the bride of Christ

[Openly Curious]

Openly Curious said this -

Matthew 26:28 - For this is my blood of the new testament (oath, covenant) which is shed for "many" for the remission of sins.

 

Testament & Covenant are two different things. Will put some notes together for this.

 

Marilyn.

 

Oh please do tell...

Hi Openly Curious,

The terms `covenant` & `testament` have two different meanings.

A COVENANT

A covenant is a mutual agreement or compact in which at least two persons must act. A covenant may be dissolved by one of the parties involved not fulfilling its conditions. A covenant may be concluded without necessarily having an inheritance implied in it. (Gen. 26: 28; 1 Sam. 23: 18) A covenant can also be made without requiring a death, for instance the covenant made by David & Jonathan (1 Sam. 20: 16).

A TESTAMENT

When a will & testament is made by a testator, it does not become operant until after the testator`s death. A testament implies property & possessions; a person who has nothing cannot bequeath a legacy.

I will continue this topic soon in relation to those terms for God`s Covenant & God`s Testament.

Marilyn.

Covenant in the new testament Greek word is diatheke and it means a contract, covenant, testament. The word "testament" is the same word translated in the english word for covenant. Everytime you read "covenant or testament" it's from this greek word in the New Testament (diatheke). They are one and the same.

The Hebrew word for "covenant" in the Old Testament is beriyth and it means a compact a confederancy, covenant, league.

The word "testament" only appears in the new testament and it is translated for covenant.

In the book of the Hebrews passages especially chapter 8 speaks of the Old Testament Covenant of Israel and it speaks of a new and better covenant and it uses the "same" greek word every single time.

Meaning from a bible stand point there is no difference between a covenant and testament they are one and the same.

The Biblical difinition of the two words are one and the same "diatheke"

There may be differences in the way people use the words in the English language but in Biblical language they are the same.

I am actually quite glad that you are wrong on this because if you were right then that would mean that God could just opt out of his covenant promises.

[Openly Curious]

over all of what???

quote Marilyn

Wonderful question, Openly Curious,

I did not ask this question you have mistaken me for other one who asked the question.

[Guest]

And again, Matt. 26: says His blood is shed for many.  But that doesn't mean that all of those "many" are in covenant with God.   It simply says his blood was shed for them

But it does mean that every believer in Christ is in covenant with God

 

 

The Trouble With Tossing Out The First Testament Of Jesus (The "OT")

 

Behold, the days come, saith the LORD, that I will make a new covenant with the house of Israel, and with the house of Judah:

 

Not according to the covenant that I made with their fathers in the day that I took them by the hand to bring them out of the land of Egypt; which my covenant they brake, although I was an husband unto them, saith the LORD:

 

But this shall be the covenant that I will make with the house of Israel; After those days, saith the LORD, I will put my law in their inward parts, and write it in their hearts; and will be their God, and they shall be my people.

 

And they shall teach no more every man his neighbour, and every man his brother, saying, Know the LORD: for they shall all know me, from the least of them unto the greatest of them, saith the LORD; for I will forgive their iniquity, and I will remember their sin no more. Jeremiah 31:31-34

 

Is One Is In Great Danger Of Missing The LORD's

 

For finding fault with them, he saith, Behold, the days come, saith the Lord, when I will make a new covenant with the house of Israel and with the house of Judah:

 

Not according to the covenant that I made with their fathers in the day when I took them by the hand to lead them out of the land of Egypt; because they continued not in my covenant, and I regarded them not, saith the Lord.

 

For this is the covenant that I will make with the house of Israel after those days, saith the Lord; I will put my laws into their mind, and write them in their hearts: and I will be to them a God, and they shall be to me a people:

 

And they shall not teach every man his neighbour, and every man his brother, saying, Know the Lord: for all shall know me, from the least to the greatest.

 

For I will be merciful to their unrighteousness, and their sins and their iniquities will I remember no more.

 

In that he saith, A new covenant, he hath made the first old. Now that which decayeth and waxeth old is ready to vanish away. Hebrews 8:8-13

 

Everlasting Love For His Brothers

 

For thus saith the LORD of hosts; After the glory hath he sent me unto the nations which spoiled you: for he that toucheth you toucheth the apple of his eye.

 

For, behold, I will shake mine hand upon them, and they shall be a spoil to their servants: and ye shall know that the LORD of hosts hath sent me.

 

Sing and rejoice, O daughter of Zion: for, lo, I come, and I will dwell in the midst of thee, saith the LORD. Zechariah 2:8-10

 

As I See It

 

And so all Israel shall be saved: as it is written, There shall come out of Sion the Deliverer, and shall turn away ungodliness from Jacob:

 

For this is my covenant unto them, when I shall take away their sins. Romans 11:26-27

 

Now That's A Covenant~!

 

~

 

Don't Be Jealous

 

It was said unto her, The elder shall serve the younger.

 

As it is written, Jacob have I loved, but Esau have I hated.

 

What shall we say then? Is there unrighteousness with God? God forbid.

 

For he saith to Moses, I will have mercy on whom I will have mercy, and I will have compassion on whom I will have compassion.

 

So then it is not of him that willeth, nor of him that runneth, but of God that sheweth mercy. Romans 9:12-16

 

Be Blessed Beloved Of The KING

 

The LORD bless thee, and keep thee:

The LORD make his face shine upon thee, and be gracious unto thee:

The LORD lift up his countenance upon thee, and give thee peace.

 

And they shall put my name upon the children of Israel; and I will bless them. Numbers 6:24-27

 

Love, Your Brother Joe

[Marilyn C]

Hi Openly Curious,

 

Sorry for calling other one`s question from you.

 

Also I have not finished with my comments on Covenant & testament, as I said, in relation to what God says. So wait to see if I am wrong. And thank you for your comments. I`m glad to see that you do agree with me that those words `Covenant & Testament,` are used differently in the English language.

 

Marilyn.

Edited April 5, 2015 by Marilyn C

[Openly Curious]

Hi Openly Curious,

 

Sorry for calling other one`s question from you.

 

Also I have not finished with my comments on Covenant & testament, as I said, in relation to what God says. So wait to see if I am wrong. And thank you for your comments. I`m glad to see that you do agree with me that those words `Covenant & Testament,` are used differently in the English language.

 

Marilyn.

The issue I'm having with you Marilyn is not how it was used in English but how it was used in the original Greek. As far as the bible goes the words "covenant" and "testament" do mean the exact same thing there is no difference between the two.

[other one]

Paul seemed to want to keep things kind of simple....     I am amazed at the length of discussions some of you can have.....   mincing words, alternative meanings, different languages and such is confusing to read.

 

Just sayin'

[Marilyn C]

Hi Openly Curious,

So here we are looking at what God`s word says concerning `Covenant,` & `Testament.` Now here are my thoughts.

A COVENANT BETWEEN PEOPLE.

`But they said, (Abimelech & others) “We have certainly seen that the Lord is with you. So we said, “Let there now be an oath between us, between you & us; & let us make a covenant with you, that you will do us no harm,….` (Gen. 26: 28 & 29)

`And he (Jonathan) said to him (David), “Do not fear, for the hand of Saul my father shall not find you. You shall be king over Israel , & I shall be next to you…..So the two of them (Jonathan & David) made a covenant before the Lord.` (1 Sam. 23: 17 & 18)

So here we see a covenant is a mutual agreement or compact between persons, (Abimelech & Isaac, & Jonathan & David). Now these covenants could be dissolved by one of the parties involved if they didn`t fulfill its conditions. Note there was no inheritance, property or possessions implied. That is, no testament of a bequest involved.


THE FATHER`S COVENANT WITH THE SON.

`Now may the God of peace who brought up our Lord Jesus from the dead, that great shepherd of the sheep, through the blood of the everlasting covenant.` (Heb. 13: 20)

Now we read of the everlasting covenant that God the Father made with His beloved Son from everlasting, which can never break down because of either one failing to fulfill the agreement. Then we know the validity of a human charter usually depends on the character of the signature & authority of the seal appended to it. What then shall we say of this covenant which has been ratified by the blood of Christ, & which bears the insignia of that glorious Name.

Next we see that God has by no means disconnected the things of the earth from His eternal interests.

`Thus says the Lord: “In an acceptable time I have heard you, & in the day of salvation I have helped you; I will preserve you & give you as a covenant to the people, to restore the earth, to cause them to inherit the desolate heritages;….` (Isa. 49: 8)

It is the Lord`s desire & design that the harmony of heaven be yet established in the earth. And it is through Christ as the covenant that it will be accomplished. This covenant includes redemption, reconciliation & regeneration, for Christ is the Redeemer, the Reconciler & the Regenerator.

Then as we read that God has made Christ Himself as the covenant to the people, we also see that He sent Him to earth to explain this covenant. Thus Christ is called `the messenger of the covenant.` Christ coming to earth to explain the message of the covenant that He made with God the Father.

`And the Lord, whom you seek, will suddenly come to His temple, even the Messenger of the covenant,…` (Mal. 3: 1)

Never before in the whole range of human knowledge was a messenger sent on such an important issue for mankind which involved, besides other supreme matters, the gift of eternal life, the bequest of an everlasting inheritance, & the legacy of immortal blessedness.

More than all this, the person of the messenger Himself by far exceeds the exceptional mission & ethereal message on account of which he came. Heaven`s chiefest & choicest in the whole celestial hierarchy came in manifestation, to convey the glad tidings & to confirm the covenant.

The pure motive of His precious message & the perfect magnificence of His personal majesty are unrivaled in world history. How strange it appears that everyone`s attention is not arrested & attracted by the manifestation of such a delegate, with so wonderful a purpose from the celestial court.

To be continued….. Marilyn.

 

Edited April 6, 2015 by Marilyn C

[Openly Curious]

To be continued….. Marilyn.

same bat time same bat channel for the conclusion of this cliff hanger.

[Marilyn C]

Hi Openly Curious,

I want to thank you for this topic as I have appreciated looking into it more deeply.

Now I believe, as I said previously, that God the Father made a covenant with God the Son. It is an everlasting covenant sealed with Christ`s blood, & because it is made between divinities it can never be broken. The details of the covenant, the promises, privileges & possessions are all confirmed in Christ who not only embodies the covenant itself but is the Mediator & Messenger of the covenant.

We first hear of this covenant when God talks with Noah before & then after the flood.

`Behold, I Myself am bringing the flood waters on the earth…..& everything that is on the earth shall die. But I will establish My covenant with you;…..` (Gen. 6: 17 & 18)

`God said……`Surely for your lifeblood I will demand a reckoning; …..Behold, I establish My covenant with you & your descendents after you,….` (Gen. 9: 5 & 9)

Establish – Heb. Word `quwm` meaning to rise, accomplish, make good, perform…..

This is the same word `establish` `quwm,` that God uses when He talks with Abraham & then of Isaac.

`I will establish My covenant between me & you & your descendants after you in their generations, for an everlasting covenant to be God to you & your descendants after you.` (Gen. 17: 7)

Thus we see that God is `establishing` His covenant through different people. However we need to realize here that what God is doing with man is not a contract, a covenant that puts man on equal footing with God, but that God is declaring His purposes & His faithfulness to accomplish what He purposed.

And so on through Moses & David, God opens up more of His purposes to mankind, the covenant the Father made with the Son to fulfill all that was purposed, restoring mankind & the earth (etc).

Now when the time came for the blood of the everlasting covenant to be shed we find that the person (Christ) who died has left a `last will & testament.` He had property & possessions to bequeath.

`How much more shall the blood of Christ, who through the eternal Spirit offered Himself without spot to God……& for this cause He is the mediator of the new testament, that by means of death, for the redemption of the transgressions that were under the first testament, they which are called might receive the promise of eternal inheritance.

For where a testament is, there must also of necessity be the death of the testator. For a testament is of force after men are dead ; otherwise it is of no strength at all while the testator lives.` (Heb. 9: 14 – 17)

 

Thus we see that God`s everlasting Covenant also includes a bequest, a testament because `someone,` died. This is what is being focused on here in Hebrews 9, the testament aspect, the inheritance passed on when Christ died. However we need to realize that the everlasting covenant in full is the contract, covenant, agreement that God the Father & God the Son made with each other in eternity passed.

Summing up I see that God the Father made this everlasting covenant with the Son & then declared it to mankind. Then because it was sealed with Christ`s blood & He had an inheritance to pass on, then we see that a testament, a bequest is included. And since the one who died is Divine, then this bequest has an eternal inheritance with promises & privileges.

This then leads us to investigate what is this eternal inheritance & to whom are the promises & privileges given. I, personally believe Christ has bequest all who receive, - eternal life with privileges & blessings of sonship. The final detail is then required of WHO the different groups are that God has called out, & WHERE they serve in His great kingdom encompassing all realms.

Which brings us back, I believe to the `Bride purpose,` & the Body purpose.` Different groups who serve in different realms of God`s great kingdom but who all receive the eternal inheritance of – eternal life, promises & blessings of sonship.

Marilyn.








 

Edited April 7, 2015 by Marilyn C

[Openly Curious]

I still believe by difinition that both "covenant" and "testament" are the same thing.

They both come from the same Greek word.