Tithing, Giving, and the Believer

[other one]

This is a spinoff subject that came up in this thread:

 

 

1A. Is tithing strictly an OT principle (given to Israel)?

 

1B. If no, does tithing apply to Believers in Jesus Christ today?

2. Is giving a NT principle that applies to Believers?

 

3. Is tithing/giving specifically to the local church or to include other Gospel centered organizations?

 

Feel free to answer one or all of the questions. Biblical backing is always appreciated.

 

 

As sort of a general answer to them all, if you mean by tithing giving 10% i do not think it  applies today unless you are an orthodox practicing Jew.   However giving is a NT principle and one should help fund the Church he/she attends and/or the places they get the word from if it's tv or computers.

 

Giving in general I believe is more than a principle as not helping disadvantaged people in need was reasoning enough to send people to hell (Matt. Chapter 24.

 

As for ten percent I don't agree with for that is a serious burden on some and a frivolous amount to others.  I think one should give whatever they can with a happy heart.

 

We do somewhere around ten percent of our gain to the church and add to that whatever seems to be needed.  It varies because I don't want to set down and figure exactly ten percent for I don't want to entertain the thought that it's demanded, but is a free willing return of what we have been blessed to receive.  Sometimes when families at church are in trouble our entire congregation comes together to help.....   and I know that's more than ten percent.   I've seen us pass the plate for a special need with about 100 people there and occasionally raise seven or eight thousand dollars on one pass.  none of us are wealthy.  That's just the kind of people who attend Nazarene Churches......    if you are not comfortable giving, you probably would not be comfortable there.....    but if you like to eat, you'd love it for we gather often.

[GoldenEagle]

As sort of a general answer to them all, if you mean by tithing giving 10% i do not think it  applies today unless you are an orthodox practicing Jew.   However giving is a NT principle and one should help fund the Church he/she attends and/or the places they get the word from if it's tv or computers.

I agree with you brother. What would you say to those who think that a person HAS to give 10% as a Christian?

[Guest man]

What would you say to those who think that a person HAS to give 10% as a Christian?

 

I would say, "Follow your convictions".

[His_disciple3]

This is a spinoff subject that came up in this thread:

 

 

1A. Is tithing strictly an OT principle (given to Israel)?

 

yes any part of the law is strictly OT, for if we go back under the law we fall from grace, 3 basic principles before the law, the Sabbath, tithing and circumcision all three were also during the law, only one has been brought forth for the NT Church tithing, If the NT church is still under tithing then we have to also be fleshly circumcised, But scriptures for the NT Church, that Circumcision availeth nothing, so neither does tithing.

 

1B. If no, does tithing apply to Believers in Jesus Christ today?

2. Is giving a NT principle that applies to Believers?

 

 

yes, the lady gave all of her wants, in Acts they sold all they had and brought the money to the disciples and they lived out of this fund according to their needs. what ever you give if you give it because you are required to may as well not give, give with a cheerful/willing heart

 

3. Is tithing/giving specifically to the local church or to include other Gospel centered organizations?

 

Follow your heart on how much and where it goes

 

 

Feel free to answer one or all of the questions. Biblical backing is always appreciated.

[just_fish]

1a) YES -- if you are going to hold onto OT principles/laws you must keep ALL of them--you CANNOT pick and choose

 

2) YES, 1 Cor 16:2--we are in the New Covenant initiated by our LORD in the upper room before his crucifixion. We love/give because He first loved/gave for us

 

3)To your local church first, then to additional resources

 

God Bless

[WebFisher]

The problem with tithing (if you want to call it a problem) is that the modern church focuses on the act rather than the purpose. In the OT the people of Israel were commanded to tithe to provide upkeep for the temple and for the Levites since they were the tribe that did not receive an inheritance of land specifically for them as did the other tribes. This was part of the Hebrew Law that the children of Israel were required to keep. In the NT, the temple, the Law and the need for them were removed through the blood sacrifice of Christ on the cross. The "temple" became the "church" which was now defined as the Body of Christ rather than a physical building. The "tithe", in the sense that the Hebrews used it prior to Christ would also have become moot as the Law in its' entirety was replaced by Grace. Instead of "tithing", the Christian is commanded to reflect Christ by giving, caring, loving, and helping the world around them. In some instances, the local church (building and congregation) are able to this much more effectively as a collective group than an individual is. However, many churches have turned this act of cheerfully and willfully giving into a requirement to make the new temple bigger and thus inadvertently placing themselves under the law again. Many modern churches (read: buildings) have become industries rather than ministries and are not effectively using the monetary and non-monetary resources "tithed" to them because their buildings have become so large that their need for more resources has outgrown their incomes. Some buildings are just poor stewards, and others are masterful at it. Some churches are using the "tithes" received to actually minister to the poor, while others are only using it to add more to their new temple. As a member of the church as the Body of Christ rather than a collection of individuals which gathers under a common roof on Sunday, you have to pray to God to identify where your giving would be more effective. Can you impact your community for Christ more by giving $10/week to a homeless shelter or to a building that is adding more Sunday school classrooms where the Bible can be taught to more people? 

 

My point is, the act of "tithing" is an ongoing principal of the Christian life in that we are commanded to give as Christ gave (of course, I don't recall that he ever gave money to a building, only His life in service to the world.) The OT tithe was money. The NT tithe is more than just monetary.

 

The "purpose" of the tithe is strictly OT as the Temple and the Tribe of Levi are no longer a part of the Christian Life. (Not sure if that is the correct wording... may edit it later)

[Guest]

there is a very lengthy treatment of this at http://omegazine.com/biblestudy/tithe_1.html , way too much to post here for any interested - basically every verse on the topic

[kwikphilly]

Blessings Everyone,Golden Eagle

      I do believe it really is the responsibility of the believer to support the ministry that blesses them & it is not strictly an OT principle,many people will argue that we are not under the curse of the law (true)& I tend to see that as an excuse not to tithe....it is not about being cursed or about the law.......it is what we should do just as Jesus said so in Mathew 23:23......(paraphrasing)Jesus brings to light that just because you tithe  you must not omit the weightier matters..........and He then adds"these you ought to do"(referring to tithing)

     If we truly trust God for provision then we should automatically give back to God what is His First,everything we have is given to us by Him & every way is made by Him..............I do believe tithing is a testimony of faith & trust.....I also think tithing can be given anywhere you choose,it does not have to be your church

                                                                                                                                            With love,in Christ-Kwik

[gdemoss]

John, your war on legalism and the persistence you have is amazing brother.

 

A person works and makes $10 in a week raking leaves while another runs a company and collects $5000 for his due.  There are those who would take the young man and chastise him if he did not put a dollar in the basket that would praise the CEO for his paltry $500 contribution as if he has done some wonderful work.  

 

Let us cut to the chase, the problem that underlies the whole argument is whether or not I want to part with my precious treasure or squeeze out as much as I can from every single unit of my God given time and talents that I convert to some form of currency.

[GoldenEagle]

Blessings Everyone,Golden Eagle

      I do believe it really is the responsibility of the believer to support the ministry that blesses them & it is not strictly an OT principle,many people will argue that we are not under the curse of the law (true)& I tend to see that as an excuse not to tithe....it is not about being cursed or about the law.......it is what we should do just as Jesus said so in Mathew 23:23......(paraphrasing)Jesus brings to light that just because you tithe  you must not omit the weightier matters..........and He then adds"these you ought to do"(referring to tithing)

     If we truly trust God for provision then we should automatically give back to God what is His First,everything we have is given to us by Him & every way is made by Him..............I do believe tithing is a testimony of faith & trust.....I also think tithing can be given anywhere you choose,it does not have to be your church

                                                                                                                                            With love,in Christ-Kwik

I think I understand what you're saying sister...

I sometimes call Matthew 23 the "Woe to Scribes and Pharisees" chapter... So Jesus says in Matthew 23:23 that the Pharisees should indeed tithe while also seeking justice, mercy, and having faith. Jesus charged them with not having justice, mercy, and faith - without these what is a tithe worth?

 

Matthew 23:23-24

¹⁶ “Woe to you, blind guides, who say, ‘Whoever swears by the temple, it is nothing; but whoever swears by the gold of the temple, he is obliged to perform it.’ ¹⁷ Fools and blind! For which is greater, the gold or the temple that sanctifies the gold? ¹⁸ And, ‘Whoever swears by the altar, it is nothing; but whoever swears by the gift that is on it, he is obliged to perform it.’ ¹⁹ Fools and blind! For which is greater, the gift or the altar that sanctifies the gift? ²⁰ Therefore he who swears by the altar, swears by it and by all things on it. ²¹ He who swears by the temple, swears by it and by Him who dwellsin it. ²² And he who swears by heaven, swears by the throne of God and by Him who sits on it.

 

²³ “Woe to you, scribes and Pharisees, hypocrites! For you pay tithe of mint and anise and cummin, and have neglected the weightier matters of the law: justice and mercy and faith. These you ought to have done, without leaving the others undone. ²⁴ Blind guides, who strain out a gnat and swallow a camel!

 

²⁵ “Woe to you, scribes and Pharisees, hypocrites! For you cleanse the outside of the cup and dish, but inside they are full of extortion and self-indulgence.^{[f] 26} Blind Pharisee, first cleanse the inside of the cup and dish, that the outside of them may be clean also.

 

 

Questions: Were the scribes and Pharisees believers in Jesus Christ? Does this verse apply to Christ-followers? Or was this a lesson Jesus was trying to show that scribes/Pharisees were majoring {focusing} on the minor ({issues}?

Thanks for bringing this verse up! Good discussion.

God bless,

GE