False doctrine

[Riccardo]

of cause you have to think thats why God gave you a brain,  you are right we cannot give Gods word our own meaning thats why we use our brain & base scripture upon scripture. why do you think there is so much confusion,

Have you got it all right? I,m not trying to be nasty sister, I just can't see were you are coming from or how you come to your conclusion.

[ayin jade]

1 hour ago, Davida said:

Some here actually fight against the ones giving truth & challenging false hoods of others. I believe it's a lost cause and sometimes feel like deleting all of my posts and leaving.

We need a hugs reaction.

[ayin jade]

When something clearly contradicts the word of God, then its most definitely wrong doctrine.

[Neighbor]

4 hours ago, missmuffet said:

When it comes to the Holy Bible you do not have to "think" you are right. The words are right there in front of you. You can not give God's words your own meaning or spiritualize the words. That is not what God intended.

Seems a false doctrine to me! Maybe you are right and there is an increase.

But: my God has never told me to park my brain in order to come to Him. No way has He done that. His word is a challenge to those of scholarly attributes far greater than most that post on Christian message boards, certainly  self included. Demanding all stop their thinking  on the word of God seems to me a  false doctrine in of itself, or at least very poor advice.  Why? Because almost every pastor,  priest, and prophet, that I have read of has had an awakening, a humbling moment of realization as they were thinking and praying upon the word of God they were reading, that some point some understanding, some doctrine even, that they have espoused is not correct. They have then come to a pulpit or have written of their long held conclusion being wrong.  

No! God's lessons do not stop at the end of each sentence of the Bible. God help the person that decides they have read his word, every one of which is perfectly clear to them, and they may proceed without thinking from there on. 

On a practical basis if no thinking were required there would be no commentaries, no Strong's Concordance,  no "Got Questions",  no reference material of any kind, and no pastors nor teachers, not even  a Bible man.

Of course anyone should pray on and think on their understanding of what they  read in the Bible!

To read without praying and thinking is presumption, to think without reading and praying is atheism-

 

Could we really have greater false doctrines being held today than did the very people of the Bible whose legacies have been recorded for us to pray  read and think upon? Anyone been melting down all the gold in the nation to make golden calves as idols to worship lately? More false doctrine today? Doubt it.

Edited October 19, 2017 by Neighbor

[Guest shiloh357]

4 minutes ago, Neighbor said:

Seems a false doctrine to me! Maybe you are right and there is an increase.

But: my God has never told me to park my brain in order to come to Him. No way has He done that. His word is a challenge to those of scholarly attributes far greater than most that post on Christian message boards, certainly  self included. Demanding all stop their thinking  on the word of God seems to me a  false doctrine in of itself, or at least very poor advice.  Why? Because almost every pastor,  priest, and prophet, that I have read of has had an awakening, a humbling moment of realization as they were thinking and praying upon the word of God they were reading, that some point some understanding, some doctrine even, that they have espoused is not correct. They have then come to a pulpit or have written of their long held conclusion being wrong.  

No! God's lessons do not stop at the end of each sentence of the Bible. God help the person that decides they have read his word, every one of which is perfectly clear to them, and they may proceed without thinking from there on. 

On a practical basis if no thinking were required there would be no commentaries, no Strong's Concordance,  no "Got Questions",  no reference material of any kind, and no pastors nor teachers, not even  a Bible man.

Of course anyone should pray on and think on their understanding of what they  read in the Bible!

To read without praying and thinking is presumption, to think without reading and praying is atheism-

 

Could we really have greater false doctrines being held today than did the very people of the Bible whose legacies have been recorded for us to pray  read and think upon? Anyone been melting down all the gold in the nation to make golden calves as idols to worship lately? More false doctrine today? Doubt it.

When we think of the false doctrines that are being spread on this board, it usually in the form of conspiracy theories, rejection of the deity of Jesus or the person-hood of the Holy Spirit, and promotion of Roman Catholicism.

[Neighbor]

57 minutes ago, shiloh357 said:

When we think of the false doctrines that are being spread on this board, it usually in the form of conspiracy theories, rejection of the deity of Jesus or the person-hood of the Holy Spirit, and promotion of Roman Catholicism.

Hi,

Okay. Except "I" think  that there is no truly new topic to be found here, nor is it more prevalent today  that there are advocates of errors than there always have been. 

Also; I find I must reject the idea of "we think". There is no "we" think. You may pray read and think, and so may I. The Holy Spirit may enlighten each of us to the will of God for each of us individually, but neither of us thinks for the other. Unless this is to be a cult like experience where no one thinks at all. And, I know that is not the case.

The word "we" as in we think used to add credibility always bugs me- sorry for my rant against it. I just find it  to be a presumption without basis whenever and by whomever it is used. I catch myself doing it to my  own shame.

 I personally  believe from my own reading, and my own thinking, and my own prayer, that there are no greater denials of Jesus today, than have been recorded for us within the Bible to think upon and pray over.

I agree that there may be spikes in interest in a subject as one poster excites another about one theory of faith or another; but that seems to me to be the ebb and flow of conversations generating yet more thought and prayer, which is a good thing! For it also provides yet another opportunity to read, think,  pray,  over the word of God,  to share the gospel of Jesus, along with the chance to armor up  too on the word having read, thought, and prayed  over it.  

Reading  by the saints in Christ Jesus with prayer and thinking brings about much good application, as well as the stronger armoring up that enlightens and works sanctification of the saints. Even an iron sharpening iron experience sometimes occurs to the gain of all in Christ Jesus.

 

Edited October 19, 2017 by Neighbor

[GandalfTheWise]

Here is a summary of this post for those who don't want to read it all.

1. Some Christians have no clue what things are worth fighting over and what things are not worth fighting over.  I think we should have a very clear sense of what things are critical to believe and what things are arguing about the color of the carpet.

2. Some Christians think it is more important to believe the right things than it is to know God well.  (Primary symptom of this I observe: "Well, you cannot know God well unless you believe the right things first!")  I think that an ever increasing knowledge of the Truth is ultimately a result of knowing God (and His mature people) more and more.

There are Calvinists who are convinced that Arminians refuse to believe what the Bible "plainly" says; there are Arminians who are convinced that Calvinists refuse to believe what the Bible "plainly" says.   There are Pentecostals who are convinced that Cessationists refuse to believe what the Bible "plainly" says; and vice versa.  There are Christians convinced that the Bible teaches that the earth is flat; and those that don't.  There are Christians that are convinced that particular musical styles are wrong; and others that are convinced that those very same musical styles are fine.   There are some Christians that wholeheartedly believe that all women should have some type of head covering in church; and others who do not.  There are some Christians convinced that it is vital that all Christians hold the correct biblical view of the End Times.  There are Christians who believe baptism by immersion saying the name of Jesus (not Father, Son, and Holy Spirit) is necessary for salvation.  There are some Christians who believe that some denominations are in essence satanic.

On many points, the determination of "false" doctrine comes down to the opinion of individual Christians, individual congregations, and individual denominations about what the Bible "plainly" teaches.  On all of the above points I mention, there are Christians who cannot in good conscience let the above points go and not fight about them.  And on pretty much all of those points, there are Christians who point to a few proof texts where the Bible plainly says that they are correct; and then there are other Christians who point to other proof texts that prove that they are completely wrong about it.

I'll be completely blunt here.  A whole lot of "protecting truth" that I've seen over the years boils down to "I read the Bible correctly and I am very close to being right on all the important things!  Therefore anyone who disagrees very much with me is a false prophet, wolf, false teacher, heretic, not-really-a-Christian, or <fill in your favorite disparaging term for a Christian who disagrees with you>.  Praise be to God that I am one of His favored ones that holds God's Truth correctly and that I'm one of the few on the narrow path that leads to life."  Much of "protecting and proclaiming Truth" that I've seen boils down to childish "I'm right and you're wrong!!" or "I serve God better than you!!" behavior.  Frankly, not much different that the "which of us is greatest" argument the disciples liked to have or the "they weren't following us so we forbid them to do anything in your name" attitude the disciples had toward other disciples.

Deny the Trinity.  I'll come down on it like a (gently padded ) ton of bricks.  Question the deity or humanity of Christ.  I'll push back.   Argue about the color of fabric on the pews, I'll try to point out the stupidity and childishness of doing that.  Here's another blunt statement.  Most Christians I see spending large amounts of time fighting "false" doctrines really have no sense of priority as to what things are really worth contending for.  They have elevated their opinions on way too many issues as being "critical" for contending for the faith. 

Another point to be blunt on here.  Some Christians have made an idol out of "all or nothing" belief.  If you do not have the right opinion on everything, then it is impossible to serve God well.  Their entire faith in God rests on every single item that they "believe" being correct.  If a single part fails, their entire belief in God comes crashing down.  It is critical for them to know the answers to every question; how to answer every argument; having to win every argument; why?  Because their faith is NOT ultimately in God; their faith is in what they believe about God.

The key point in all of this is this.  Being a Christian is about being transformed into a new creation who lives life in a way that glorifies God; that righteousness and good works flow naturally from us; that love, joy, peace, patience, kindness, gentleness, self-control, and the like are the characteristics of our life; that we come to know God more and more as we consistently walk with Him.   Believing the right things about God ultimately comes from knowing God more and more; not memorizing proof texts and counter proof texts;  from closely observing those who truly exhibit fruit of the Spirit in their lives, those whose prayers are answered, who truly minister to those around them; not from those who are strongly opinionated and spend much of their time pointing out "problems" in God's other children.   God gave us the Bible to reveal Himself to us.  To the extent we search the scriptures to learn more about Him, we are using it well.  To the extent we search the scriptures for minutia, hidden spiritual truth, rules and recipes, and ways to win arguments, I think we are missing the point.

Brothers and Sisters!  Believing the right things about God ultimately comes from knowing God from spending time with Him.  Holiness and a changed life does not come from talking about it; it does not come from knowing and following the right rules about what is and what is not sin; it does not come from trying our hardest to be righteous; it comes from God's presence in our life changing and transforming us.  Sin does not really decrease in our life because we learn more about what it is and try to avoid it, or because we try harder, exercise our willpower, find accountability partners, or other efforts to mitigate it.  That's trying to achieve holiness through our own strength.  Sin decreases and righteousness and holiness increases by God's presence in our life increasing.  This does not come about from having the correct biblical view on every possible issue that might arise; it comes from knowing God more and more; it comes from consistently spending time walking with God; it comes from consistently spending time with very mature Christians (and not merely outspoken and opinionated ones!!)  who know God very well themselves and exhibit a lot of natural spiritual fruit in their life (and not just self-imposed follow-strict-rules behavior).

 

[Unfailing Presence]

False doctrines are not living water . 

They never satisfy , give rest , give joy , give peace . 

Instead they provide , disillusionment , disharmony , worry , weariness . 

In this they are always easily identifiable . 

Only the doctrines of Living water provide true rest unto the soul . 

In this they are also just as easily indentifiable .

                                                         " There remaineth therefore a rest to the people of God "    ( Hebrews 4 : 9 )  

[Guest shiloh357]

4 minutes ago, Neighbor said:

Hi,

Okay. Except "I" think  that there is no truly new topic to be found here, nor is it more prevalent today  that there are advocates of errors then there always have been. 

I have  been here for  over 13 years.   I know what I am talking about.  There is stuff that is being allowed to surface here only because for a long time, there were more moderators than there are now. And there is stuff coming up now that we have not seen before, for that reason.

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The word "we" as in we think used to add credibility always bugs me- sorry for my rant against it.

I really don't care if it bugs you or not.  

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I just find it  to be a presumption without basis whenever and by whomever it is used. I catch myself doing it to my  own shame.

I am not being presumptuous.  I am simply operating from a lot more knowledge about the history of this board than you are.

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 I personally  believe from my own reading, and my own thinking, and my own prayer, that there are no greater denials of Jesus today, than have been recorded for us within the Bible to think upon and pray over.

Not greater, but newer forms of it.

 

[the watchman]

false doctrine is any thing out side the persons personal belief................................... correct  ?