Age of the Earth

[spiritman]

Hi again,

Another thing that might help is to ask the question why after the genealogy back to Adam is so well documented, that is being the sixth day would we want to suddenly require for one day to be as a thousand years etc? What then would we do with the seventh?

I believe that by faith we must receive it as such.

We understand witches and such are able to effect lying wonders with varying degrees of magnitude, and that's darkness, why can't we accept that the God, who is light, be able to create as stated, and with eternal faithfulness?

Amen my brother

I would just like to add one more thing. I have been accused on this board of attacking others that do not hold my views.

But brothers and sisters, please understand, I'm being misunderstood. For what seems to be an attack, is actually my passion for the truth of the Gospel of Jesus Christ. In my heart I truely grieve because of some of the RIDICULOUS, and outrageous doctrine I have heard on here in the last couple of days. And then when I out of love and concern try to teach my brother the truth, get ganged up on, and shunned while my brother who is in error gets a pat on the back.

Paul talks plainly in the book of 2nd timothy on the matter of false doctrine:

2 Tim 2:15-26 (NASB) 15 Be diligent to present yourself approved to God as a workman who does not need to be ashamed, accurately handling the word of truth.16 But avoid worldly and empty chatter, for it will lead to further ungodliness,

17 and their talk will spread like gangrene . Among them are Hymenaeus and Philetus,

18 men who have gone astray from the truth saying that the resurrection has already taken place, and they upset the faith of some.19 Nevertheless, the firm foundation of God stands, having this seal, "The Lord knows those who are His," and, "Everyone who names the name of the Lord is to abstain from wickedness."

20 Now in a large house there are not only gold and silver vessels, but also vessels of wood and of earthenware, and some to honor and some to dishonor.

21 Therefore, if anyone cleanses himself from these things, he will be a vessel for honor, sanctified, useful to the Master, prepared for every good work.

22 Now flee from youthful lusts and pursue righteousness, faith, love and peace, with those who call on the Lord from a pure heart.

23 But refuse foolish and ignorant speculations, knowing that they produce quarrels .

24 The Lord's bond-servant must not be quarrelsome, but be kind to all, able to teach, patient when wronged,

25 with gentleness correcting those who are in opposition, if perhaps God may grant them repentance leading to the knowledge of the truth,

26 and they may come to their senses and escape from the snare of the devil, having been held captive by him to do his will.

My concerns are highlighted in red: Paul calls those in false doctrine snared by the devil, and for everyone to avoid Speculations. Not to mention, that the false doctrine will spread like gangrene. I have also heard the comment, that oh (my brother said this); This doctrine we are discussing is so trival that it will not affect our salvation. However we see in verse 18 above, that trival doctrine of some believing that the resurrection had already happend, paul was concerned that those with less knowlege will suffer a ship wreck of their faith. And so was my concern, that those watching this discussion, might get an inaccurate conclusion.

I love my brother; (I promised him I would no longer use his name); And truely was reaching out to him. not out of pride or arrogance, but love, to bring him to the truth. If some of you want to think that showing who's the smartest on these scriptures is top priority than that's between you and God. But I will be watching out for my brothers and sisters, not my reptuation.

I don't hold any grudges against anyone here for things done in the past or ever. If any here have any I suggest we dump them in the sea as far as the east is from the west.

In His Love always

Spiritman

[spiritman]

It baffles me how the bible can cause so many to scrap.

I think it is becasue of the passion in the Word, and one's convictions of his interpretation.

I've seen worse over football games.

As far as this particular thread - please keep the discussion on the issue and not on one another.

Thanks, fellas.

Thank you traveller I was ending my partipation in this thread anyway.

Peace to you brother

Traveller Peace to you my sister and may God truely bless you

[psalmone]

Hi again,

Another thing that might help is to ask the question why after the genealogy back to Adam is so well documented, that is being the sixth day would we want to suddenly require for one day to be as a thousand years etc? What then would we do with the seventh?

I believe that by faith we must receive it as such.

We understand witches and such are able to effect lying wonders with varying degrees of magnitude, and that's darkness, why can't we accept that the God, who is light, be able to create as stated, and with eternal faithfulness?

Amen my brother

I would just like to add one more thing. I have been accused on this board of attacking others that do not hold my views.

But brothers and sisters, please understand, I'm being misunderstood. For what seems to be an attack, is actually my passion for the truth of the Gospel of Jesus Christ. In my heart I truely grieve because of some of the RIDICULOUS, and outrageous doctrine I have heard on here in the last couple of days. And then when I out of love and concern try to teach my brother the truth, get ganged up on, and shunned while my brother who is in error gets a pat on the back.

Paul talks plainly in the book of 2nd timothy on the matter of false doctrine:

2 Tim 2:15-26 (NASB) 15 Be diligent to present yourself approved to God as a workman who does not need to be ashamed, accurately handling the word of truth.16 But avoid worldly and empty chatter, for it will lead to further ungodliness,

17 and their talk will spread like gangrene . Among them are Hymenaeus and Philetus,

18 men who have gone astray from the truth saying that the resurrection has already taken place, and they upset the faith of some.19 Nevertheless, the firm foundation of God stands, having this seal, "The Lord knows those who are His," and, "Everyone who names the name of the Lord is to abstain from wickedness."

20 Now in a large house there are not only gold and silver vessels, but also vessels of wood and of earthenware, and some to honor and some to dishonor.

21 Therefore, if anyone cleanses himself from these things, he will be a vessel for honor, sanctified, useful to the Master, prepared for every good work.

22 Now flee from youthful lusts and pursue righteousness, faith, love and peace, with those who call on the Lord from a pure heart.

23 But refuse foolish and ignorant speculations, knowing that they produce quarrels .

24 The Lord's bond-servant must not be quarrelsome, but be kind to all, able to teach, patient when wronged,

25 with gentleness correcting those who are in opposition, if perhaps God may grant them repentance leading to the knowledge of the truth,

26 and they may come to their senses and escape from the snare of the devil, having been held captive by him to do his will.

My concerns are highlighted in red: Paul calls those in false doctrine snared by the devil, and for everyone to avoid Speculations. Not to mention, that the false doctrine will spread like gangrene. I have also heard the comment, that oh (my brother said this); This doctrine we are discussing is so trival that it will not affect our salvation. However we see in verse 18 above, that trival doctrine of some believing that the resurrection had already happend, paul was concerned that those with less knowlege will suffer a ship wreck of their faith. And so was my concern, that those watching this discussion, might get an inaccurate conclusion.

I love my brother; (I promised him I would no longer use his name); And truely was reaching out to him. not out of pride or arrogance, but love, to bring him to the truth. If some of you want to think that showing who's the smartest on these scriptures is top priority than that's between you and God. But I will be watching out for my brothers and sisters, not my reptuation.

I don't hold any grudges against anyone here for things done in the past or ever. If any here have any I suggest we dump them in the sea as far as the east is from the west.

In His Love always

Spiritman

Gbu Spiritman. I am most pleased that you were blessed by the above information as I myself was to happen upon those revelations. I agree with you that such information is important with regards to the strength of our faith and I agree that you were right to be concerned. I understand your wanting to edify our bretheren with the vital truth so that they may strong in the truth that sets free. May you also be blessed and comforted as you have sought to minister comfort to others.

[psalmone]

Greetings again. I don't wish to dwell on things excessively but there is an interesting article that addresses the fall of satan with a different angle to what I have heard preached. I understand that there is still debate and speculation on the subject, but the article was quite substantial in my opinion.

It states that satan wasn't felled between Genisis 1 and 2 because he was in the garden probably still as the anointed cherub, and that he was possibly commissioned to minister to Adam and Eve until he maybe envied the attention they were getting and proceeded in tempting them. This was possibly the point where iniquity was found in Him and the judgement which followed could have been that fall with all that was related to it.

The original article might be found here

[Guest Honolulu-Dad]

Some of you just crack me up. Especially spiritman. Poor you!!!! roflol

Get real!!!!

[Guest Honolulu-Dad]

A quote from spiritman:

"I would just like to add one more thing. I have been accused on this board of attacking others that do not hold my views.

But brothers and sisters, please understand, I'm being misunderstood. For what seems to be an attack, is actually my passion for the truth of the Gospel of Jesus Christ. In my heart I truely grieve because of some of the RIDICULOUS, and outrageous doctrine I have heard on here in the last couple of days. And then when I out of love and concern try to teach my brother the truth, get ganged up on, and shunned while my brother who is in error gets a pat on the back."

End quote.

As any of you, who have been following this thread are aware, I am the brother of whom spiritman is referring to. Now, the truth is, I believe something different than spiritman, and that is totally unacceptable to him. He has called me a liar because I submitted scripture that supports my position on the original topic, something he has yet to do.

He says he has not attacked me. He has only acted out of his "passion" for his belief. However, if you read the entire thread, you will discover that someone other than spiritman offered that as a reason for people defending there beliefs. Spiritman has simply decided to use that persons' idea as his own without giving that person credit. Typical.

He justifies his pride and arrogance by using the scripture which reads; "Avoid foolish and unlearned questions knowing that they do gender strifes." (KJV)

Sadly, he has failed to avoid what he would call "foolish". Rather, he launches an attack against someone whom, in order to make himself look innocent, calls a 'brother'. I wonder what motivates him to do the opposite of the very scriptures he posts, such as:

2 Tim. 2:23 But refuse foolish and ignorant speculations, knowing that they produce quarrels.

This entire thread is based upon speculation. Although, anyone can use scripture to support the position they take. The Bible does not give, in a single verse of scripture, the answer to the question posed by Bill C.11, to which I responded and subsequently came under attack by spiritman. Neither does it tell us, in a single verse, when Satan fell from Heaven. Therefore, one must study, which I have, and then make a speculation.

I find myself wondering how long he will continue to conduct himself in such manner.

I have not attempted to persuade anyone that they should follow in my beliefs. I simply answered a question with what I believe, based on indepth Bible study, and still, the relentless persuit of spiritman continues.

Another quote from spiritman:

"I love my brother; (I promised him I would no longer use his name); And truely was reaching out to him. not out of pride or arrogance, but love, to bring him to the truth. If some of you want to think that showing who's the smartest on these scriptures is top priority than that's between you and God. But I will be watching out for my brothers and sisters, not my reptuation."

He promised me he would no longer use my name. Actually, that is a lie. I asked him to quit using my name when he was addressing his post to someone else. I suppose I did not spell it out clearly enough for his intellect, so, he continues to attack me - just without using my name. A tactic of a wolf in sheeps clothing.

He goes on to claim that his attacks against me are for the purpose of "reaching out to me", while, at the same time, discouraging the reader from perhaps thinking he is arrogant and full of pride. Again, a tactic used by a wolf.

I have made it very clear that I do not care if spiritman agrees with me or not. I have absolutely no intent to persuade anyone to follow my belief, thus, disfuting his accusation that I am a false teacher. I have simply stated what I believe and offered scripture that supports my belief.

I also told spiritman very clearly that every time he says something about me in his slanderous way - I will rebuke him.

He needs to stop. It is one thing to state a difference of opinion - it is an entirely different thing to maintain an attack on someones character, that you don't even know. Falsely accusing and wrongfully judging people do not constitute stateing a difference of opinion.

I pray that God will help me to forgive spiritman for, well, his cowardly way. At the moment I am having a difficult time doing so. Perhaps if he will just STOP already!

[MorningGlory]

A quote from spiritman:

"I would just like to add one more thing. I have been accused on this board of attacking others that do not hold my views.

But brothers and sisters, please understand, I'm being misunderstood. For what seems to be an attack, is actually my passion for the truth of the Gospel of Jesus Christ. In my heart I truely grieve because of some of the RIDICULOUS, and outrageous doctrine I have heard on here in the last couple of days. And then when I out of love and concern try to teach my brother the truth, get ganged up on, and shunned while my brother who is in error gets a pat on the back."

End quote.

As any of you, who have been following this thread are aware, I am the brother of whom spiritman is referring to. Now, the truth is, I believe something different than spiritman, and that is totally unacceptable to him. He has called me a liar because I submitted scripture that supports my position on the original topic, something he has yet to do.

He says he has not attacked me. He has only acted out of his "passion" for his belief. However, if you read the entire thread, you will discover that someone other than spiritman offered that as a reason for people defending there beliefs. Spiritman has simply decided to use that persons' idea as his own without giving that person credit. Typical.

He justifies his pride and arrogance by using the scripture which reads; "Avoid foolish and unlearned questions knowing that they do gender strifes." (KJV)

Sadly, he has failed to avoid what he would call "foolish". Rather, he launches an attack against someone whom, in order to make himself look innocent, calls a 'brother'. I wonder what motivates him to do the opposite of the very scriptures he posts, such as:

2 Tim. 2:23 But refuse foolish and ignorant speculations, knowing that they produce quarrels.

This entire thread is based upon speculation. Although, anyone can use scripture to support the position they take. The Bible does not give, in a single verse of scripture, the answer to the question posed by Bill C.11, to which I responded and subsequently came under attack by spiritman. Neither does it tell us, in a single verse, when Satan fell from Heaven. Therefore, one must study, which I have, and then make a speculation.

I find myself wondering how long he will continue to conduct himself in such manner.

I have not attempted to persuade anyone that they should follow in my beliefs. I simply answered a question with what I believe, based on indepth Bible study, and still, the relentless persuit of spiritman continues.

Another quote from spiritman:

"I love my brother; (I promised him I would no longer use his name); And truely was reaching out to him. not out of pride or arrogance, but love, to bring him to the truth. If some of you want to think that showing who's the smartest on these scriptures is top priority than that's between you and God. But I will be watching out for my brothers and sisters, not my reptuation."

He promised me he would no longer use my name. Actually, that is a lie. I asked him to quit using my name when he was addressing his post to someone else. I suppose I did not spell it out clearly enough for his intellect, so, he continues to attack me - just without using my name. A tactic of a wolf in sheeps clothing.

He goes on to claim that his attacks against me are for the purpose of "reaching out to me", while, at the same time, discouraging the reader from perhaps thinking he is arrogant and full of pride. Again, a tactic used by a wolf.

I have made it very clear that I do not care if spiritman agrees with me or not. I have absolutely no intent to persuade anyone to follow my belief, thus, disfuting his accusation that I am a false teacher. I have simply stated what I believe and offered scripture that supports my belief.

I also told spiritman very clearly that every time he says something about me in his slanderous way - I will rebuke him.

He needs to stop. It is one thing to state a difference of opinion - it is an entirely different thing to maintain an attack on someones character, that you don't even know. Falsely accusing and wrongfully judging people do not constitute stateing a difference of opinion.

I pray that God will help me to forgive spiritman for, well, his cowardly way. At the moment I am having a difficult time doing so. Perhaps if he will just STOP already!

It's sad that most discussions on the true meaning of Scripture descend into name calling, character assassination, and mud slinging. Why not just agree to disagree? Neither of you is an Apostle; you are speaking from your view and nothing else. Both of you are trying to get others to side with you in your perceived grievances.....frankly, it's a big bore. That being said, I hope that you two bury the hatchet and proceed with discussion....tearing down your brother is a losing proposition, no matter how 'right' you think you are, IMHO.

[traveller]

Everyone needs to discuss the issues at hand and stop attacking each other. We're family here - act like it please.

Last warning.

[BlindSeeker]

2Co 3:1 Do we begin again to commend ourselves? or need we, as some others, epistles of commendation to you, or letters of commendation from you?

2 Ye are our epistle written in our hearts, known and read of all men:rr

Sweet Sister,

Paul addressing the Corinthians stated he did not need proof of his ministry to them . . . that they were in fact proof enough. Yet when someone like spirit man comes along stating his opinion as absolute fact they need to be challenged. Nowhere did Spiritman engage in reasoning, rather a constant presentation of "how it really is."

I failed to see were Spiritman ever entered the conversation as an equal to anyone while reasoning his view. I do believe he made pharisaical jabs at Honolulu dad . . .

You know I enjoy a hearty discussion about the things of God, but I purposely step back from this discussion (somewhat

Edited July 12, 2008 by BlindSeeker

[HAZARD]

Brothers and Sisters,

This question came up in chat today, (July 3, 2008):

Accoding to the Bible, starting with Adam, mankind is approx 6,000 years old according to the Hebrew calender. so then How much older is the Earth compared to Man? Is it 4 days older, or is it much older as stated by the verse, 2Pe 3:8 "But do not let this one fact escape your notice, beloved, that with the Lord one day is like a thousand years, and a thousand years like one day."?

Your comments would be appreciated.

Love In Christ,

Bill_C.11

Something I like to share on that; 1,000 years to man is but a day to God. In our time frame that means in God's time we lived 18 minutes from birth to death.

Many Bible students are led to believe that a day can mean a year and a year can mean a day in Bible prophecy. This theory is purley of human origin based upon the fact that God punished men forty years according to the number of days the spies searched Canaan (Num.13:25; 14:34) and according to the number of days Ezekiel lay upon his side (Ezek. 4:1-13). Men have used this as a basis of changing a day to a year or a year to a day in Scripture as their fancy lead them. This has led to innumerable fallacies concerning Bible dates and prophetical truths. There is no basis for such a theory, for in the above cases a day always means a day and a year always means a year. And so it is in all Scripture. Forty days will always be forty days and not forty years, and to deviate from this fact is only foolish human reasoning.

Haz.