live in. Not Donald Trump or Elon Musk or any of the others who are trying to control our government and everything in it. Perhaps God has a plan and is allowing all of this chaos that is happening now. If He did not want it He surely would not allow it to happen. We don't know why. Our understanding is very different from God's understanding. That is faith and trust in God and knowing that God's Will Be Done and that He knows the whole picture. We do not.

[ayin jade]

49 minutes ago, Sower said:

Jesus is my savior. Not government. Not Trump. I thank God the Biden/Harris mob has been removed. God is still on the throne!
I can say, I am proud, did I say proud, yes proud to be an American. I am blessed beyond measure to be an American citizen.
EVERY American citizen is blessed to live in this country, whether they know it/believe it or not.

America is where I reside now, in this earthen body, temporarily. Some day in the near future I will be called home.
Till then I have to live with all the lost and dying, some friends, neighbors, and even relatives. This is sad.
Coming home from 2 combat tours in the military, I learned to never trust anybody, fully, much less government.

I have employed the lost. I buy from the lost. I have lost friends. I trust some lost more than some saved.  This also is sad.
When in my business I've had to hire sub contractors. I hired the best in the trade I needed. Some were saved, some were not.
I needed men who were professionals, who were good craftsmen. Being a christian sub did not influence my choice. More sad.
Remember our christian President Jimmy Carter?

I hired those who knew the job and performed well. I believe God was pleased in my being a good steward of my business.
I voted for the man, Trump,  who knew his job and performed well. I DID NOT vote for a savior of any kind. I'm tired of hearing this "savior" mantra here. This forum is the ONLY place I've heard the Trump comparison with savior. Stop putting wood on the fire and it dies out.  Yes?

I've read Watchman Nee's 'The Spiritual Man' a couple of times, and pass the book to others. I understand it reasonably well.
The more I abide, spirit led, desiring to do the 'right' thing, confessing every sin, the more I see the good in people.
I know everybody I meet is fighting battles I know nothing about.
I try to think on whatsoever things are pure honest true lovely just praise worthy honorable etc

My trust is not in Trump nor the government, nor any person, pastor friend etc.  I Trust the Lord.
I rarely listen to political dialog on media, and now especially on this forum. Majority of the political threads here get pretty carnal.

I judge everybody all the time. Mentally. Just like the food I eat, work I do, people I talk to etc. Evaluate all, to make decisions.
I realize the lost do not comprehend the things of God nor could they. But they can hear his word, and it is very sharp.
It can cut to the marrow, as it did me in my lost condition, and that word was watered and a child was born.
You have to encounter the lost if you desire to share the good news. I remember that ole faithful brother who shared it with me.

Trump needs Jesus just like you, tatwo, and me. I pray for him that God grants him salvation mercy. Not run him down.
I also pray for many 'christians' here on this forum, as I have quietly mentally evaluated (judged) their behavior. My bad?
I understand spiritual discernment and the holy spirit's promptings to clarify. Not as good as some here claim it could be.

"What has been will be again,
    what has been done will be done again;
       there is nothing new under the sun"

I concentrate on the here and now, another day the Lord has granted me, to try and sow some seed whenever possible.
We were created unto good works and not to focus on the 'worlds' who's who's fighting deceiving slandering etc etc..
It'd be cool to see a thread that lift's up our leaders in prayer for a change, asking for God's best blessings to cover them.

Wouldn't it?   Thanks tatwo..

 

What sower said. Two thumbs up.

[ayin jade]

Im pretty tired. Long day traveling to another city and home again ....

Seems to me the issue of judging is simple. God says 

John 7:24 Do not judge according to sight, but judge righteous judgment.

and He says

1 Corinthians 5
12 For what is it to me to also judge those who are outside? Do you not judge those who are inside?
13 But God judges those who are outside. Therefore put out from you the evil one.

So the question is, do you believe trump is a Christian? If not, then are you, according to scripture, allowed to judge him?

If he is a Christian, are you judging with righteous judgment?

Are you judging members on worthy with righteous judgment?

 

[Michael37]

2 hours ago, missmuffet said:

Can you define to me what systemic manifestation of denominational pride is? Just dumb it down a bit for me

"Systemic manifestation" refers to the appearance or evidence of something that occurs throughout a whole system or organization.

• Systemic means it affects or is spread across an entire system, rather than being isolated to a specific part.

• Manifestation means the visible sign, result, or embodiment of something.

So, when we talk about a "systemic manifestation," we're referring to signs or outcomes that show up throughout an entire system or organization. 😊

"Denominational pride" refers to the belief promoted by certain denominations that their origin and operation excels and supersedes others. Advancement in such organisations is only possible through accepting and further promoting this belief.

[Who me]

Judging  others, something we automatically  do every time we meet someone, or see or hear someone a ,little out of the ordinary.

Something we automatically  do while driving.

The command not to judge is correctly stated to make a right judgement!

We are not to judge like Trump did, just because he wasn't  wearing  a suite. ( can't  spell his name )

 

Jesus said ' by their fruits you will know them'  That means assessing how they are living, judging them by the standards Jesus set and incidentally because we are judging by that standard, we too will be judg3d by that standard.