rev 12 does revelation speak of a new king

[Jayne]

John plainly and clearly says in verse 1 that what he is reporting is a sign - meaning not literal, but representative of something else.

PART I:  The PAST

Verses 1-2 = "a woman with a crown of 12 stars [12 tribes of Israel], pregnant and  crying out in birth pains".  This is Israel.  And Jesus is about to be born from that nation and at that time they were suffering pain from the persecution of Rome.

Verses 3-4 = "the great dragon, with seven heads, ten horns, and seven diadems, sweeping one third of stars from heaven, and standing before the woman ready to devour her baby".  This is the devil.  The book of Revelation makes that clear in chapter 20.  He took one third of the angels with him when he fell from heaven and they became fallen angels [demons].  He was ready to kill Jesus when he was born, using Herod to slaughter the baby boys two and  under when Jesus was born.

Verse 5 = Jesus was born.

 

PARTII:  THE FUTURE

Verse 5 continued - "and he will rule all nations with a "rod of iron" [Psalm 2 also says this about Jesus].  Jesus will return for a 1000 years earthly reign.

Verse 6 = "The woman flees to the wilderness for 1260 days to a place where God protects her."  During the tribulation, God will protect Israel from the devil and enemies.

Verses 7-9 = During the midpoint of the 7-year tribulation, there will be a great war in heaven between the dragon [devil] and his angels against Michael and his angels.  The dragon and his angels will be vanquished and cast down for good. [Right now, some of them do have access to heaven.  The devil accuses us before God day and night the Bible says]

Verses 10-12 = A loud voice cries out the authority of Jesus Christ.  And how Christians who have been accused by the devil have been victorious because of the blood of Christ.  The voice tells heaven to rejoice, but tells earth to  beware.  With the devil being cast down for good, he knows his time is short and he is about to come against the remaining humanity in great wrath.

Verses 13-17 = The dragon, the devil, is obviously the most enraged with Israel.  But as said before God is going to help her flee to a hiding place where he will protect Israel for 3 1/2 years.  The devil will come after her with a "flood" - I don't know what that means, but in accordance with the chapter it is not real flood waters.  God protects Israel from that.  Finally, the dragon, the devil, goes after the rest of the woman's children.  These are the saved Gentiles of the tribulation.  Life is going to be very, very hard for those 3 1/2 years for people who are saved.

Edited January 6, 2019 by Jayne

[Diaste]

8 hours ago, Jayne said:

John plainly and clearly says in verse 1 that what he is reporting is a sign - meaning not literal, but representative of something else.

PART I:  The PAST

Verses 1-2 = "a woman with a crown of 12 stars [12 tribes of Israel], pregnant and  crying out in birth pains".  This is Israel.  And Jesus is about to be born from that nation and at that time they were suffering pain from the persecution of Rome.

Verses 3-4 = "the great dragon, with seven heads, ten horns, and seven diadems, sweeping one third of stars from heaven, and standing before the woman ready to devour her baby".  This is the devil.  The book of Revelation makes that clear in chapter 20.  He took one third of the angels with him when he fell from heaven and they became fallen angels [demons].  He was ready to kill Jesus when he was born, using Herod to slaughter the baby boys two and  under when Jesus was born.

Verse 5 = Jesus was born.

 

PARTII:  THE FUTURE

Verse 5 continued - "and he will rule all nations with a "rod of iron" [Psalm 2 also says this about Jesus].  Jesus will return for a 1000 years earthly reign.

Verse 6 = "The woman flees to the wilderness for 1260 days to a place where God protects her."  During the tribulation, God will protect Israel from the devil and enemies.

Verses 7-9 = During the midpoint of the 7-year tribulation, there will be a great war in heaven between the dragon [devil] and his angels against Michael and his angels.  The dragon and his angels will be vanquished and cast down for good. [Right now, some of them do have access to heaven.  The devil accuses us before God day and night the Bible says]

Verses 10-12 = A loud voice cries out the authority of Jesus Christ.  And how Christians who have been accused by the devil have been victorious because of the blood of Christ.  The voice tells heaven to rejoice, but tells earth to  beware.  With the devil being cast down for good, he knows his time is short and he is about to come against the remaining humanity in great wrath.

Verses 13-17 = The dragon, the devil, is obviously the most enraged with Israel.  But as said before God is going to help her flee to a hiding place where he will protect Israel for 3 1/2 years.  The devil will come after her with a "flood" - I don't know what that means, but in accordance with the chapter it is not real flood waters.  God protects Israel from that.  Finally, the dragon, the devil, goes after the rest of the woman's children.  These are the saved Gentiles of the tribulation.  Life is going to be very, very hard for those 3 1/2 years for people who are saved.

Well put and biblically accurate.

[Diaste]

9 hours ago, Oseas Ramos de Siqueira said:

Sorry? I do not agree.

Ok.

[n2thelight]

On 1/2/2019 at 7:23 AM, noblenut said:

to Christians there is no other king besides Jesus, but rev 12 prophesies the birth of a child, one who will rule with an iron sceptre which he also states in rev 2 and 19.

Are you a Christian?

[nobleseed]

yes i am

[other one]

On ‎1‎/‎5‎/‎2019 at 2:08 AM, noblenut said:

you are speaking complete nonsense and i have no idea wat your talking about, the prophesy is sbout a woman giving birth to a child do not go beyond wat is written and take the passage for wat it is, twisted minds distort this and talk rubbish

I don't think this tone will get anyone to pay any attention to your thoughts on the subject.    I would be interested in your thoughts about the whole subject without putting others down.

[other one]

On ‎1‎/‎5‎/‎2019 at 2:08 AM, noblenut said:

you are speaking complete nonsense and i have no idea wat your talking about, the prophesy is sbout a woman giving birth to a child do not go beyond wat is written and take the passage for wat it is, twisted minds distort this and talk rubbish

I don't think this tone will get anyone to pay any attention to your thoughts on the subject.    I would be interested in your thoughts about the whole subject without putting others down.

[other one]

On ‎1‎/‎5‎/‎2019 at 2:08 AM, noblenut said:

you are speaking complete nonsense and i have no idea wat your talking about, the prophesy is sbout a woman giving birth to a child do not go beyond wat is written and take the passage for wat it is, twisted minds distort this and talk rubbish

I don't think this tone will get anyone to pay any attention to your thoughts on the subject.    I would be interested in your thoughts about the whole subject without putting others down.

[other one]

On ‎1‎/‎5‎/‎2019 at 2:08 AM, noblenut said:

you are speaking complete nonsense and i have no idea wat your talking about, the prophesy is sbout a woman giving birth to a child do not go beyond wat is written and take the passage for wat it is, twisted minds distort this and talk rubbish

I don't think this tone will get anyone to pay any attention to your thoughts on the subject.    I would be interested in your thoughts about the whole subject without putting others down.

[Jayne]

44 minutes ago, Oseas Ramos de Siqueira said:

Did not you and all them as you read what JESUS said unto John and unto us too (Revealation 1:v.1) that the things of the book of Revelation or Apocalypse would go to happen in the future? 

How can you change what JESUS said,  by trying to teach us that verse 5 of the Apocalypse or Revelation is the birth of JESUS?

In my understanding you need to study this more deeply, it because the thing you are preaching saying that has happened in the past, Jesus has announced that it would happen in the future.

 

Chapter 12, if it began with the future description would not show the complete picture.  Jesus, via John begins with the past - connecting ALL the dots - to give the reader the full  understanding of what is happening.  You can't  understand the future if you don't understand the past.  Christ giving this past background to support the future events does not violate what he said when he said "things to shortly come."

Also, Jesus messages to the churches in Asia were messages to churches and their past behaviors.