MorningGlory Posted November 6, 2009 Group: Royal Member Followers: 0 Topic Count: 1,022 Topics Per Day: 0.16 Content Count: 39,193 Content Per Day: 6.11 Reputation: 9,977 Days Won: 78 Joined: 10/01/2006 Status: Offline Share Posted November 6, 2009 Why can't we pray for the soul of a person who is dead? Once one has died their eternity has been determined and prayer can have no effect at all. We are to pray for the living, especially those who can still repent. I wish I could remember the Scripture for this. Where is Fresno Joe when we need him? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Smalcald Posted November 6, 2009 Group: Royal Member Followers: 0 Topic Count: 32 Topics Per Day: 0.00 Content Count: 5,258 Content Per Day: 0.76 Reputation: 42 Days Won: 3 Joined: 06/16/2005 Status: Offline Birthday: 07/22/1960 Share Posted November 6, 2009 Why can't we pray for the soul of a person who is dead? Once one has died their eternity has been determined and prayer can have no effect at all. We are to pray for the living, especially those who can still repent. I wish I could remember the Scripture for this. Where is Fresno Joe when we need him? Yeah I was just wanting some scriptural support. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Fez Posted November 6, 2009 Group: Royal Member Followers: 3 Topic Count: 683 Topics Per Day: 0.12 Content Count: 11,128 Content Per Day: 2.00 Reputation: 1,352 Days Won: 54 Joined: 02/03/2009 Status: Offline Birthday: 12/07/1952 Author Share Posted November 6, 2009 Why can't we pray for the soul of a person who is dead? Once one has died their eternity has been determined and prayer can have no effect at all. We are to pray for the living, especially those who can still repent. I wish I could remember the Scripture for this. Where is Fresno Joe when we need him? Yeah I was just wanting some scriptural support. Mat 22:31 And as for the resurrection of the dead, have you not read what was said to you by God: Mat 22:32 'I am the God of Abraham, and the God of Isaac, and the God of Jacob'? He is not God of the dead, but of the living." Rev 20:11 Then I saw a great white throne and him who was seated on it. From his presence earth and sky fled away, and no place was found for them. Rev 20:12 And I saw the dead, great and small, standing before the throne, and books were opened. Then another book was opened, which is the book of life. And the dead were judged by what was written in the books, according to what they had done. Rev 20:13 And the sea gave up the dead who were in it, Death and Hades gave up the dead who were in them, and they were judged, each one of them, according to what they had done. Rev 20:14 Then Death and Hades were thrown into the lake of fire. This is the second death, the lake of fire. Rev 20:15 And if anyone's name was not found written in the book of life, he was thrown into the lake of fire. I don't think this is what you are looking for, I think it is the scripture about the vision of people in hell and God being asked can we not pray for them and save them, and the answer was no. I will have another look and see if I can find it. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
MorningGlory Posted November 6, 2009 Group: Royal Member Followers: 0 Topic Count: 1,022 Topics Per Day: 0.16 Content Count: 39,193 Content Per Day: 6.11 Reputation: 9,977 Days Won: 78 Joined: 10/01/2006 Status: Offline Share Posted November 6, 2009 Why can't we pray for the soul of a person who is dead? Once one has died their eternity has been determined and prayer can have no effect at all. We are to pray for the living, especially those who can still repent. I wish I could remember the Scripture for this. Where is Fresno Joe when we need him? Yeah I was just wanting some scriptural support. I'll see if I can find it, Smalcald. I saw it not too long ago when I was looking for another Scripture. And here it is; from mountainretreatorg.net.... Hebrews 2:3 * "How shall we escape, if we neglect so great Salvation; which at the first began to be spoken by the Lord, and was confirmed unto us by them that heard him;" The retort to God by many seems to be, "we escape very easily if we can neglect Salvation in this world, and it is by men's prayers for us after we are in the grave!" That is in essence what this unbiblical doctrine of praying for the dead teaches. The humanistic reasoning of those who cannot bear to believe the truth about the death of loved ones or friends. But the Christian principle applies, "he who loves friends, father, or mother, more than Christ, is not worthy of Christ (Matthew 10:37)." Christ and His word come first, except we have left our first Love and replaced it with tradition. Matthew 8:21-22 * "And another of his disciples said unto him, Lord, suffer me first to go and bury my father. * But Jesus said unto him, Follow me; and let the dead bury their dead." Luke 9:59-60 * "And he said unto another, Follow me. But he said, Lord, suffer me first to go and bury my father. * Jesus said unto him, Let the dead bury their dead: but go thou and preach the kingdom of God." Should Christians pray for the dead? Jesus is not teaching the Church to be concerned for the dead, but just the opposite. He teaches that we not be concerned with the dead, and that we follow Him by tending to the living. we are to preach the gospel to them that are alive, for they are the ones who can and will benefit from it. The dead, as in the Parable of Lazarus and the Rich man, have already had their chance in life. Our prayers should tend to the living. In the whole of the Bible, both New Covenant and Old Covenant testimony, there exists not one single solitary example of true Children of God praying for, to, or with, the dead. For the souls of believers who die go to be with the Lord, and the souls of unbelievers live not again, until the last day, when they are raised up to stand for judgment. 2nd Corinthians 5:8-11 * "We are confident, I say, and willing rather to be absent from the body, and to be present with the Lord. * Wherefore we labor, that, whether present or absent, we may be accepted of him. * For we must all appear before the judgment seat of Christ; that every one may receive the things done in his body, according to that he hath done, whether it be good or bad. * Knowing therefore the terror of the Lord, we persuade men; but we are made manifest unto God; and I trust also are made manifest in your consciences." We labor of judgment is in this world, and we know that all must appear before the judgment seat and receive in himself the judgment of the things done in his body. Therefore, nothing can add to a man's good works after he has left the body. And except Christ paid for our bad works in life, we must pay for the bad works ourselves, after death. That is why the scriptures say, "knowing this, we persuade men." i.e., that's the reason we preach the gospel to persuade men while they are alive. Because we know of a surety the fate of those who neglect so great a salvation and die without conversion. Another theory of this Church is that, if man is assisted by prayer after this life is over, this is the result of the things he had done in the body, and therefore, these good works of others, are actually his. This is extremely convoluted and more than that, begs the question. Even if it were true (which it isn't, because it's not things "he" did in his body), it still fails to answer the fundamental question of payment for his bad works. In other words, what about his sin? No one is going to heaven for his good works, they go because of the good work of Christ. But unless one has been saved in this life, made righteous by the work of Christ, then he is destined for hell as judgment for his works on earth. That is a fundamental tenet of true Christianity. For a man's works, whether good (in Christ) or bad, follow Him. We must all stand before God to account for those works. The praying for someone after death cannot change a man's works, nor give him repentance unto salvation. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
georgedrw81 Posted November 7, 2009 Group: Royal Member Followers: 0 Topic Count: 7 Topics Per Day: 0.00 Content Count: 1,823 Content Per Day: 0.33 Reputation: 36 Days Won: 2 Joined: 04/10/2009 Status: Offline Share Posted November 7, 2009 Praying Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest Posted November 9, 2009 Share Posted November 9, 2009 Praying! Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Sir Gareth Posted November 9, 2009 Group: Senior Member Followers: 1 Topic Count: 73 Topics Per Day: 0.01 Content Count: 540 Content Per Day: 0.10 Reputation: 7 Days Won: 0 Joined: 02/11/2009 Status: Offline Birthday: 08/26/1980 Share Posted November 9, 2009 It shows how much you share Christ's desire to see sinners saved by what you said. I personally feel all you can do now is use this as an oppertunity to try and grow a closer relationship with his family so you may have an oppertunity to share the gospel with them. I will pray for his family and for you, God bless. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Prycejosh1987 Posted July 16, 2020 Group: Diamond Member Followers: 1 Topic Count: 1 Topics Per Day: 0.00 Content Count: 1,176 Content Per Day: 0.85 Reputation: 126 Days Won: 0 Joined: 07/07/2020 Status: Offline Birthday: 04/29/1987 Share Posted July 16, 2020 On 11/6/2009 at 7:45 PM, Fez said: An acquaintance of mine shot himself today. Â He committed suicide. He sent out an SMS, drove to a secluded corner of the reserve in which I work, a lovely cool wooded area alongside the estuary, and at about 3 pm, put his 9mm issue pistol to his head and shot himself. Â His name was Anton James; he left a wife and three children in their teens. We don Its stupid for a person to take their own life, when they are married with children. They have support and help all around them. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Peter Krishnan Posted October 1, 2020 Group: Non-Conformist Theology Followers: 3 Topic Count: 7 Topics Per Day: 0.00 Content Count: 55 Content Per Day: 0.03 Reputation: 11 Days Won: 0 Joined: 12/04/2019 Status: Offline Share Posted October 1, 2020 Depression can be deadly especially in the non religious . Suffering dark night of soul is especially traumatic to the faithless . Lack of hope, worth and help can be devastating . That is why it is better to be religious especially Christian, where God is loving, kind and compassionate, Jesus's grace is life saving and virtue can be learnt from the Bible . 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Figure of eighty Posted October 22, 2020 Group: Diamond Member Followers: 7 Topic Count: 243 Topics Per Day: 0.12 Content Count: 1,557 Content Per Day: 0.77 Reputation: 872 Days Won: 0 Joined: 10/15/2018 Status: Offline Share Posted October 22, 2020 On 11/6/2009 at 5:05 PM, Smalcald said: Why can't we pray for the soul of a person who is dead? Bc ita too late. Theyre at their destination already. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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