The Chronological Order Of The Revelation

[JoeCanada]

4 hours ago, Revelation Man said:

No you didn't, YOU THINK you did, n ow I will agree with you think you did, but you can't because its the same event. 

No, its referring to Armageddon. Where the FOWLS of Heaven {a Metaphor for the bride by that time, will be at, defeating the Beast and his minions at the Marriage Feast. Its seems you miss the forest for the trees. The whole point Jesus is making {which seems to escape you} is, hes telling the Jews Hey, do not be DECEIVED !! Don't got to the LIAR who says hes the Messiah/Christ in the Desert or in the Secret Store Room {this is because if they leave the Petra/Bozrah area they will be killed, BUT they won't, because Jesus says....CATCH THIS.......BEHOLD, I have told you before[hand]. THUS they will not be DECEIVED !! Because they are looking towards the Eastern Skies for Jesus to ride in on the clouds. Then he comes according to the Old Testament from the Petra/Bozrah area, with bloodstains { with the Wine-press stains} on his garment. 

Jesus lands on Mt. Zion, defeats the Beast at Armageddon and then he will rule for 1000 years. Rev. 19 CLEARLY tells us the Marriage Feast is where the fowls are gathered, that is the CLUE !! Where will you be at Jesus? Where do the Fowls/Eagle gather ? Where the Carcass is at.........where will Jesus be at? Where the EVIL EXISTS that needs to be DEFEATED, of course !!Not in a Store Room or Desert Preaching, hes come this time as a CONQUEROR !! Thus the White Horse !!

That you can see.............But then again you can't see the Rapture, so I am not looking to you for perception brother, I am just not. That doesn't mean you are not a fine Christian gentleman, winning souls for the kingdom of Christ. It is what it is.

Jesus never gave the Rapture understanding to anyone until Paul came along. Matthew has the Rapture AFTER the Second Coming in verse 36-51 whilst the Second Coming is in verses 29-31. That is what was meant by it being a SECRET, that is why they didn't understand it. Seems like that would register with you brother. After the Tribulation we get the Second Coming. FACT.

The Church CLEARLY RETURNS with the Lord, see Rev. 19, this is what one gets when they have to stick to a doctrine because that's what they have decided to go with. Its best to just go with the Scriptures. 

You can't even see the Church coming back in Rev. 19 !! I don't expect up to see the same things therefore. Rev. 19 and Matt. 24:29-31 is the Second Coming.

BADA BING !!

God Bless brother. It will clear up when we get to Heaven for you. The things I don't know will clear up for me. I try to stick with whats been revealed, and then In say, this is my understanding on this but its nor revelation, if I am seeing darkly. I don't see darkly on the Book of Revelation however. Its a gift from above. 

Revman,

Let's compare:

Events in Matt 24:30-31                                                                                              Events in Rev 19:11-16,19

Jesus comes on the clouds.....no horse....                                                                    Jesus rides a white horse.....no clouds

Jesus blows a trumpet                                                                                                  Jesus has a sword coming from His mouth

Jesus comes with His angels                                                                                        Jesus is followed by the saints on white horses

Jesus comes to gather the elect                                                                                    Jesus comes with the elect to destroy the antichrist

The events couldn't be more dissimilar!

"No, its referring to Armageddon. Where the FOWLS of Heaven {a Metaphor for the bride by that time, will be at, defeating the Beast and his minions at the Marriage Feast"

Ah yes. Everything that can't be explained  has to be  a metaphor. You  spiritualize, allegorize, contextualise, customize and personalize scripture.....leaving the primary interpretation untouched. 

The Church CLEARLY RETURNS with the Lord, see Rev. 19,................You can't even see the Church coming back in Rev. 19 !!

Where did you get this from? I never stated anywhere that I don't see the church coming back in Rev 19. Of course I do. It's right there in scripture.

Perhaps you can't see the difference in Matt 24:29-31 because you believe that all of Matt 24, the Olivet Discourse, is for the Jews and not the Church. 

Is this a fair assumption?

[Revelation Man]

20 hours ago, JoeCanada said:

Revman,

Let's compare:

Events in Matt 24:30-31                                                                                              Events in Rev 19:11-16,19

Jesus comes on the clouds.....no horse....                                                                    Jesus rides a white horse.....no clouds

You do understand that the White Horse is a Metaphor for a "CONQUEROR" right ? The Anti-Christ goes forth Conquering on a White Horse {for three years}. Likewise when he is then defeated by Jesus, its Jesus who is "RIDING" the White Horse in Rev. 19, which happens in Rev. 16. I doubt either one is riding a White Horse brother, its a Metaphor, as the book of Revelation is wont to do. So Jesus returning in the Clouds as a King of Kings in Matt. 24 is the same event as the White Horse. You can't try to MAKE different books of the bible emphasize things in like manner. One is pointing to Jesus returning to save the Jews, and to be their King of Kings and only a HINT of Armageddon is given, whilst in Rev. 19 Jesus is being designated as a Conqueror, who throws a Marriage Feast Party for His faithful Bride, while vanquishing the evil opposition. 

20 hours ago, JoeCanada said:

Jesus blows a trumpet                                                                                                  Jesus has a sword coming from His mouth

Jesus comes with His angels                                                                                        Jesus is followed by the saints on white horses

Jesus comes to gather the elect                                                                                    Jesus comes with the elect to destroy the antichrist

The events couldn't be more dissimilar!

So this is self explanatory, I explained above why they are different and were intended to be different. Matthew was shown NONE of the things John was shown. That was not his calling, the Gospels are a TESTIMONY to the Life of Christ on earth, and his coming rule for 1000 years is only mentioned via a glancing bow so to speak, whilst Revelation is about the 70th week troubles and Jesus Conquering Evil, before his reign on earth for 1000 years starts.

20 hours ago, JoeCanada said:

"No, its referring to Armageddon. Where the FOWLS of Heaven {a Metaphor for the bride by that time, will be at, defeating the Beast and his minions at the Marriage Feast"

Ah yes. Everything that can't be explained  has to be  a metaphor. You  spiritualize, allegorize, contextualise, customize and personalize scripture.....leaving the primary interpretation untouched. 

Or........NO, you just don't entirely grasp what the book of Revelation is saying and thus you can't see what I see, is that possible ? Yes, we know the book of Revelation is one GIANT CODE BOOK, out of 404 verses 289 reference the Old Testament. Jesus told the Disciples why he spoke to them in Parables, so they hearing would understand and SEE..........but the world hearing would NOT UNDERSTAND nor see !! So why are we given the END TIME GAME PLAN in Metaphors ? Because that is what Jesus/God does, they give us coded messages that only we can understand.....and that is my gift, its what I do. And since I am right and you seem to me to be off kilter, it would be you who are PERSONALIZING these verses......SEE, we can all say that, but it really means nothing, the truth is still the truth. 

 

20 hours ago, JoeCanada said:

The Church CLEARLY RETURNS with the Lord, see Rev. 19,................You can't even see the Church coming back in Rev. 19 !!

Where did you get this from? I never stated anywhere that I don't see the church coming back in Rev 19. Of course I do. It's right there in scripture.

Perhaps you can't see the difference in Matt 24:29-31 because you believe that all of Matt 24, the Olivet Discourse, is for the Jews and not the Church. 

Is this a fair assumption?

Ohhh, so you SEE The Church in Rev. 19 coming back to defeat the Beast and his minions but you don't see the Pre trib Rapture. That's very odd to me. The Jews will be Messianic Jews by then so what does it matter ? It won't be for the Church because we are in Heaven for 7 years and the REMNANT CHURCH are going to mostly be Martyred. To tell you the truth, Matt. 24 is a witness to the Wicked also, because the Jews are protected in Petra, the Remnant Church is mostly killed off by this maniac, so its a TESTIMONY against the wicked, they can read their own demise so to speak. 

But mostly, its to warn the Jews {1/3 who repent before the DOTL} that they need to Flee Judea when they see the AoD, and NOT TO BUY INTO the Anti-Christ and False Prophets lies. I mean, from verse 15 on it's almost exclusively to the Jews who are by this time Messianic Jews, at least the ones who flee Judea and survive are. 

Now if you had to do what Jesus had to do, inform the Jews what THEY NEEDED TO DO, in order to not get killed off so that God's Covenant with Abraham could be fulfilled in full, as promised, that Abraham would have continual seed, forever. In this case what would you do? Remember, God can't lie !! So Jesus had to INFORM the Jews what they needed to do when they see this certain event, the AoD. By the way, its not the Anti-Christ that commits the AoD, its the False Prophet {a Jewish High Priest like unto Jason under Antiochus}. After the Jews REPENT, and therefore, IMHO, are serving Jesus in Jerusalem and thus my guess is a 1/3 will be worshiping Jesus in the Temple of God by that time, so this Jewish High Priest is seething at this, and he FORBIDS Jesus Worship {takes away the SACRIFICE} AND THEN places the thing that ought not STAND in the Temple {Image of the Beast/E.U. President} and Jesus called it an Abomination !! You see, THEY GO HAND IN HAND !! You stop Jesus/Messiah Worship, AND you place a Graven Image in the Temple. Jesus during these END TIMES will be THE SACRIFICE will he not ? Of course he is !! So why do you, and many others, think Jesus/Gabriel were speaking about a PROFANE SACRIFICE being taken away ? That makes no sense brother !! 

Its Jesus Worship that is STOPPED, thus the Temple was Holy, and BECAME PROFANED by the False Prophets Actions !! Thus the Jews KNOW TO FLEE Judea !! They get a 30 days heads-up, at the 1290, which is 1290 days from the Second Coming, and 30 days before the 1260, which is 1260 days before the Second Coming, and where the Anti-Christ Conquers Jerusalem/Mediterranean Sea Region Nations. So why wouldn't it be about Israel and the Jews ? Why would Satan want to DECEIVE the masses ? To make you think Jesus is speaking about the Church so he can confuse the Messianic Jews in the last days, and its confusing the Church now-a-days,  instead of leaving  proper instructions, some are planing to be here with the Jews during the 70th week, when they will not be here.

Edited April 2, 2020 by Revelation Man

[not an echo]

 

On 3/30/2020 at 9:00 PM, Revelation Man said:

On 3/29/2020 at 3:38 AM, Revelation Man said:

You do realize nothing happens until ALL SEVEN SEALS are opened right ? Lets see, QUESTION........When can you read the scroll below?  

We can ONLY READ the Parchment, AFTER all 7 Seals are opened !! 

not an echo had said this:  I agree with this wholeheartedly!  You can see this in my thread, "A Title Suggestion for the Seven Sealed Book."  Just a little side bar...Can you show me anything after the opening of the 6th Seal through the Great White Throne Judgment that is not a part of the period of the Day of the Lord?

Good catch Revelation Man.  On this one, I'm embarrassed and kicking myself for not more closely proof-reading what I wrote.  I guess I was overly weary.   I certainly meant the 7th Seal, as my other posts will bear out, as well as my statement, "I agree with this wholeheartedly!"  Also, in my thread, "A Title Suggestion for the Seven Sealed Book," I make this clear as well (see for example my March 3 post).  With this said, let me once again ask all, as I meant to ask you:  Can you show me anything after the opening of 7th Seal through the Great White Throne Judgment that is not a part of the period of the Day of the Lord?  The answer to this question should establish that my title suggestion for the Seven Sealed Book---THE DAY OF THE LORD---is a fitting and helpful interpretative thought. 

Now, do note that I point out that both the 6th and 7th Seals can be opened the same DAY, as there is nothing in Scripture that forbids this possibility.  Which makes the people's cry, "For the great DAY of His wrath is come..." (Rev. 6:17) all the more truthful.   

Edited February 1, 2023 by not an echo
the picture was doubled

[JoeCanada]

2 hours ago, Revelation Man said:

You do understand that the White Horse is a Metaphor for a "CONQUEROR" right ? The Anti-Christ goes forth Conquering on a White Horse {for three years}. Likewise when he is then defeated by Jesus, its Jesus who is "RIDING" the White Horse in Rev. 19, which happens in Rev. 16. I doubt either one is riding a White Horse brother, its a Metaphor, as the book of Revelation is wont to do. So Jesus returning in the Clouds as a King of Kings in Matt. 24 is the same event as the White Horse. You can't try to MAKE different books of the bible Emphasize things in lie manner. One is pointing to Jesus returning to save the Jews, and to be their King of Kings and only a HINT of Armageddon is given, whilst in Rev. Jesus is being designated as a Conqueror, who throws a Marriage Feast Party for His faithful Bride, while vanquishing the evil opposition. 

Why yes yes, of course...everything that can't be explained is a metaphor. It's all a metaphor. The whole book is a metaphor!!!

Likewise when he is then defeated by Jesus, its Jesus who is "RIDING" the White Horse in Rev. 19, which happens in Rev. 16

Is this another metaphor? Or allegory....or spiritualized ..... or maybe its just your interpretation. Dunno!

2 hours ago, Revelation Man said:

Or........NO, you just don't entirely grasp what the book of Revelation is saying and thus you can't see what I see, is that possible ? Yes, we know the book of Revelation is one GIANT CODE BOOK, out of 404 verses 289 reference the Old Testament. Jesus told the Disciples why he spoke to them in Parables, so they hearing would understand and SEE..........but the world hearing would NOT UNDERSTAND nor see !! So why are we given the END TIME GAME PLAN in Metaphors ? Because that is what Jesus/God does, they give us coded messages that only we can understand.....and that is my gift, its what I do. And since I am right and you seem to me to be off kilter, it would be you who are PERSONALIZING these verses......SEE, we can all say that, but it really means nothing, the truth is still the truth. 

God/Jesus......they give ( ME )us coded messages that only we ( I ) can understand.....and that is my gift, its what I do.................And since I am right

More nonsense!

As for the rest of your reply.....

I can only shake my head in disbelief.........and maybe bang it against the wall.......

Respectfully......

[not an echo]

On 3/30/2020 at 9:00 PM, Revelation Man said:

Well, if you had something that was a DEEP SECRET, and everyone differed on it like the 1260, 1290 and 1335, then I might say, let me look at it. But everyone knows or should know the 6th Seal doesn't even come to pass until the 7th Seal is opened. I think you miss the point, a lot of people have a PRE WRATH Rapture {Well, not a lot...but more than you imagine}. 

Not sure if I'm understanding you here.  Do you mean, everyone knows or should know the 7th Seal doesn't even come to pass until the 6th Seal is opened?

[Revelation Man]

11 hours ago, JoeCanada said:

Why yes yes, of course...everything that can't be explained is a metaphor. It's all a metaphor. The whole book is a metaphor!!!

Likewise when he is then defeated by Jesus, its Jesus who is "RIDING" the White Horse in Rev. 19, which happens in Rev. 16

Is this another metaphor? Or allegory....or spiritualized ..... or maybe its just your interpretation. Dunno!

No, this is called a Parenthetical Citation brother. If you bothered reading my posts instead of trying to prove them wrong, when they are correct, you would have learned by now why Rev. 11 {7th Trump blowing} Rev. 14:18-20, Rev. 16:19 and Rev. 19:14-20 are all the EXACT SAME EVENT, the Fall of Babylon {World under Satan's Dark Rule FALLS}. When you get to heaven and find out I was right on all these things you gonna blow a gasket !! But, you will have a new body by then so it will be OK !! 

11 hours ago, JoeCanada said:

God/Jesus......they give ( ME )us coded messages that only we ( I ) can understand.....and that is my gift, its what I do.................And since I am right

More nonsense!

As for the rest of your reply.....

I can only shake my head in disbelief.........and maybe bang it against the wall.......

Respectfully......

Maybe you need to prayer more.....then you could learn how to hear that small still voice as easy as I do. Satan still roams the earth, and seeks out those who he can confuse, to this day. He loves mixing in Biblical half truths brother. 

God Bless....

Edited April 2, 2020 by Revelation Man

[Revelation Man]

11 hours ago, not an echo said:

Good catch Revelation Man.  On this one, I'm embarrassed and kicking myself for not more closely proof-reading what I wrote.  I guess I was overly weary.   I certainly meant the 7th Seal, as my other posts will bear out, as well as my statement, "I agree with this wholeheartedly!"  Also, in my thread, "A Title Suggestion for the Seven Sealed Book," I make this clear as well (see for example my March 3 post).  With this said, let me once again ask all, as I meant to ask you:  Can you show me anything after the opening of 7th Seal through the Great White Throne Judgment that is not a part of the period of the Day of the Lord?  The answer to this question should establish that my title suggestion for the Seven Sealed Book---THE DAY OF THE LORD---is a fitting and helpful interpretative thought. 

Now, do note that I point out that both the 6th and 7th Seals can be opened the same DAY, as there is nothing in Scripture that forbids this possibility.  Which makes the people's cry, "For the great DAY of His wrath is come..." (Rev. 6:17) all the more truthful.   

Edited 10 hours ago by not an echo

I think they are all opened on the same day and within minutes, we see the Church in Heaven BEFORE the Seals are ever opened. 

11 hours ago, not an echo said:

Not sure if I'm understanding you here.  Do you mean, everyone knows or should know the 7th Seal doesn't even come to pass until the 6th Seal is opened?

I think they were speaking there about the 6th Seal Wrath, and I am pointing out that the 6th Seal Wrath is like the 1st-4th Seal Horses, they are all going to begin on day 1261, as will the 5th Seal Martyrs, and the Wrath of God will run for 1260 days, the same number of days the Beast {Seals 1-5} is allowed to Rule via tyrannical rule, which brings many Martyrs.

In other words, the Seals are READYING the Trumps and Vial Judgments, Jesus is opening them up an d saying, these are IMPORTANT JUDGMENTS, BE YE WARNED !! The Anti-Christ is going to do THIS {White Horse} THIS {Red Horse} THIS {Black Horse} THIS {Pale Green Horse} and THIS {Martyrs} and God is going to do this to his Wicked Servants {6th Seal}..............as soon as the 7th Seal is opened !! BOOM..............Now Israel {144,000} Flee ye to Petra before these Trumpet Judgments start !! So the Rev. 7 Events ARE the 1290-1260 days....LOL......WOW....This just sent chills down my spine, I can even give a specific time frame on chapter 7 now !! Its a 30 day window !! We see the SAME THING HERE:

Rev. 18:4 And I heard another voice from heaven, saying, Come out of her, my people, that ye be not partakers of her sins, and that ye receive not of her plagues. {See Rev. 7, the 144,000 {Jews Fleeing Judea} just before what hits ? THE PLAGUES of God via the Trumps/Vials !! 

[douggg]

On 3/10/2020 at 12:22 AM, not an echo said:

However, I feel almost handicapped time wise, because I am one of those bi-vocational pastors, and my secular job is quite demanding. 

 

Use my chart, it will save you about the 50 years of your time.   Follow the red critical path from upper left to lower right.    Read each of the annotated scriptures on the way through it.

 

 

 

 

[not an echo]

Hello all,

I have finally gotten around to adding the following illustrations to this thread.  I originally posted them in my thread titled, The Revelation Is Our God Given Prophetic Grid (https://www.worthychristianforums.com/topic/251871-the-revelation-is-our-god-given-prophetic-grid/).  Each of these threads is really complimentary to the other.  I will just make a few comments here to explain how I tie my illustrations to The Revelation.  Then I am going to copy and paste them to my opening post, where I explain in more detail.  Hope you find them helpful and enlightening.   

The first 10 chapters of The Revelation are in the strictest chronological order possible.  One thing leads into another thing, which leads into another thing, and so forth throughout the first 10 chapters---without fail.  No back and forth, no overlap, no repeating of anything, just chronological information laid out as simply as 1, 2, 3, 4, 5, 6, 7, 8, 9, and 10.  Following is an illustration of how straightforward the first 10 chapters are laid out:

Beginning with chapter 11, there is a difference in the manner in which John records things.  This difference is closely related to what he writes concerning the 7th Trumpet in verses 15-19, for what he here records is like a concise overview of what will be taking place throughout the next several chapters.  In accord with the way the Bible's chapters are divided (which I attribute to the hand of God!), it appears that after John is given the brief overview of this period, he uses an overlapping method of recording all of the details of it---again, without fail.  Following is an illustration of the overlapping method in which chapters 11 through 20 are laid out:

Finally, the last two chapters of The Revelation also continue chronologically, but as a whole, and reveal John's vision of God's Heaven and the conclusion of The Revelation, as well as The Bible:

Simplified further, that's 10 chapters with no overlapping pattern, 10 chapters with an overlapping pattern, and two chapters as a unit.

Edited February 1, 2023 by not an echo
to reset illustrations

[douggg]

not an echo, the visuals are not showing on my screen.   Only blank squares.    Are they showing on yours?

If not, it may be because you saved your images in png format.    Try saving your images in the jpg format instead.

_____________________________________________________________

What you still have to get into is making a timeline chart of the seven years.

This is what I just wrote to another poster at another forum...

"You come into a forum, trying to sell your view, but you have no product on the show room floor. You are like a salesman who talks all about the leather seating, the fit and finish, the tinted windows, and aerodynamic shape - but has no pictures nor model of his car on the show room floor. And he should expect people to buy into his verbalization?

I have a chart of the 7 year 70 week.  And another chart of the anytime rapture. You are not presenting a product for people to see."

Edited May 2, 2020 by douggg