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If silence was a sound it would be my favorite. I like the sound the ocean makes when it washes up and down the shore..

Joseph is a type of Christ, in respect of two advents. (Gen 37:3 - 4.) At his first advent Jesus was hated by the majority of the Jews, and they disposed of Him. (Gen 37:27 - 28, & Gen 37:36) But look what happened, (Gen 41:40 - 42.) And then, (Gen 41:29 - 30, & Gen 42:1-3.) But they did not recognise Joseph their brother, (Gen 42:6 & 8.) But then, (Gen 45:3 to 8, & Gen 45:13 - 15.) Which is how it will be when Jesus returns to for the second advent Bless you all. Edwin..

If security is such a priority for the 1st family, then I believe it would be in the best interests of the US to grant them only authorized vacation locations. Such as Camp David. You cannot seek the office of President, then just expect to live life normally at everyone else's expense. No one is forced to run for President. This is a gross abuse and misuse of the treasury.

There are two answers. One... anyone can say they are a Christian. But do they follow him, love him, or even believe in who he says he is. Two...Christian are flawed human beans, sinners. We have to study Gods word and grow into Christian maturity. We make mistakes along the way. I try not to judge wether someone is the first or second. But it would help more come to Christ if we could be more mature Christians and love others as we should.

Blessings Shiloh.... Praise the Lord,right on & to the point,just like Jesus said,"if these things were not so I would have told you" & as the Lord is never changing.......if God were trying to fit 15 billion years into 6days,He would have said so.......but He did not!!!!!!Amen,brother,Amen! With love,in Christ-Kwik

Shiloh, I still believe the best study you have ever given on Genesis 1 was in looking for the spiritual meaning and significance to the passage. Trying to interpet Genesis 1 from a perspective it was never written in, nor interpreted from until maybe 600 years ago (the western scientific perspective) is producing more fruit of headaches and hurt feelings than it is advancing the Gospel. But finding the Gospel in Genesis 1 - WOW! That was mind-blowing.

You cannot take a quote Dr. Schroeder used from someone else who may have practiced a considerably different form of Kabbalah and make it to what we understand about Kabbalah today, which is definitely occultic. Back centuries ago it did not take this form. Besides they are referencing certain points of Hebrew to support a point that was made. The point is not these older sages but the truth of starlight and time. The science behind the Bible. G-d is the greatest scientist. He was the one who put into effect the laws of the universe - starlight, time, speed of light, thermodyanmics, gravity, speed of sound, etc. He does not even compromise His own laws. When we read more about the science of starlight and time we can see that the six day 24-hour creation and the billions of years of age to the universe can both be true. This is the essence of Hebrew block logic. You do not need to mentally check out of science to believe the Bible. Science actually proves the Bible and thereby proves the existence of G-d. Science is all through the Bible. The Hubble telescope and space probes have actually given us a true glimpse of how stars, planets, asteroids, etc. are actually being created and died. G-d is always creating. The laws He set into effect are still at work to this very day. Baruch HaShem!

Prophetic types / ante-types The Bible is full of them. John 5:39-40 (NASB95) 39 “You search the Scriptures because you think that in them you have eternal life; it is these that testify about Me; 40 and you are unwilling to come to Me so that you may have life. Luke 24:27 (NASB95) 27 Then beginning with Moses and with all the prophets, He explained to them the things concerning Himself in all the Scriptures. That must have been one big / eye opening Bible study!

So it looks like Satan has been trolling Worthy. Get thee behind me...... We need to find his ISP address and ban him.

Like the cute commercial says - "Have you eaten today? You seem a bit grouchy." Time for my lunch now. I know I will feel better after I have eaten. Seriously, though, satan knows his time is short. It is true .... he is out to devour whom he can and if we allow this, he will use us to devour each other! Let us remember to always put on love and walk in the Spirit. We must resist the temptation to retaliate in harsh words, for "A soft answer does turn away wrath." I have seen what appears to be the lack of love or compassion and I'm working on my own walk in Christ to be sure that I walk in His love. I know it isn't always easy, just something we must do. PTL We fight against the flesh and pride daily. We must discipline ourselves to be humble and to count others in higher regard. Let us all be more respectful of each other and if we have to, just walk away before we are tempted to speak from the flesh. It is a praying way and this topic is something I have been praying about for some time now. God hears our prayers and He answers them. Hallelujah! I see love coming down on us like a gentle rain. Praise God! Thank you for bringing this to my attention. I will work harder to love more and argue less. More of Jesus .... less of me Holy Spirit .... let it be. Amen! Always in His care, Peace to you, PrairWarur 1 Peter 5 New American Standard Bible (NASB) Serve God Willingly 5 Therefore, I exhort the elders among you, as your fellow elder and witness of the sufferings of Christ, and a partaker also of the glory that is to be revealed, 2 shepherd the flock of God among you, exercising oversight not under compulsion, but voluntarily, according to the will of God; and not for sordid gain, but with eagerness; 3 nor yet as lording it over those allotted to your charge, but proving to be examples to the flock. 4 And when the Chief Shepherd appears, you will receive the unfading crown of glory. 5 You younger men, likewise, be subject to your elders; and all of you, clothe yourselves with humility toward one another, for God is opposed to the proud, but gives grace to the humble. 6 Therefore humble yourselves under the mighty hand of God, that He may exalt you at the proper time, 7 casting all your anxiety on Him, because He cares for you. 8 Be of sober spirit, be on the alert. Your adversary, the devil, prowls around like a roaring lion, seeking someone to devour. 9 But resist him, firm in your faith, knowing that the same experiences of suffering are being accomplished by your brethren who are in the world. 10 After you have suffered for a little while, the God of all grace, who called you to His eternal glory in Christ, will Himself perfect, confirm, strengthen and establish you. 11 To Him be dominion forever and ever. Amen.

Christians are imperfect just like anybody else.

I think for me, I need to pray before I answer or post here, just as I need to in real life. I am to show love to others, and in doing so, I need to let God show me what they are saying. I've seen many christians, including myself be hammered for using one, wrong word when I didn't mean what they thought at all. I am not perfect and I am not some meticulous, studious person, I am average at best, I make lots of mistakes. But I just would rather give someone the benefit of the doubt especially in online forums. And if there is correction needed then I am to do that with love to, or if I question what they post, ask it in a loving manner. God bless, Denise

Yes, this is what I saw when I read Edwin's post:) And it's so true, I'm amazed by all the little glimpses of our Messiah in the OT, and not that Joseph, Moses or anyone else "was" Jesus at all, you are right, there is only ONE Jesus;) and yes PRAISE HIS HOLY NAME:) denise, a sister in Christ

The Bible doesn't say that Genesis 1:1-2 occurred in the dateless past. That is YOUR baseless assumption. Verse 1 is nothing more than synopsis of the creative process. Verse 1 tells us that God created the heavens and earth. Verse 2 'till the end of the chapter is an elucidation or expanded explanation of verse one. That is what the Hebrew allows for, and I have chosen to believe the Bible and what it says. You can't simply brush the Heberw grammar aside. To do so means that you are not dealing honestly with the text. Many experts in Hebrew have translated the bible to mean that the earth existed in darkness before the first daylight. This is what a straightforward reading of the text says. You are choosing to believe what the Hebrew "allows for" above what is the most obvious interpretation. By doing so you are contradicting your own principle of accepting the bible at face value. Honestly the bible is not YEC, the earth existed for an unknown period before the first daylight, if we take the bible at its most literal and face value interpretation that you seem to be so committed to. The rest of the days are literal days, and so about 6000 years ago God created life, but I cannot be an honest bible literalist and believe YEC, I believe the YEC stance contradicts the face value understanding of the bible text.

Time out- there are other alternatives too. For instance, what if the 4.5 billion years was how long it was before God did his creation thing starting in Genesis 1.3. Remember, in the beginning (dateless past) God created the heavens and the earth. THEN the earth was formless and void..... Why can't all this be 4.5 billion years?

Great words of admonition my sister. I will ponder them, especially because they came from your lips. Errrrr, or from your fingertips.

Lots to ponder upon and consider at length: thank you!

yes I have to go to several places for analyzing or reading deeper in a scripture and find its meaning.

Blessings to All, My God,Oh my God.........Send Your Comforter to this widow & the people of this Christian community & the Strong Arm of the Lord.....Heavenly Father in Jesus Name place Your Hedge of Protection around our Nigerian brothers & sisters.... My heart aches to think of the suffering these people live with....something that is so foreign to people like me living in America.So many Christians don't "feel like" going to church or are "too busy" for Wednesday Bible Study and take for granted "freedom of religion" & that we are free to worship God Almighty without reprocussion or opposition & here are these people who live worship God and risk their very lives & have now lost that PRIVILEGE of doing so a in fellowship as a Body of Believers........what a tragedy. With love,in Christ-Kwik

Blessings Hall..... Shall we talk about the most annoying sounds we hear....if DRS does not mind?For me its the lawn maintenance people blowing leaves & mowing the lawn by the bedroom window early Saturday morning or by the living room just as you are dying to find out who-done-it at the end of a good mystery movie & just as the detective declares who the villian is at the very end ....vvvvv.vvvvvrrrrrrrmmmmm-lol With love,in Christ-Kwik

Blessings Flame... Not to mention the sounds of the horses excitement when you come into the barn at sunrise to feed,the rusting & snorting & whinnying & moments later just hearing them at play when you turn them out....the thundering sound of a full gallop or the music of a happy canter.......I could listen to those sounds for hours on end................ And I love to hear the roosters crow,Hall....but then again it was probably because it was not what woke me up,I was up & busy at the barn before they even awoke-lol With love,in Christ -Kwik

I appreciate your concerns, GW, but you should know that I'm not the one who is searching for these answers. In post #8 I gave a nutshell version of what I believe will happen to not only those who are ready and go in the rapture, but also those who are left and become martyrs afterward, while also identifying who the sheep are that are separated from the goats at His second coming at the end of the age. I also know who those men are that will seek death, but death will flee from them. No other theory that I'm aware of even attempts to identify who these men are and/or why they won't be able to die. It's amazing what we can find when we remove the assumptions and myths. If you want to continue this discussion, then answer the questions I asked you in the previous post....Who is Christ warning to be ready? Who are the two in the field and the two women grinding in the mill? Who are the ten virgins? Who are those that received talents? These questions must be answered if you're going to understand the rapture. But I get the feeling that you are one that believes Matt. 24 is the second coming. If so, it is not workable. Just take the two in the field, one was taken and the other left, for example... I see people arguing all the time, over which one of these was the evil one. Either way, it does not work if you think this is the second coming and God's wrath. If you say the one that was taken was raptured and the one that was left was swept away and destroyed, then who will be left to re-populate the earth and who will the saints reign over in the millennium? There won't be anyone left. On the other hand, if you say those taken were destroyed, then those that were left will remain on the earth, but what about the rapture? Both of these scenarios have holes. The only possible way this makes sense at all, is when both are saints, while one is the faithful servant that was ready, and the other was the lazy servant that gets caught unaware of His masters coming for them. You may not see it this way, but this mystery is already solved as far as I'm concerned. There are no holes here. And I really don't mind if you disagree, that's no problem at all. You're free to work it out your own way. Sorry, but I don't have the foggiest idea of what you're talking about here. I will never be a date setter, for no one can know the day and hour. I won't even try to predict the year. All I can say is keep a very close eye on the scriptures. We'll know when the time is getting near. I do know that the rapture and second coming are not the same event. Those who are ready and go in the rapture, these will be going to the wedding supper (read Luke 12:35-48 to prove this). Now if you want to know about the second coming and the Day of the Lord wrath, (read Matt. 25:31-46). The goats, those who destroy the earth will be killed and the sheep will enter into the millennial kingdom. I can not and will not be able to tell you how far apart the rapture and second coming are, and I don't believe anyone else can answer that question either. Cheers

I do not go around to abortion clinics and scream murderers. But if I am asked if it is murder, I will say so. I think it is harsh to turn around and condemn a believer for daring to say yes it is murder. No matter what the circumstances, it is murder.

As christians we have authority to test the spirits and their teachings. If you question a person's beliefs, always go back to scripture. The Word of God HAS to be the focal point. When the Word is your center point, just allow the Holy Spirit to guide you.

I've noticed this also. It is fun finding all the types and pictures of bible stuff

So was Issac a forshadow of Jesus All the prophets pointed to Jesus Moses and Job also Good point you made take care I understand where you coming from

OK, you guys are confusing me. I've heard of "types of Christ" for decades in sermons and such. (http://www.bible-topics.com/Types-of-Christ.html) Why is there suddenly a problem with this word "type"?

"Muffled silence" sounds like a good description! Yes, it is. There's something calming and beautiful about it, isn't it?

So the Earth was without form for how long? Before the first day, it could have been without form for billions of years (or not).

Blessings paredwin I understand what I think you are trying to say,that Joseph was dipicted as a foreshadow of Christ to come.......or a representation of the promised seed,of course we know there is only ONE JESUS.....but the Old Testament indeed proclaims the eager anticipation of the Messiahs arrival & speaks of Him throughout ,just as Jesus explained to the men as they walked together down the road after He was risen from the dead................How beautiful it must have been to have Jesus take them through the Scriptures.......Praise Jesus!!!! With love,in Christ-Kwik

All I am doing is drawing attention to Old Testament pictures of Him who was to come.

i love the sounds of the sea too.

Ever been outside while it is snowing, with an inch or more of snow already on the ground? It has a very unique sound of silence. yea a very mute sound of the snow falling, very unique sound indeed.

Ah yes... Gerold Schroeder and his time dilation theory. Has anyone read his book? It really isn't all that impressive when you get into the more detailed information contained in his book. It is really nothing more than a variation on the day-age hypothesis. This is because he is also an evolutionist. The comment he makes about having two clocks, one on earth and one some other place in the universe where 15 billion years on earth is only 6 days in another part of the universe, doesn't really jive with Genesis because God isn't in another part of the universe where time is passing by at such a blinding rate of speed. He is hovering over the earth in Gen. 1:2 Furthermore the narrator perspective of Genesis 1 is that of a person standing on the earth watching everything happening around him. It is not written from the perspective of someone looking at the events of creation from some distant location that would make 15 billion years feel like six days. The narrator is giving his description as if he is experiencing it in real time, six days. Also I would point that Schroeder, in his book and in this article, gives various erroneous and incorrect definitions of Hebrew words. Here is what he says in the article: "Nachmanides says the text uses the words "Vayehi Erev" ― but it doesn't mean "there was evening." He explains that the Hebrew letters Ayin, Resh, Bet ― the root of "erev" ― is chaos. Mixture, disorder. That's why evening is called "erev", because when the sun goes down, vision becomes blurry. The literal meaning is "there was disorder." The Torah's word for "morning" ― "boker" ― is the absolute opposite. When the sun rises, the world becomes "bikoret", orderly, able to be discerned. That's why the sun needn't be mentioned until Day Four. Because from erev to boker is a flow from disorder to order, from chaos to cosmos. That's something any scientist will testify never happens in an unguided system. Order never arises from disorder spontaneously and remains orderly. Order always degrades to chaos unless the environment recognizes the order and locks it in to preserve it. There must be a guide to the system. That's an unequivocal statement." ~Schroeder What needs to be pointed out is that the Rabbis in these commentaries like Nachmanides and RASHI and the RAMBAM are adding the mystical kabalistic meaning to these words. The Rabbis in using PARDES method of hermeneutics view the Scriptures as being layered with meanings. The "meaning" of a text isn't what you read. The meaning of the text is "mystical" and is only discovered by peeling back the many layers and this is done through kabalistic interpretation. So what they consider "literal" means something totally different to the way that we mean literal. He is applying the mystical rendering of Erev when he claims it means chaos. It doesn't mean chaos. It is never used to mean chaos. In Jerusalem and in Jewish communities all over the world, Jewish people will wish someone "erev tov" or "boker tov" which mean "good evening" or "good morning." "Erev" is never used in the sense it is used in Genesis 1 to mean "chaos" in normal usage like what we see in Genesis 1. Nor does boker mean, ":order." That is the application of an irrelevant mystical, dare a I say, occultic approach to the text. Kabbalah is occultic. So This article, despite Spock's claims, is NOT the "other side." Schroeder is not an Hebraist. He is not a scholar of Hebrew. He is a physicist at MIT. So to present an article about time dilation as a refutation of a Hebrew scholar is rather laughable and doesn't really counter anything stated by Wang's article presented in the OP. I would like to return the thread to the topic of my OP. Please continue the discussion of the different branches of science in another thread. Here is my previous response to Schroeder article which someone mistakenly thought was a rebuttal to a scholar of the Hebrew language. You make me laugh, Shiloh. Thanks! You question the Hebrew of a Jewish Ph.D who was raised Jewish and was raised on Hebrew from his childhood. Reads, speaks and writes Hebrew weekly and especially during Shabbat and study of the Torah. I would bet on a true one-on-one with him, he would win the Hebrew contest. Also, the old sages you referenced were not all into Kabbalistic thought. However, the Kabbalah of many centuries ago was not the occultic Kabbalah of today, (like Madonna practices). It was a more spiritual focus, looking for more tangible, spiritual experiences, somewhat like our charismatic movements of today.

Ever been outside while it is snowing, with an inch or more of snow already on the ground? It has a very unique sound of silence.

Yes; how better to get his claws into man than to convince said man that he is nonexistent? Few of us are wary of things that don't exist. Yep, if you don't believe in satan do you believe in God? It's complicated, but to believe in God one has to believe satan exists.(cause the bible says...)

Evangelism for me is a natural outpouring of the love I receive from God unto others. God truly is a part of everything and at least some aspect of God ends up in every conversation I have whether words are used or not.

Very inspiring! I've experienced the Holy Spirit talking through me, but didn't make the connection til now!

Hearts desire. Hearts desire. Hearts desire. God examines our heart and responds through His love when its inline with His. No self centered, no personal gains but a true desire to help others which points to relying on Him. Exactly as the way He designed it.

My personal view is that scripture says to preach the gospel. That means the gospel must be vocalized. In my experience, I have known a few people who were attracted to Christianity because they liked that the people they met were so friendly. These few people joined in, but at a time later, when things became difficult, they renounced Jesus. One had become very involved and ended up being offended by Christians. They were used as a 'poster child' of those who claimed they had been deceived by believers. Another said that Christians were not what they claimed. In these instances, the people were attracted to what they initially saw in Christians, but then were disappointed by Christians. I believe that these people never really accepted Jesus but rather were joining in with people who seemed to love one another, were a tight knit group, found the gatherings fun, but never really were drawn to or accepted Jesus. I know that I am likely to blow it at some point and disappoint those around me. If I am trying to look attractive, I will disappoint. But Jesus never disappoints. So I realized that I am not trying to attract people by my behavior, but I am trying to tell people about Jesus so they will come to Him, not me. I think if they come to Him and not me, when I disappoint, it should not effect their faith in Him, as they came to Him and not me. Gandhi said something about liking Jesus but not liking Christians. That is theoretically the reason he rejected Jesus, because of Christians. The truth is, if Jesus is the truth, and a person accepts the truth, they will follow Jesus, even though Christians are not perfect. And that is what Christianity is all about. Following and believing on Jesus. So, the gospel can not be preached without telling people about Who Jesus is and What He did. We do not have to be perfect in order to tell others about Jesus. I tend to be shy, and yes, I start out shaking, nervous, and fearful etc, when I intend to share the gospel. Somehow, once I start, the Holy Spirit meets me, and I discover, I become bold, which I know is not me.

Vengaturreino good post !