Mark of the beast

[iamlamad]

18 hours ago, ARGOSY said:

I don't agree with the Michael view. Neither do I agree with the view that the restrainer is the Holy Spirit, we are looking for some entity that is KEEPING SECRETS, hiding the identity of the antichrist and hiding the secret lawlessness.  This is what the wording is saying, something is HIDING DARK SECRETS:

 Don’t let anyone deceive you in any way, for that day will not come until the rebellion occurs and the man of lawlessness is revealed..............And now you know what is holding him back (from being revealed), so that he may be revealed at the proper time.  For the secret power of lawlessness is already at work; but the one who now holds it back will continue to do so till he is taken out of the way.  And then the lawless one will be revealed

Some claim there is a theme of lawlessness being held back by the Holy Spirit, but that is not reading the text clearly at all.  The text is saying the EXPOSURE/REVEALING  of the antichrist is being held back, and this is a SECRET lawlessness that ALREADY EXISTS.

Some evil entity is keeping secrets folks!! To know who, we have to look through scripture for an evil entity removed suddenly from his place of authority, at the same time the antichrist comes to power for 42 months.

As I read it, the man of sin will be revealed (as the man who will turn into the Antichrist Beast) when He enters the  temple and declares he is the God of the Jews. 

Paul tells us that he is being hindered or restrained so he cannot be revealed until the proper time.  It is the Holy Spirit, working through the church, that is restraining or holding the man of sin back.  When the church is taken out of the way, THEN the man of sin can be revealed. After the rapture, the Holy Spirit will have no one through whom He can work. You see, He has no authority on earth except working through believers. WE have the authority.  Satan is still the spiritual ruler of this planet, and will be until the midpoint of the 70th week. 

Satan is the lawless one! Much of what he does is secret.  He is grooming the man of sin and getting him ready - but this is being done in secret.  Once the church is raptured - taken out of the way - THEN the man will enter the new temple and declare he is God.

[iamlamad]

On 2/11/2019 at 12:16 PM, ARGOSY said:

The interesting thing is that these events occur exactly 3.5 years before the end. There are dark secrets, secrets of lawlessness. There is lawlessness currently on the earth, and yet the full truth of these secrets is not revealed to us (the church).  Yet something will be REMOVED, then all these dark secrets will be revealed, the secret lawlesness will be exposed for what it is:

And now you know what is holding him back, so that he may be revealed at the proper time. ⁷ For the secret power of lawlessness is already at work; but the one who now holds it back will continue to do so till he is taken out of the way. ⁸ And then the lawless one will be revealed

It just so happens, that at the SAME moment that the antichrist is revealed for 42 months of rule (Rev 13), Satan is cast out from heaven in a great battle caused by the victory of the church as per Rev 12. Satan's wrath on earth is for the same time period, 1260 days (42 months).  

So in summary, the withholder is REMOVED/TAKEN OUT THE WAY, at the SAME TIME as Satan is REMOVED/TAKEN OUT OF HEAVEN through the victory of the church. This is when the SECRET (of lawlessness) is no longer held back because the antichrist is REVEALED, he is no longer a secret. 

I think there is another reason Satan is cast down. His only claim to earth is that He usurped Adam's lease. I believe Adam was given a 6000 year lease - but at the midpoint of the 70th week that lease will EXPIRE, and suddenly Satan will have no legal hold to earth. So the kingdoms of the world are given back to their rightful owner, Jesus Christ. And then Satan is cast down. 

[ARGOSY]

22 hours ago, Littlelambseativy said:

Stop and think Who is strong enough to restrain Satan.

some say the devil is the Restrainer...is he mightier than the Holy Spirit Who was active in the creation of the universe? Who keeps each member of the church safe...No...satan cannot withstand the Holy Spirit, Who strengthened Jesus against Satan when He was tempted.

Some say the church is the Restrainer... is the church mightier than the Holy Spirit..or does the church depend ON the Holy Spirit to keep it safe and free from sin...can the church ( even United ) withstand Satan? I cannot accept that. The members of the church still sin daily and need forgiveness daily.

the ONLY One who can restrain Satan is the Holy Spirit, the Spirit Who does God’s bidding.... the Holy Spirit Who  is God.

The chapter says nothing about restraining the holy spirit. It is all about restraining the revealing. Holding back the secret power, then this sudden revealing. That's the context.

[ARGOSY]

13 hours ago, iamlamad said:

I think there is another reason Satan is cast down. His only claim to earth is that He usurped Adam's lease. I believe Adam was given a 6000 year lease - but at the midpoint of the 70th week that lease will EXPIRE, and suddenly Satan will have no legal hold to earth. So the kingdoms of the world are given back to their rightful owner, Jesus Christ. And then Satan is cast down. 

Rev 12 says we overcome through our testimony. It is the preaching of the Gospel to all nations that overcomes Satan. Thus the church removes the accuser from heaven, and the antichrist is then revealed at the same moment.

[ARGOSY]

13 hours ago, iamlamad said:

As I read it, the man of sin will be revealed (as the man who will turn into the Antichrist Beast) when He enters the  temple and declares he is the God of the Jews. 

Paul tells us that he is being hindered or restrained so he cannot be revealed until the proper time.  It is the Holy Spirit, working through the church, that is restraining or holding the man of sin back.  When the church is taken out of the way, THEN the man of sin can be revealed. After the rapture, the Holy Spirit will have no one through whom He can work. You see, He has no authority on earth except working through believers. WE have the authority.  Satan is still the spiritual ruler of this planet, and will be until the midpoint of the 70th week. 

Satan is the lawless one! Much of what he does is secret.  He is grooming the man of sin and getting him ready - but this is being done in secret.  Once the church is raptured - taken out of the way - THEN the man will enter the new temple and declare he is God.

Are you saying that the holy spirit is deliberately keeping the identity of the antichrist secret, and deliberately keeping the secret lawlessness a secret? Doesn't sound very godly.

[Last Daze]

2 hours ago, ARGOSY said:

The chapter says nothing about restraining the holy spirit. It is all about restraining the revealing. Holding back the secret power, then this sudden revealing. That's the context.

Agreed.  The man of sin himself hasn't been restrained for ~ two thousand years, however, the evil angel beast that empowers his revealing was being restrained in the abyss.  He is currently setting the stage for the revealing of the man of sin.

[Michael37]

This planet is crawling with demons of various function, rank, and position. The French President, Emmanuel Macron is being seriously corrupted, deceived, and exploited by the same principalities and powers of darkness assigned to achieve global satanic supremacy that manifested in Hitler, Lenin, Stalin, Ceaușescu, et al. These, and all tyrants to date have all been restrained from achieving global dominance by people opposed to their tyranny. It is when there is no-one motivated to oppose the ultimate end-times tyranny, having been prevented as prophesied, that the "man of sin" is finally empowered by the collective will of corrupt humanity seated on satan's throne.  

2Th 2:7 For the mystery of iniquity does already work: only he who now restrains will restrain, until he be taken out of the way.
Rev 13:2 And the beast which I saw was like unto a leopard, and his feet were as the feet of a bear, and his mouth as the mouth of a lion: and the dragon gave him his power, and his throne, and great authority.
 

 Macron: Believes he can be like the Roman god Jupiter

 Top Sites: Macron Manifesting the god Jupiter

QUOTE: Macron himself has said he plans a “Jupiterian” presidency - as a remote, dignified figure, like the Roman god of gods, who weighs his rare pronouncements carefully. It would be a marked break from his unpopular and often-mocked predecessor Francois Hollande’s man-of-the-people style. Reuters France Politics

[iamlamad]

6 hours ago, ARGOSY said:

Are you saying that the holy spirit is deliberately keeping the identity of the antichrist secret, and deliberately keeping the secret lawlessness a secret? Doesn't sound very godly.

Why should the Holy Spirit tell anyone? Paul wrote that he would be revealed. We know he will be revealed when he enters the temple and declares he is God. It is evident that God does not want people to know why he is before that point in time. Some may have guesses. Maybe someone will guess right ahead of time.

God has never revealed much of the kingdom of Satan and how he operates.  That is HIS choice, and we have nothing to do with it.  You forget, this is Satan's world now. God has no authority here on earth except what we, His kids, give Him.  In other words, when Adam sold out to the devil, he limited what God could do on earth. God had to start with one man, and work from there to gain some authority. He chose Abraham. 

Are you blaming God?

[iamlamad]

4 hours ago, Last Daze said:

Agreed.  The man of sin himself hasn't been restrained for ~ two thousand years, however, the evil angel beast that empowers his revealing was being restrained in the abyss.  He is currently setting the stage for the revealing of the man of sin.

The man himself has not been alive for 2000 years. Maybe 20, maybe 40 or 60.

Perhaps you meant the antichrist spirit that has been at work.

Edited February 13, 2019 by iamlamad

[ARGOSY]

9 hours ago, iamlamad said:

Why should the Holy Spirit tell anyone? Paul wrote that he would be revealed. We know he will be revealed when he enters the temple and declares he is God. It is evident that God does not want people to know why he is before that point in time. Some may have guesses. Maybe someone will guess right ahead of time.

God has never revealed much of the kingdom of Satan and how he operates.  That is HIS choice, and we have nothing to do with it. 

Sure that is one way of looking at it. But other than your opinion, you have given no biblical evidence why your view is better than mine, or why my view is bilbically inaccurate. 

In the meantime my view has THREE advantages:

1) 2 Thess 2 if you read it clearly is about holding back a secret identity, rather than holding back lawlessness as others seem to think

2)  Although you think it's possible God keeps this secret, it is normally the role of good to expose evil, and the role of evil to hide evil

3) Rev 12 shows that a significant entity (Satan) is taken out of heaven at the SAME TIME as the restrainer is taken out the way (antichrist and Satan BOTH have 3.5 years left)

Your view may be possible, my view actually gives biblical support for an entity taken out the way at the right time.