a thought to consider: free will

[mevosper]

This is not to debate whether free will exists or not. It is a consideration of what "free will" is in its most basic idea. 

 

It seems to me that "free will" is the idea that one can make their own choice. The concept is to give the choice to the individual: "I decide to..." or "I will make the choice...". And this choice could be to pull the trigger of a gun pointed at someone, rob a bank, or even to put faith in God. Regardless of the choice, we are putting ourselves in the "decision makers" chair.

 

If we consider our bodies to be the temple of the Holy Spirit, which Paul tells us it is, then the idea of "free will" must be viewed from a different level. A different level that I believe is: (1) uncomfortable for not just a few persons; and (2) a level not considered by very many. "What is that level?" you say. 

 

The concept of "free will" boils down to what choices we make for ourselves that may or may not be beneficial for us. The idea is that "I" made the choice. "I" decided not to pull the trigger, or "I" decided not to rob the bank, or "I" decided to give my life to Christ. These choices were decisions that "I" made. I remember learning a simply saying many years ago in Sunday School: "I" is in the middle of "s-i-n".

 

These same "I" choices were the choices that the prince of Tyre is making:

 

Eze 28:2 KJV - [2] Son of man, say unto the prince of Tyrus, Thus saith the Lord GOD; Because thine heart is lifted up, and thou hast said, I am a God, I sit in the seat of God, in the midst of the seas; yet thou art a man, and not God, though thou set thine heart as the heart of God:

 

These same "I" choices were also those made by Lucifer, son of the morning in Isa 14:13-14

 

Isa 14:13-14 KJV - [13] For thou hast said in thine heart, I will ascend into heaven, I will exalt my throne above the stars of God: I will sit also upon the mount of the congregation, in the sides of the north: [14] I will ascend above the heights of the clouds; I will be like the most High. 

 

In the Garden of Eden, this was the same scheme that Satan used to tempt Eve:

 

Gen 3:6 KJV - [6] And when the woman saw that the tree was good for food (food for eating and satisfying the hunger pangs and nutrition requirements of the flesh), and that it was pleasant to the eyes (look pleasant and pretty to the eye, the physical eye that God warns us not to use for judging), and a tree to be desired to make one wise (to gain worldly wisdom and knowledge), she took of the fruit thereof, and did eat, and gave also unto her husband with her; and he did eat.

 

"free will" is what "I" choose to do, regardless of anything else. 

 

So, I ask you brothers and sisters in Christ, is "free will" really where we want to our decisions?

Edited January 25, 2015 by mevosper

[Riverwalker]

Amen

 

Freewill is often considered by some to be free from the consequences of my choice.

 

The choice is all yours but there is a result at the end

 

I am free to walk off a cliff ...but I am not free from the sudden stop at the end of my fall.

 

So too are people free to reject Christ. But they are not free from the sudden stop at the end.

 

Everyday we make a choice to live Like Christ, or to sin.  God forgives our sin, but it still impacts our lives.   we can't escape that either

Edited January 26, 2015 by Riverwalker

[mevosper]

Riverwalk - interesting reply, but I think you either missed the point. Or, you got the point and are trying to redirect.  

 

My point in the post above is that Satan uses his freewill for his own gratification.

 

When we are making a free will decision, we are doing it according to our own will - not anyone else's, including God's. The thought process is: "i have free will to choose what I want to do when I want to do it". It's all about "self". 

[Littlelambseativy]

I'm not so certain Satan uses his free will for self gratification as it is destroying the church for which Jesus gave His life. He tried to stop Jesus countless times and if Jesus succeeds in rapturing the church then gathering Israel, he, Satan has lost.

[Riverwalker]

Riverwalk - interesting reply, but I think you either missed the point. Or, you got the point and are trying to redirect.  

 

My point in the post above is that Satan uses his freewill for his own gratification.

 

When we are making a free will decision, we are doing it according to our own will - not anyone else's, including God's. The thought process is: "i have free will to choose what I want to do when I want to do it". It's all about "self". 

Satan is a tool of God

 

He is not a human, He is bereft of freewill. and choices he made God gave him....to complete his will

 

Would Jesus ever have been crucified without the devil working the scene

 

He is a rat being led through the maze

 

He could inflict Job until God allowed it

Edited January 27, 2015 by Riverwalker

[mevosper]

 

Riverwalk - interesting reply, but I think you either missed the point. Or, you got the point and are trying to redirect.  

 

My point in the post above is that Satan uses his freewill for his own gratification.

 

When we are making a free will decision, we are doing it according to our own will - not anyone else's, including God's. The thought process is: "i have free will to choose what I want to do when I want to do it". It's all about "self". 

Satan is a tool of God

 

He is not a human, He is bereft of freewill. and choices he made God gave him....to complete his will

 

Would Jesus ever have been crucified without the devil working the scene

 

He is a rat being led through the maze

 

He could inflict Job until God allowed it

 

This leads to an interesting conundrum then. 

One must ask, then, was it God's will that the serpent deceive Eve in the garden? Was Satan the cause of man's fall, or was the Father?

 

Personally, I believe God holds all the power and nothing is done without Him having total control of everything. There are no "buts".

 

Regardless, the message of the post is to edify the church, and to look inwards, and ask "Who's will is in control of our lives?"

 

I find the whole concept of free will quite fascinating.

[mevosper]

I'm not so certain Satan uses his free will for self gratification as it is destroying the church for which Jesus gave His life. He tried to stop Jesus countless times and if Jesus succeeds in rapturing the church then destroying Israel, he has lost.

I'm pretty sure Satan is all about gratifying himself:

 

Isa 14:13-14 KJV - [13] For thou hast said in thine heart, I will ascend into heaven, I will exalt my throne above the stars of God: I will sit also upon the mount of the congregation, in the sides of the north: [14] I will ascend above the heights of the clouds; I will be like the most High.

[Littlelambseativy]

But, he cannot gratify himself as long as there is a church, the bride of Christ, and as long as there is an Israel Satan CANNOT be gratified. If he can prevent currently and future,the church from being raptured and the destruction of Israel, yes he will be gratified knowing God lost. BUT, we know the end and the Father and the Son. Jesus, have and will defeat him. Otherwise....why the false church, the false prophet and the Antichrist if not to destroy. Satan will only be happy if he destroys God's final plans.

[OneLight]

Riverwalk - interesting reply, but I think you either missed the point. Or, you got the point and are trying to redirect.  

 

My point in the post above is that Satan uses his freewill for his own gratification.

 

When we are making a free will decision, we are doing it according to our own will - not anyone else's, including God's. The thought process is: "i have free will to choose what I want to do when I want to do it". It's all about "self". 

 

I disagree, in part, to the above statement.  Is it not Gods will that we continue to follow Him, that His Spirit convicts us of sin to a point of repentance, which we are free to accept or reject?  If we reject, that is our choice we have made on our own, but if we repent, it is in obedience to His will and His work in our lives.  We cannot do this ourselves, so the "I" turns into a "we" when we take a closer look at how the decision came about.  I take no credit for following God, it is 99.9% Him and .1% me, since I had to agree.

[mevosper]

 

Riverwalk - interesting reply, but I think you either missed the point. Or, you got the point and are trying to redirect.  

 

My point in the post above is that Satan uses his freewill for his own gratification.

 

When we are making a free will decision, we are doing it according to our own will - not anyone else's, including God's. The thought process is: "i have free will to choose what I want to do when I want to do it". It's all about "self". 

 

I disagree, in part, to the above statement.  Is it not Gods will that we continue to follow Him, that His Spirit convicts us of sin to a point of repentance, which we are free to accept or reject?  If we reject, that is our choice we have made on our own, but if we repent, it is in obedience to His will and His work in our lives.  We cannot do this ourselves, so the "I" turns into a "we" when we take a closer look at how the decision came about.  I take no credit for following God, it is 99.9% Him and .1% me, since I had to agree.

 

It is 100% Him. Your .1% is still self saying "Ok, God, I can choose to agree or not, but I'm gonna ..."