What really separates christians and denominations ?

[*Zion*]

We are supposed to be in agreement with God's Spirit.  The heart is deceitful above all else.

[Guest shiloh357]

10 hours ago, Marilyn C said:

Hi Shiloh357,

Politics, ay. Well that says it all - connected to the world system of power & control. Is that what you mean?

Marilyn.

As long as we are in this world, anything we do is connected to a human system of worship and practice.  No one is immune from that.  You may live in a fantasy that you are not thus connected, but you are.  

And there is nothing wrong with that.   God made this world, and God doesn't condemn human systems anywhere in the Bible.  What is condemned is elevating our own traditions above God's word.   No one can possibly live up to the unrealistic, puritanical ideals that you keep trying to promote.  

[Guest shiloh357]

29 minutes ago, *Zion* said:

We are supposed to be in agreement with God's Spirit.  The heart is deceitful above all else.

Yes, but we are imperfect creatures and no one is on their game 100% of the time.  None of us ever walk in the spirit 24/7.   We may be in agreement with God's Spirit without necessarily being in agreement with each other, particularly in the finer points of doctrine and tradition.  God knows that and He makes room for that.

[*Zion*]

So surely this should be our aim, not to find like-minded people instead.  Our focus should be on God's heart, not each others' or our own.  That is all.

[Guest shiloh357]

43 minutes ago, *Zion* said:

So surely this should be our aim, not to find like-minded people instead.  Our focus should be on God's heart, not each others' or our own.  That is all.

I think we should find likeminded people to worship with.  That doesn't detract from focusing on God's heart.

[Ezra]

6 hours ago, *Zion* said:

We are supposed to be in agreement with God's Spirit.  The heart is deceitful above all else.

Jesus said that His words are spirit and life. When Christians are like-minded they are in agreement with God's Spirit because they are in agreement about what He has revealed in His written Word (given by the Spirit). So the two go together. There can be no true fellowship or true worship without the unity of the spirit.

[enoob57]

7 minutes ago, Ezra said:

Jesus said that His words are spirit and life. When Christians are like-minded they are in agreement with God's Spirit because they are in agreement about what He has revealed in His written Word (given by the Spirit). So the two go together. There can be no true fellowship or true worship without the unity of the spirit.

There will be none that draws nearer to Him unless broken and contrite ... His Word alone prevent in and of ourselves
the ability to do so without His first chair being filled with Him in Spirit!  When we proclaim God's Word as 'ONLY'
we become inept in correcting the lies within us with any other source but that of Spirit and Word by The Will of The
Father... there are so many numerous other ways in appearance here!   Love, Steven

[Willa]

Often it is immaturity and ignorance that keeps us seperate.  When we are new Christians we often have the highest praises for the group that led us to Christ and is currently discipling us.  We even elevate our teachers in our own minds.  It is a painful process when God weens us and shows us that they also have human failities.  But in that process we begin to lean more fully on Christ as our Good Shepherd or Pastor.  He continues to reveal the heart of the Father to us by His Spirit.  We realize the frailty of people and begin to love them more as God does.  For it is while we were yet sinners that Christ died for us.  So it is that we come to love these sinners simply because we can also see Christ in them.  God is slowly changing all of us to be more like Him.  We allow others their strange ideas or habits, knowing that our ideas and actions aren't perfect yet as well.  And we continue to rely on the Holy Spirit to help us understand the Bible more fully as well as to continue to transform us till we all fully have the mind of Christ.

I agree that our greatest divider is pride.  It is the sin of satan the accuser, deciever, and father of lies.  So ultimately he is the divider of the church. 

[SavedOnebyGrace]

1 hour ago, Ezra said:

Jesus said that His words are spirit and life. When Christians are like-minded they are in agreement with God's Spirit because they are in agreement about what He has revealed in His written Word (given by the Spirit). So the two go together. There can be no true fellowship or true worship without the unity of the spirit.

Are there two spirit-filled Christians on this forum who agree upon everything pertaining to God the Father, Jesus the Messiah and the Holy Spirit, and Their teachings?  If so, I'd like to meet them.

[SINNERSAVED]

8 minutes ago, Butero said:

The answer to what divides most of us is clearly doctrinal differences.  We simply interpret the Bible different.  There are some who claim to be Christians that don't believe the Bible is the Word of God, so I am not speaking of them.  Among those of us who do believe the Bible is the inerrant Word of God, the divisions come because we read the same passages and interpret them differently. 

Why do we interpret them differently?  In some cases, I think it is because of upbringing and the influence of the church we grew up in.  In other instances, it is based on the people that led us to Christ.  We came to believe what they said about doctrine was true, and there is little chance anything will change that.  In some cases, it has to do with wanting to hold on to something.  There is something we enjoy doing that most or some think is wrong in scripture, so we stand on the fact we are not under the law but grace to justify doing something that isn't clearly right.  Those on the other side fight against those people. 

Is there any solution?  I don't think so.  That is because we all come from different places, and we all have different preferences.  What is right to one is wrong to somebody else.  There are areas most can compromise on.  When I say compromise, I simply mean tolerate the position of others.  I don't mean compromise in the sense of committing sin.  Still, there will be lines they will refuse to cross, regardless of circumstances.  There are many areas where I can tolerate what I consider wrong positions, but there are some lines I won't cross if it costs me everything.  I won't be moved in those areas, and I believe that is the case with most other Christians. 

I know that there are some in the church that claim they don't care about doctrine, and they basically allow people to come into their churches and preach whatever they believe, even if it goes contrary to the beliefs of the Pastor.  I really don't understand how a principled person can do that, but it appears their position is that every wind of doctrine can be preached, and let the individuals decide what to accept.  The leadership at TBN Network seem to hold to that approach. 

The closest thing I could come up with to create at least an appearance of unity is to have one huge church in each city, rather than multitudes of churches.  This one church would have many sanctuaries with different styles of worship services.

You could have one sanctuary with a Pentecostal service, another with a charismatic service and another with a apostolic service.  Then you could have one sanctuary with a Southern Baptist service, another with an Independent Baptist Service, and one that is Freewill Baptist.  You could have a United Methodist, Bible Methodist and Evangelical Methodist.  You get the idea.  You can have services that are formal dress and casual dress.  You can have services with traditional hymns and modern praise and worship songs with the words projected on the wall.  One big church would house all of this, like a movie theater with different screens to choose from showing different films.  In theory, you could have activity taking place every day of the week in this one huge building.  While nobody would agree on anything, more than they do today, they will all be united as part of one church of that particular city.  You go there, and you choose the service you will be attending, and you won't have any reason to try to force anyone to think like you.  If you don't like one, go to another. 

I believe if you had enough choice, you would see an increase in attendance.  One of the main reasons I think church attendance has fallen off is because nobody respects anyone else's differences of opinion on how things should be.  We all see ourselves as right, and we believe we can force everyone to look at things like we do.  There are actually people that visit different churches just to try to force change on them.  If the changes are successful, they lose the old members.  Eventually the church is destroyed.  I know there are some who live in a fantasy world and think you can convince everyone to just accept everyone where they are and be united in our general faith, but that will never happen.  We all demand things our way, and if we don't get it, we refuse to attend.  If we don't get it, we fight to the spiritual death over our doctrine.  Look at the fights that have taken place here at WB over things like OSAS.  Just try to have a church that is tolerant of those who believe in OSAS and who don't, and try to let them worship in unity, having preachers telling us we can never fall from grace, while the next guy preaches we can.  It is an impossible task. 

I really wish there was a way to unify the Christian Church, but that will only be possible if we all think alike, and that is not going to happen until Jesus returns and sets us all straight.  Until then, just accept things as they are, because you can't change it. 

that was great , and I agree with you , in all of it.