tsth

Understanding Job?

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Dear WXYZ,

I DO agree...as I came across several verses within Job that verify what you are posting...i.e.:

Eliphaz, more than any...Job 4:17-19 in contrast to Job speaking in 6:8-10 or

Eliphaz in 22:2-3 compared to Elihu(who was not rebuked) in 36:5-13. (Probably the most significant with regard to this issue!)

In His Love,

Suzanne

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Posted (edited)

GINOLJC, to all. haven't read all the post, but the few i have read was interesting. addressing something what the OP said, 

On 9/29/2004 at 10:17 AM, tsth said:

Ok, here is what I was lead to begin with:

Who are the players?

All study will be from the reading of God's Word. Quiet time in prayer. And then further research from reference sources:

Strongest Strongs (I have found that this version is a little more indepth than regular Strongs, so if you find discrepancies in this and your Strongs, that is why. They do not match identically.)

Nave's Topical Bible

Name meanings:

1. Job - #347 "where is my father" or perhaps Where is my father, O God?" Also means "hated".

(I found this to be very interesting, the root origin of this word for Job, comes from #340 which means, "to be an enemy" or "hostile")

I agree that the book of Job is a loaded book of information, especially on this man and his friends. what was revealed to me in this book about Job and his friends, right off the bat in the very first chapter and a few verses is the fact they are sons of God, scripture, Job 1:3 "His substance also was seven thousand sheep, and three thousand camels, and five hundred yoke of oxen, and five hundred she asses, and a very great household; so that this man was the greatest of all the men of the east". I have bold and red "men" here, because it's the Hebrew word, H1121 בֵּן ben (bane) n-m.
   בָּנִים baniym (ba-neem') [plural]
   בְּנִי bniy (ben-ee') [possessive singular]
   בָּנַי banay (baw-nah'ee) [possessive plural]
(used widely) a son (as a builder of the family name).
THIS IS THE EXACT SAME WORD USED IN GENESIS 6:2.  this man Job was not only a son of God as also the other men/sons of the east, but this man Job was also keeping the feast days of Deuteronomy 16:13-17. yes this book have a lot to reveal.

Edited by 101G
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On 9/29/2004 at 8:17 AM, tsth said:

Ok, here is what I was lead to begin with:

 

Who are the players?

 

All study will be from the reading of God's Word. Quiet time in prayer. And then further research from reference sources:

 

Strongest Strongs (I have found that this version is a little more indepth than regular Strongs, so if you find discrepancies in this and your Strongs, that is why. They do not match identically.)

Nave's Topical Bible

Name meanings:

 

1. Job - #347 "where is my father" or perhaps Where is my father, O God?" Also means "hated".    Brings to mind Christ's words on the cross "my God, my God, why have You forsaken me?"   This is how we sometimes feel when everything turns from bad to worse and even our friends stand in judgment of us, rubbing salt in our wounds.

(I found this to be very interesting, the root origin of this word for Job, comes from #340 which means, "to be an enemy" or "hostile")

 

2. Eliphaz - #464 "my God is (fine) gold" or God crushes    

1Pe 1:6  In this you rejoice, though now for a little while, if necessary, you have been grieved by various trials,  1Pe 1:7  so that the tested genuineness of your faith—more precious than gold that perishes though it is tested by fire—may be found to result in praise and glory and honor at the revelation of Jesus Christ.  1Pe 1:8  Though you have not seen him, you love him. Though you do not now see him, you believe in him and rejoice with joy that is inexpressible and filled with glory,  1Pe 1:9  obtaining the outcome of your faith, the salvation of your souls.

Refining removes impurities, crushes and tests for genuineness.  Its purpose is to prove the purity, not to prove it to be false.  

 

3. Bildad - #1085 Bildad = "confusing (by mingling) love"   Rom 12:9  Let love be genuine. Abhor what is evil; hold fast to what is good.  Rom 12:10  Love one another with brotherly affection. Outdo one another in showing honor.

1Co 13:4  Love is patient and kind; love does not envy or boast; it is not arrogant  1Co 13:5  or rude. It does not insist on its own way; it is not irritable or resentful;  1Co 13:6  it does not rejoice at wrongdoing, but rejoices with the truth.  1Co 13:7  Love bears all things, believes all things, hopes all things, endures all things.

Perhaps Bildad's love is not genuine.

4. Zophar - #6691 "sparrow" "peep" "twitter" - Qal) to go early, depart early-meaning dubious.  As a bird watcher I know what is meant by peeps and small birds that twitter in the trees.  They are best seen and heard early in the morning.  ON the negative side, they can have less insight.  Often a cowbird will lay an egg in the nest of a peep and wear it out raising this "adopted" bird.  They also may be irritating and noisy in their chatter to some who don't appreciate their song.

5. Elihu - #453 Elihu = "He is my God"   Elihu knew God intimately--enough to defend His actions to Job and to not question Him.

 

Will start with these.

 

In His Love,

Suzanne

Thank you for this opportunity to study in depth.

Willa

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I'm glad the post is being revisited.

 

:wub:

In His Love

Suzanne

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Something to keep in mind here: when God finally did speak and said: " Who is this that darkens counsel By words without knowledge?" (Job 38:1 NASB), God was addressing Job, but not just Job. Being that Job was the only one to openly repent of his words and attitudes, and that God said "It came about after the LORD had spoken these words to Job, that the LORD said to Eliphaz the Temanite, “My wrath is kindled against you and against your two friends, because you have not spoken of Me what is right as My servant Job has. “Now therefore, take for yourselves seven bulls and seven rams, and go to My servant Job, and offer up a burnt offering for yourselves, and My servant Job will pray for you. For I will accept him so that I may not do with you according to your folly, because you have not spoken of Me what is right, as My servant Job has.” So Eliphaz the Temanite and Bildad the Shuhite and Zophar the Naamathite went and did as the LORD told them; and the LORD accepted Job." (Job 42:7-9, NASB, emphasis mine)

When we read this, God was asking everyone but Elihu when He made his opening statement. Apparently, only Elihu spoke rightly in the encounter, while everyone else was off-base. But Job demonstrated that once confronted, he would humble himself and repent. The other three "didn't think God was talking to them". Job had asked for the Lord to judge him: God did. When confronted with that, Job acknowledged it and did the right thing.

One lesson i think we can take away from job is that sometimes we can either think ourselves righteous in our own strength, or look down on someone else and think we "know they must  have done something wrong" when ill health, misfortune or catastrophe strike. But when someone is going through such a time, the test may not be solely about them: we too  may be in the process of being tested, to show us out hearts and what lies within them. Are we willing to do as the Lord asks? Will we pass judgment on someone unfairly or claim they "deserved" their calamity somehow? Attitudes are contagious, and if our own are not in line with the kind of heart the Lord wants to create in us, we can end up becoming like Eliphaz and his friends.

A verse from the last passage:

"The LORD restored the fortunes of Job when he prayed for his friends, and the LORD increased all that Job had twofold. Then all his brothers and all his sisters and all who had known him before came to him, and they ate bread with him in his house; and they consoled him and comforted him for all the adversities that the LORD had brought on him. And each one gave him one piece of money, and each a ring of gold." (Job 41:10-11, NASB, emphasis mine)

This included Job's friends, who recognized their error in this incident, and held a man in trouble and despair in contempt. Before we decide to pass judgment on someone, Jesus advocated that we first "tend to the beam in our own eye". I think we see some of that here...

 

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On 9/29/2004 at 10:50 AM, tsth said:

I am compelled to go back to Job again. To study further. To ask, "what was it about Job?" What is significant about him? About Elihu? What is the lesson to learn? I have studied extensively and have had many questions answered about him, but the Lord brought me back again, to see what is relative to "today". What have I missed Lord? What did I not see about him, for you have taught me so much, but there is more. Job is presumably the first book of the Bible written. This is significant in itself I think. Here are my main questions to begin with.

 

1. What is "so significant" to learn about Job, as a person?

 

2. Why is Elihu "so significant"?

 

3. How does this Book relate/teach us regarding today's Christian?

 

I hope others would go with me in this study? But if not, that's ok, I just am lead to share what I find as I go.

 

In His Love,

Suzanne

1. Job trusted in the Lord even though he was going through an enormous pain.

2. Elihu was very wise--not like the three who condemns Job.

3. We can (and must) put our trust in the Lord when we are going through an enormous pain.

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On 9/29/2004 at 9:50 AM, tsth said:

I am compelled to go back to Job again. To study further. To ask, "what was it about Job?" What is significant about him? About Elihu? What is the lesson to learn? I have studied extensively and have had many questions answered about him, but the Lord brought me back again, to see what is relative to "today". What have I missed Lord? What did I not see about him, for you have taught me so much, but there is more. Job is presumably the first book of the Bible written. This is significant in itself I think. Here are my main questions to begin with.

 

1. What is "so significant" to learn about Job, as a person?

 

2. Why is Elihu "so significant"?

 

3. How does this Book relate/teach us regarding today's Christian?

 

I hope others would go with me in this study? But if not, that's ok, I just am lead to share what I find as I go.

 

In His Love,

Suzanne

I know there are many, many things within the book of Job for us to learn. The book of job saved me from false teachers and taught me a lesson about rightly dividing the Word. I was a young, impressionable believer and got involved with a study group super excited about meeting and studying. The Person teaching by fuzzy scriptures showed us every word in the bible Truth. So any verse or half verse or mixture of verses are truth. Before I got in this group i hade read Job and took from it the joy our adversity is just a drop of water in a bucket in comparison to the rewards we recieve. I would actually put One drop in my horses bucket then fill the bucket when I had bad days.

the people in the group stared teach weird stuff and speaking mixed verses of the bible say God had to do it and the devil had to obey because they were speaking Gods words like they were magical.

Anyway Holy Spirit started reminding me of things Jobs frirnd said and ask is that true? i'd answer No God said what they said about God was untrue. So i started an argument about there every word is true doctrin and used what the Holy Spirit was using to keep me straight. We ended up studing how to study. Learned that scripture interprates scripture and the sum of his word us truth. You have to take all of it into consideration.

So anyway. The Lord used Job and turned a group of young zealous christions away from a slippery slope of false teaching and doctrins.

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Thank you, Reinitin, for sharing this testimony....that is a very good thing!

 

In His Love,

Suzanne

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On 9/29/2004 at 7:50 AM, tsth said:

I am compelled to go back to Job again. To study further. To ask, "what was it about Job?" What is significant about him? About Elihu? What is the lesson to learn? I have studied extensively and have had many questions answered about him, but the Lord brought me back again, to see what is relative to "today". What have I missed Lord? What did I not see about him, for you have taught me so much, but there is more. Job is presumably the first book of the Bible written. This is significant in itself I think. Here are my main questions to begin with.

1. What is "so significant" to learn about Job, as a person?

2. Why is Elihu "so significant"?

.3. How does this Book relate/teach us regarding today's Christian?

I hope others would go with me in this study? But if not, that's ok, I just am lead to share what I find as I go.

In His Love,

Suzanne

1. What is "so significant" to learn about Job, as a person?  

Job was righteous in God's eyes in the beginning.  But his faith had not been tried.

Job 2:7 LITV And Satan went out from before the face of Jehovah. And he struck Job with bad burning ulcers from the sole of his foot to the top of his head. Job 2:8  And he took a broken piece of pottery with which to scrape himself. And he sat down among the ashes. Job 2:9  And his wife said to him, Are you still holding fast to your integrity? Bless God and die! Job 2:10  But he said to her, You speak as one of the foolish ones speak. Also, shall we receive good at the hand of God, and shall we not receive evil? In all this Job did not sin with his lips.

Job 32:1  And these three men rested from answering Job, because he was righteous in his own eyes.

When he was accused of sin and wrong doing by his 3 friends, Job failed the test: He wanted to argue his case before God to prove his own righteousness and that he had done nothing to deserve this punishment.  Since this was the accusation of his 3 friends, it is a tempting thing to do.  But it would have been better to let God vindicate him.  Self righteousness and self justification are grievous sins in God's eyes.  It is so human of us to ask "what have I done to deserve this? when we are full of pain and have lost everything we own as well as our family and friends.  

Job did repent when God showed him Himself and showed Job his sin.

Job 40:3  Then Job answered Jehovah and said:  Job 40:4  Behold, I am vile! What shall I answer You? I will put my hand to my mouth                                                             Job 42:5  I have heard of You by hearing of the ear, but now my eye has seen You;  Job 42:6  Therefore, I despise myself, and I have repented in dust and ashes.

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2. Why is Elihu "so significant"?  

 Elihu justified God.   Job 32:2  And then burned the wrath of Elihu the son of Barachel the Buzite, of the family of Ram; his wrath burned against Job, because he had justified himself rather than God. Job 32:3  Also his wrath burned against his three friends, because they had not found any answer, yet they had condemned Job.

Job 35:1 AMP  ELIHU SPOKE further [to Job] and said, Job 35:2  Do you think this is your right, or are you saying, My righteousness is more than God's,  Job 35:3  That you ask, What advantage have you? How am I profited more than if I had sinned?

Job 35:10 LITV But no one says, Where is God my Maker, who gives songs in the night, Job 35:11  teaching us more than the animals of the earth, and makes us wiser than the birds of the heavens?  Job 35:12  There they cry, but He does not answer, because of the pride of evildoers.

Job 36:22  Behold, God is exalted in His power. Who is a teacher like Him?  Job 36:23  Who has appointed Him His way; or who can say, You have done wrong?  Job 36:24  Remember that you magnify His work, of which men have sung;

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God's answer:   Job 40:1 LITV And Jehovah answered Job and said: Job 40:2  Shall a reprover contend with the Almighty? He who reproves God, let him answer it.                                                                                                        40:8  Will you also set aside My judgment; will you condemn Me so that you may be justified?   

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.3. How does this Book relate/teach us regarding today's Christian?  At times when we are helpless our world often shrinks and it becomes all about me.  God shows us our hearts, or at least He showed me mine.  And shamefully I did not pass the test either.  It was not about the goodness of God to have spared my life and that of our children.  It was about my pain and my humiliating circumstances.  Fighting the grief of loss of function as well as my job, I still did not praise God or give thanks to Him.  He deserves that whether I feel like it or not.  So I was like Job who did not exalt God in his trial.  

The words of God really hit home when He said "will you also set aside My judgement".  I used to kick myself and condemn myself after falling on my face and failing God.  God spoke those words to my heart  "Will you also set aside My judgement".   God did not condemn me---He forgave me.  That was His judgement and I set it aside and judged my self and condemned myself.  Who was I to do such a foolish thing.  In that state I was not full of the Holy Spirit but in the flesh and could not even minister to my own family.  So once again I repented.

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