LonerAndy Posted June 21, 2020 Group: Senior Member Followers: 4 Topic Count: 19 Topics Per Day: 0.01 Content Count: 693 Content Per Day: 0.42 Reputation: 396 Days Won: 0 Joined: 10/28/2019 Status: Offline Share Posted June 21, 2020 2 hours ago, mlssufan01 said: So, this would go back to the original posts--wherein I actually acknowledged anomaly situations such as these (abuse, rape) wherein I stated that I would agree reconciliation would not be wise in these specific cases of extreme sins; my original intent was more to the point where there has not been such extreme sin. Even then i still struggle to know for sure as Paul instructed the completely immoral man in Corinth to be reconciled (keep in mind, Corinth was known for it's extremely unbiblical sexual immorality). My case is largely based on the statisticsnthat the instructions of reconciliaton is the most disobeyed Scripture in the Bible; and from what I've seen, while SOME of it is due to extreme sin like the one you mention; the vast majority is out of pettiness and/or unforgiveness of the less extreme sins---and this is where I have the problem. You are contradicting yourself then. You can't say "The problem with this statement is..the Holy Spirit DID tell you to do it" and then say 'well not in certain situations'. If the Holy Spirit said conclusively "DO THIS"... then you need to do it. If you are saying "not be wise in specific cases"... then you are saying the Holy Spirit is telling you to do something, and "you are still holding them responsible for their past sins.". These are mutually exclusive claims. They can't both be true. One has to be false. Either you need to forgive and reconcile with wise boundaries... *OR* the Holy Spirit DID tell you to do something, and you can't consider their history in forgiving, and letting your daughter go with a rapists, who claims to have repented. It's one or the other. Can't be both. Can't be "Holy Spirit told you" and "not wise in specific situations". Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
David1701 Posted June 21, 2020 Group: Royal Member Followers: 8 Topic Count: 15 Topics Per Day: 0.01 Content Count: 5,731 Content Per Day: 3.51 Reputation: 3,524 Days Won: 12 Joined: 11/27/2019 Status: Offline Share Posted June 21, 2020 3 hours ago, mlssufan01 said: lol...no, no it wouldn't starve the lust. I am telling you this as someone who struggles with it. In fact after a bout with mental health I decided blocking those site on the internet would be wise. It did not eliminate my temptation because sin is not originated externally, it is originated in the human heart. I know that sin is within us; but feeding it only makes it stronger: that was my point. Quote Was I going out of my way to search for images? No. Was I awkwardly staring at women in church? No. In fact, I did a pretty good job of hiding it. But when alone, the struggle is still there, probably even more intensely then when I had access to those blocked sites. Now, is it wise to enter a sinful-themed shop overtly explicit things to trigger my temptations? of course not. But I am to avoid it altogeter? actually...I would argue no, for 2 reasons. Firstly, Jesus went into the desert TO BE TEMPTED. Though He would not sin. If going into a temptation is a sin, then you're calling Jesus a sinner...and that can't be possible. Secondly, especially in the area of lust...it is virtually impossible to go anywhere without being tempted. Walk down the street, see a woman in lewd clothing. Maybe I work in a mall (I did for a bit); how many Victoria's Secret images you think I saw? Could I even possibly go to the beach? Then you add the shear disobedience of Christians when it comes to premarital sex, 65% willfully engaging in it without any conviction (I don't support this view, but it can raise a lot of "why" questions). For lust, to avoid it altogether would be t never leave your house and never associate with anybody. And this is why I say avoiding temptation is nigh impossible. In fact, in Genesis, God said that the thoughts and intentions of man's heart are evil continually, all day long. Jesus was led into the wilderness, by the Holy Spirit, to gain victory over the devil's temptations, under the most difficult circumstances possible (near starvation, extreme tiredness, being tempted by the devil himself. This contrasts with Adam giving in to temptation under the best circumstances possible. This is nothing to do with going into a "sinful-themed shop"! No, you can't avoid temptations altogether; and thought-life requires prayer, as I said previously. The Lord is able to help those who are tempted. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
BeauJangles Posted June 21, 2020 Group: Royal Member Followers: 43 Topic Count: 229 Topics Per Day: 0.06 Content Count: 10,900 Content Per Day: 2.91 Reputation: 12,145 Days Won: 68 Joined: 02/13/2014 Status: Offline Birthday: 08/14/1954 Share Posted June 21, 2020 On 6/19/2020 at 4:15 AM, mlssufan01 said: do you feel guilty for being the person not willing to reconcile when the other party is sincere in wanting to make things work? particularly in a friendship. On 6/19/2020 at 4:13 PM, mlssufan01 said: Cases like this one and similar (abuse, sexual misconduct) are the anomaly cases where I would tend to agree it isnt wise to reconcile. But I would still venture to guess there is some unforgiveness; even if you say you've forgiven. I do understand that they are not "exactly" the same; but I also cannot see how the two can truly be separated. As mentioned; God never forgives without reconciling...this is how He love and therefore i cannot justify my unwllingness to reconcile when God will always take me back if I repent. 5 hours ago, mlssufan01 said: So, this would go back to the original posts--wherein I actually acknowledged anomaly situations such as these (abuse, rape) wherein I stated that I would agree reconciliation would not be wise in these specific cases of extreme sins; my original intent was more to the point where there has not been such extreme sin. Even then i still struggle to know for sure as Paul instructed the completely immoral man in Corinth to be reconciled (keep in mind, Corinth was known for it's extremely unbiblical sexual immorality). My case is largely based on the statisticsnthat the instructions of reconciliaton is the most disobeyed Scripture in the Bible; and from what I've seen, while SOME of it is due to extreme sin like the one you mention; the vast majority is out of pettiness and/or unforgiveness of the less extreme sins---and this is where I have the problem. 4 hours ago, mlssufan01 said: lol...no, no it wouldn't starve the lust. I am telling you this as someone who struggles with it. In fact after a bout with mental health I decided blocking those site on the internet would be wise. It did not eliminate my temptation because sin is not originated externally, it is originated in the human heart. Was I going out of my way to search for images? No. Was I awkwardly staring at women in church? No. In fact, I did a pretty good job of hiding it. But when alone, the struggle is still there, probably even more intensely then when I had access to those blocked sites. Now, is it wise to enter a sinful-themed shop overtly explicit things to trigger my temptations? of course not. But I am to avoid it altogeter? actually...I would argue no, for 2 reasons. Firstly, Jesus went into the desert TO BE TEMPTED. Though He would not sin. If going into a temptation is a sin, then you're calling Jesus a sinner...and that can't be possible. Secondly, especially in the area of lust...it is virtually impossible to go anywhere without being tempted. Walk down the street, see a woman in lewd clothing. Maybe I work in a mall (I did for a bit); how many Victoria's Secret images you think I saw? Could I even possibly go to the beach? Then you add the shear disobedience of Christians when it comes to premarital sex, 65% willfully engaging in it without any conviction (I don't support this view, but it can raise a lot of "why" questions). For lust, to avoid it altogether would be t never leave your house and never associate with anybody. And this is why I say avoiding temptation is nigh impossible. In fact, in Genesis, God said that the thoughts and intentions of man's heart are evil continually, all day long. Brother, if this has anything to do with the sexual misconduct between that minister's underage daughter and you, a number of us including admin advised you to drop this subject and move on with your life. Those good people wanted nothing further to do with you making continued visitations at their church and communications by Facebook. You are now exhausting the efforts of newer members who are unaware of your story and all those actions on your behalf. That's not being fair to them. Discontinue obsessing with this and stop this nonsense now. 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
mlssufan01 Posted June 21, 2020 Group: Mars Hill Followers: 1 Topic Count: 15 Topics Per Day: 0.01 Content Count: 73 Content Per Day: 0.04 Reputation: 15 Days Won: 0 Joined: 09/27/2018 Status: Offline Author Share Posted June 21, 2020 3 hours ago, BeauJangles said: Brother, if this has anything to do with the sexual misconduct between that minister's underage daughter and you, a number of us including admin advised you to drop this subject and move on with your life. Those good people wanted nothing further to do with you making continued visitations at their church and communications by Facebook. You are now exhausting the efforts of newer members who are unaware of your story and all those actions on your behalf. That's not being fair to them. Discontinue obsessing with this and stop this nonsense now. A few rhings on this: No, it isn't directly tied to that. It is tied to almost every broken relationship I see never ever being reconciled. 2nd...to clarify...the pastor's daughter was not underage during our fallout, nor was there any sexual misconduct...these are very slanderous statements...at worst we had a frowned upon online friendship....thirdly....I am not excommunicated from any church...only allowed in limited capacity; and became confused due to conflicting statements and actions. In any case, this post isn't directly caused by that situation. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
BeauJangles Posted June 22, 2020 Group: Royal Member Followers: 43 Topic Count: 229 Topics Per Day: 0.06 Content Count: 10,900 Content Per Day: 2.91 Reputation: 12,145 Days Won: 68 Joined: 02/13/2014 Status: Offline Birthday: 08/14/1954 Share Posted June 22, 2020 (edited) 4 hours ago, mlssufan01 said: No, it isn't directly tied to that. I see. Well, it sure reeks of an odd familiarity then. Too many similarities to all these other posts concerning the same old topic over and over again. It went on page after page, bro. And it never accomplished anything profitable for you whatsoever. 4 hours ago, mlssufan01 said: It is tied to almost every broken relationship I see never ever being reconciled. So, this is about everyone else but you. That doesn't quite match up with the obsessive stories of your desperate attempts for reconciliation with the pastor's daughter. Now I guess you're including the family in there also, as some redemptive attempt at not appearing too driven by your uncontrolled desire for her. I dunno, bro. This all really stinks for some reason. Sounds lopsided, sorry. I'm regretful for the suspicions, but it's just too close to your past problems to buy into what your claims are. Maybe other members are more knowledgeable about the background than I am. They have far more information than what's been revealed to me personally. It's enough to go on even though I do lack a few specifics that haven't been disclosed. What I've been informed of isn't good. 4 hours ago, mlssufan01 said: 2nd...to clarify...the pastor's daughter was not underage during our fallout, nor was there any sexual misconduct... Hmm... Okay. So, she was underage when all this started out then. Maybe you didn't get the chance for actual intercourse, but obviously the daughter's family was not in approval of the relationship due to the age difference between you. From other posts, there was enough to indicate some type of perpetration on your end of it. None of this is looking good for you. 4 hours ago, mlssufan01 said: these are very slanderous statements...at worst we had a frowned upon online friendship It's not slanderous at all. Look, you quoted me with all this and now just it's just digging a deeper hole for yourself. Perhaps not addressing my post would have been a far better option and better to have dropped it then and there. I can't be blamed for all the allegations. This is your life and your problems, brother. You were said by others who knew the story on this, the family kept telling you to stop trying to contact them. Also to forget attempting amends for the so-called "mistakes" you made in this relationship. I'm really not into looking up archival information on this. This needs to end including trying to excuse yourself. Making you appear to be the one victimized, when this family claims you were bothering them. That's putting in the mildest sense I can offer you at this point. I did edit this down so as not to paint such a dismal portrait. 4 hours ago, mlssufan01 said: thirdly....I am not excommunicated from any church...only allowed in limited capacity; From my understanding they did say they wanted nothing further to do with you personally. That says quite a lot to me right there. I wouldn't want to continue attending a church congregation where I was no longer wanted. It wouldn't be comfortable staying. My mom and I were pretty much asked to leave or no longer attend the AoG due to our standpoint on the deliverance ministry, so we left before being asked to do so. We understood how that felt. Maybe you should consider the same, but it is your choice after all. 4 hours ago, mlssufan01 said: In any case, this post isn't directly caused by that situation. Fair enough. If you say so. I think it wise to drop the subject while you're ahead though. Continuing this is only going to make the entire thing to be an embarrassment to you. I'm not desirous of this, believe me. I'm just saying that this subject exhausted members attempting to minister mercy to you including myself until finding out the truth to your motives. I was a little upset when all that information came out. Let's end this now, please. No more quoting so I'll not have the need to respond. God bless you, bro. You do need to move on with your life from this incident. I'll give you the benefit of the doubt as I'm sure the rest of us are willing to do so. We'll all just move on with you in Christ Jesus and go from here. Edited June 22, 2020 by BeauJangles Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Debp Posted June 22, 2020 Group: Worthy Ministers Followers: 52 Topic Count: 1,029 Topics Per Day: 0.15 Content Count: 12,376 Content Per Day: 1.80 Reputation: 16,406 Days Won: 92 Joined: 07/19/2005 Status: Offline Share Posted June 22, 2020 4 hours ago, Abby-Joy said: I have, on the other hand, been one who was mistreated and misunderstood by another person, who cut me off. And when I tried to reconcile, they chose not to acknowledge my attempts. In that case, I left it between them and the Lord and moved on. I didn't do anything to legitimately cause their actions. So I don't feel guilty about that case, either. I also experienced the above, exact situation. There's nothing I can do about it, so I just leave that person in the Lord's hands. I have already forgiven him as that is what the Lord teaches us to do. 1 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Prycejosh1987 Posted July 12, 2020 Group: Diamond Member Followers: 1 Topic Count: 1 Topics Per Day: 0.00 Content Count: 1,176 Content Per Day: 0.83 Reputation: 126 Days Won: 0 Joined: 07/07/2020 Status: Offline Birthday: 04/29/1987 Share Posted July 12, 2020 On 6/19/2020 at 12:15 PM, mlssufan01 said: do you feel guilty for being the person not willing to reconcile when the other party is sincere in wanting to make things work? particularly in a friendship. I have never felt guilty because i am fair in the way i deal with people. If someone constantly disappoints then it would stupid to be their friend afterwards. But if it is more subtle then its something that is more considerable. Even then i really evaluate on what that person can do for me and what they will do. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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