Gay Christians who choose celibacy.....

[RustyAngeL]

Personally I think this post needs to be closed.  I'm just plain sick of Christians making excuses for this topic when it's so plain to understand in scripture.

[Guest shiloh357]

I stand corrected. I thought the OP was about a man who knew he was a sinner.

I would like to go back to 

 

2 Corinthians 12: Paul's Thorn in the Flesh

1 It is necessary to go on boasting. Though it is not profitable, I will go on to visions and revelations from the Lord.

2 I know a man in Christ who fourteen years ago (whether in the body or out of the body I do not know, God knows) was caught up to the third heaven.

3 And I know that this man (whether in the body or apart from the body I do not know, God knows)

4 was caught up into paradise and heard things too sacred to be put into words, things that a person is not permitted to speak.

5 On behalf of such an individual I will boast, but on my own behalf I will not boast, except about my weaknesses.

6 For even if I wish to boast, I will not be a fool, for I would be telling the truth, but I refrain from this so that no one may regard me beyond what he sees in me or what he hears from me,

7 even because of the extraordinary character of the revelations. Therefore, so that I would not become arrogant, a thorn in the flesh was given to me, a messenger of Satan to trouble me --- so that I would not become arrogant.

8 I asked the Lord three times about this, that it would depart from me.

9 But he said to me, "My grace is enough for you, for my power is made perfect in weakness." So then, I will boast most gladly about my weaknesses, so that the power of Christ may reside in me.

10 Therefore I am content with weaknesses, with insults, with troubles, with persecutions and difficulties for the sake of Christ, for whenever I am weak, then I am strong.

First of all, I would like to know how a messenger of satan could cause a physical affliction. Could a messenger of satan cause a gay person to be blind to sin?

----------------------------------------------------------------

 

 

 

 

 

"Messenger of Satan" is a figure of speech Paul was using to express how he viewed his ailment.  He is not talking about a demon, however, Jesus healed people by casting out demons so yes a messenger of satan in terms of a demon could cause a physical ailment.

 

 

Blindness to sin is usually wilful.  When you are confronted by the Word of God regarding the sin in your life, you have a choice to make.  You can can hold on to your sin or you can repent.  Some people love their sin too much to let it go.   So they find ways to justify it in their own minds, as is the case in the OP.

[MorningGlory]

Personally I think this post needs to be closed.  I'm just plain sick of Christians making excuses for this topic when it's so plain to understand in scripture.

 

 

I DON'T think it should be closed.  I started this thread to encourage discussion and to try to get new perspectives on the issue and there are many.  Yes, some are trying to excuse sin but many are founded on solid Scripture.  No offense, RA, but if you're sick of this thread, you could leave it to the rest of us to discuss.   

[OneLight]

The thread was moved to the Inner Court.  The Outer Court is designed for those who do not believe in God to discover why we believe.  A discussion on "Gay Christians" is not something that should be discussed with the lost. 

 

The outer Court is an area where we allow anyone who wishes to learn more about our belief to ask questions and learn.

[Littlelambseativy]

Just curious - how does anyone interpret Matt, 19:11,12?

I am questioning this because of the word celibate - a word we use today instead of the word eunuch. 

[enoob57]

 

 

I don't understand how it doesn't we are dealing with sin correct, or what we view as sin and other don't.  Thats what this all boils down too.  They don't view being attracted to the same sex as being sin.  I don't view smoking weed as being sin. Speeding is not mentioned in the Bible either, but is it sin when we do it?  You said I am unrepentant because I feel its okay to smoke weed.  Well, lets readjust that.  I basically stated if the law permits, just like if the law permits unlimted speeds I wouldn't find going fast in a car to sinful.  So I actually am repentant of breaking the law when it comes to smoking weed therefore I don't do it.  While I may not find smoking sinful, I do find breaking the law to smoke sinful.  While these ones who identify as gay may not find the attraction sinful, they do find laying with the same sex as sinful. 

 

 

 

In love I find this obviously wrong! Commonsense dictates that smoking anything is a rebellious process against original created

aspect of the lungs-> as they were designed for air and that alone was life for the clay...  Love, Steven

 

[enoob57]

 

 

 

 

I don't understand how it doesn't we are dealing with sin correct, or what we view as sin and other don't.  Thats what this all boils down too.  They don't view being attracted to the same sex as being sin.  I don't view smoking weed as being sin. Speeding is not mentioned in the Bible either, but is it sin when we do it?  You said I am unrepentant because I feel its okay to smoke weed.  Well, lets readjust that.  I basically stated if the law permits, just like if the law permits unlimted speeds I wouldn't find going fast in a car to sinful.  So I actually am repentant of breaking the law when it comes to smoking weed therefore I don't do it.  While I may not find smoking sinful, I do find breaking the law to smoke sinful.  While these ones who identify as gay may not find the attraction sinful, they do find laying with the same sex as sinful. 

 

 

 

In love I find this obviously wrong! Commonsense dictates that smoking anything is a rebellious process against original created

aspect of the lungs-> as they were designed for air and that alone was life for the clay...  Love, Steven

 

 

 

Well, no need to get into an actual smoking vs not smoking debate, but please deal with the substance of what I'm saying if you can please. 

 

 

 

enoob's reply:

The reasoning is yours to correct! As all communication is the formation of individual truths together to form a larger truth ... one fallacy in that string of truth

and all becomes lie! So to be pin point specific The Highest Law 'IS' God's! Of which you are not even in reason with above in your statement- as your claim

clearly indicates... As your comment suggests don't require everything I say to be true in order for truth to be in what I say... sorry I know where that is

going and I think you do too!  Love, Steven

[GoldenEagle]

Just curious - how does anyone interpret Matt, 19:11,12?

 

I am questioning this because of the word celibate - a word we use today instead of the word eunuch. 

--------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------

 

How do you interpret the passage Littlelambseativy?

 

I believe the context of this passage: Matt. 19:1-15

 

Matt. 19:1-15

Marriage and Divorce

19 Now it came to pass, when Jesus had finished these sayings, that He departed from Galilee and came to the region of Judea beyond the Jordan. ² And great multitudes followed Him, and He healed them there.

³ The Pharisees also came to Him, testing Him, and saying to Him, “Is it lawful for a man to divorce his wife for just any reason?”

⁴ And He answered and said to them, “Have you not read that He who made^[a] them at the beginning ‘made them male and female,’^{[b] 5} and said, ‘For this reason a man shall leave his father and mother and be joined to his wife, and the two shall become one flesh’?^{[c] 6} So then, they are no longer two but one flesh. Therefore what God has joined together, let not man separate.”

⁷ They said to Him, “Why then did Moses command to give a certificate of divorce, and to put her away?”

⁸ He said to them, “Moses, because of the hardness of your hearts, permitted you to divorce your wives, but from the beginning it was not so. ⁹ And I say to you, whoever divorces his wife, except for sexual immorality,^[d] and marries another, commits adultery; and whoever marries her who is divorced commits adultery.”

¹⁰ His disciples said to Him, “If such is the case of the man with his wife, it is better not to marry.”

 

Jesus Teaches on Celibacy

¹¹ But He said to them, “All cannot accept this saying, but only those to whom it has been given: ¹² For there are eunuchs who were born thus from their mother’s womb, and there are eunuchs who were made eunuchs by men, and there are eunuchs who have made themselves eunuchs for the kingdom of heaven’s sake. He who is able to accept it, let him accept it.”

 

 

Jesus Blesses Little Children

¹³ Then little children were brought to Him that He might put His hands on them and pray, but the disciples rebuked them. ¹⁴ But Jesus said, “Let the little children come to Me, and do not forbid them; for of such is the kingdom of heaven.” ¹⁵ And He laid His hands on them and departed from there.

[Littlelambseativy]

I fully understand the above but my question does not refer to the married but to the unmarried. I am just stating that another way to look at the word celibate is as mentioned in Matt 19:11,12. Just because one may realize that he /she may in the right circumstance be tempted, they refrain from any sexual encounter and choose to remain celibate or in the OT term a eunuch knowing that if tempted God is just and will forgive their sin of temptation. And this refers to both homosexual and heterosexual.

[enoob57]

Actually I have no clue what you are talking about.  The only thing that was clear is the Highest Law is God's.....Agreed!!  As for the rest of your stament it was pretty jumbled in rhetoric and riddle.  Try being a little simpler....matter a fact try answering the question?  I have expressed a certian feeling, basically becoming vulnerable to those here.  I welcome what you say, but can you make it clear.  Shiloh was at least succcinct in what he stated. I would appreicate if I could get the same from you. 

 

 

 

enoob's reply:

Point in fact You stated smoking pot is wrong because it is against the law... no it wrong because it violates first the original creation of God... it is

a perversion by evil and it is  also against the law -period!  If it becomes legal it is still wrong because of perversion of original creation.  First fallacy 

corrected in your statement!

 

Point in fact you said " While these ones who identify as gay may not find the attraction sinful, they do find laying with the same sex as sinful." 

While using your first fallacy now you move on to validate your second fallacy that being a man and desiring a man may not wrong but  doing it is

wrong ... homosexuality is a rebellion against original creation and has no place of purpose in its use but to be perversion against God's original design!

Whether law permits or not it remains and abomination both the desire of and the act!

Love, Steven