Does water baptism precede regeneration?

[Charlie744]

7 minutes ago, Justin Adams said:

No. Not baptism per se. This account is related to the ingathering of all Jews first, and then gentiles second. The eunuch was most likely of the Ethiopian Israeli line that travelled down the Nile early on and later have now been mostly all airlifted back to Israel. Note that in the table of nations, the NT writers take care to mention all the countries/nations in the Tanakh that were scattered at Babel, with the promise to Abram for a later blessing thru him.

Note the next place Philip is sent to. Very telling.

Thank you very much Justin.... and as I was writing this supplemental piece I was going to insert another comment that I believe may be in line with your comment:

During Jesus ministry I remember reading where a gentile woman had approached Jesus and (paraphrasing), he told her that He had come for the Jews. The woman replied something like, "even the dogs will lick up the crumbs". Jesus was so impressed by her FAITH and DESIRE to be saved / part of Jesus that He granted her what she asked. 

I believe the same type of event happened with Cornelius the Roman Centurion who had so much faith in Jesus that he responded by telling Him to "just say the word and I know he will be healed".  Once again, and although Jesus made it clear He had come to His People, these two well documented events stand out in a very prominent way.... He was willing to consider the gentiles that exhibited such a tremendous amount of faith in Him..... 

I believe the story of the eunuch is another that is meant to "stand out" because they are gentiles. In the first two stories, Jesus physically healed the relatives of the two gentiles. Here with the eunuch, the LORD is healing his soul or his salvation. As I am writing this, and although I have NOT studied this, but this may also be representative of how Jesus dealt with His People, the Jews ---- He would perform so many miracles of physical healing of the blind, lepers, crippled, fever, etc., and later on He spoke about the spiritual healing He would bring.... Perhaps these limited, micro events with these gentiles follows the same theme / pattern?

I think this might be in keeping with your thought here... Charlie

 

 

[Your closest friendnt]

13 hours ago, Frits said:

Hi bro Charlie,

Yes the story of the eunuch from Acts 8  is strong support for a continuation of a WB in the NT.

But Charlie, how significant do you think the words of the Lord Jesus Himself are?
(With apologies if this has already been mentioned.)

Mat 3:15 KJV And Jesus answering said unto him, Suffer it to be so now: for thus it becometh us to fulfil all righteousness. Then he suffered him.
Mat 3:16 KJV And Jesus, when he was baptized, went up straightway out of the water: and, lo, the heavens were opened unto him, and he saw the Spirit of God descending like a dove, and lighting upon him

Mar 16:16 KJV He that believeth and is baptized shall be saved; but he that believeth not shall be damned.

And then this text:

Han 22:16 KJV And now why tarriest thou? arise, and be baptized, and wash away thy sins, calling on the name of the Lord.

The doctrine of baptisms is part of the foundation of the Gospel of the Lord Jesus Christ, as communicated to us in Hebrews 6:2.

God bless.

10 In Damascus there was a disciple named Ananias. The Lord called to him in a vision, “Ananias!”

“Yes, Lord,” he answered.

11 The Lord told him, “Go to the house of Judas on Straight Street and ask for a man from Tarsus named Saul, for he is praying. 12 In a vision he has seen a man named Ananias come and place his hands on him to restore his sight.”

13 “Lord,” Ananias answered, “I have heard many reports about this man and all the harm he has done to your holy people in Jerusalem. 14 And he has come here with authority from the chief priests to arrest all who call on your name.”

15 But the Lord said to Ananias, “Go! This man is my chosen instrument to proclaim my name to the Gentiles and their kings and to the people of Israel. 16 I will show him how much he must suffer for my name.”

17 Then Ananias went to the house and entered it. Placing his hands on Saul, he said, “Brother Saul, the Lord—Jesus, who appeared to you on the road as you were coming here—has sent me so that you may see again and be filled with the Holy Spirit.” 18 Immediately, something like scales fell from Saul’s eyes, and he could see again. He got up and was baptized, 19 and after taking some food, he regained his strength.

[Charlie744]

7 minutes ago, Your closest friendnt said:

10 In Damascus there was a disciple named Ananias. The Lord called to him in a vision, “Ananias!”

“Yes, Lord,” he answered.

11 The Lord told him, “Go to the house of Judas on Straight Street and ask for a man from Tarsus named Saul, for he is praying. 12 In a vision he has seen a man named Ananias come and place his hands on him to restore his sight.”

13 “Lord,” Ananias answered, “I have heard many reports about this man and all the harm he has done to your holy people in Jerusalem. 14 And he has come here with authority from the chief priests to arrest all who call on your name.”

15 But the Lord said to Ananias, “Go! This man is my chosen instrument to proclaim my name to the Gentiles and their kings and to the people of Israel. 16 I will show him how much he must suffer for my name.”

17 Then Ananias went to the house and entered it. Placing his hands on Saul, he said, “Brother Saul, the Lord—Jesus, who appeared to you on the road as you were coming here—has sent me so that you may see again and be filled with the Holy Spirit.” 18 Immediately, something like scales fell from Saul’s eyes, and he could see again. He got up and was baptized, 19 and after taking some food, he regained his strength.

Thank you very much.. nice verses of course!

I would respectfully ask that you might focus on the last few words in 9:17 .... TO ME, it is abundantly clear that Paul was indeed baptized... “WITH THE HOLY SPIRIT”.

Just my thoughts, Charlie 

[Your closest friendnt]

8 minutes ago, Charlie744 said:

Thank you very much.. nice verses of course!

I would respectfully ask that you might focus on the last few words in 9:17 .... TO ME, it is abundantly clear that Paul was indeed baptized... “WITH THE HOLY SPIRIT”.

Just my thoughts, Charlie 

This is a brief description of the events by some else who was not an eye witness. 

It's not if what is written down was taken out from Paul's personal Journal, or Ananias for that matter. 

[Charlie744]

4 minutes ago, Your closest friendnt said:

This is a brief description of the events by some else who was not an eye witness. 

It's not if what is written down was taken out from Paul's personal Journal, or Ananias for that matter. 

I am not sure what you mean but below is a copy / paste of the verses written in Acts:

And Ananias went his way and entered the house; and ^(L)laying his hands on him he said, “Brother Saul, the Lord ^[c]Jesus, who appeared to you on the road as you came, has sent me that you may receive your sight and ^(M)be filled with the Holy Spirit.” 

Also, it is the same words within the verses you sent me....?????

Charlie

[Your closest friendnt]

2 minutes ago, Charlie744 said:

I am not sure what you mean but below is a copy / paste of the verses written in Acts:

And Ananias went his way and entered the house; and ^(L)laying his hands on him he said, “Brother Saul, the Lord ^[c]Jesus, who appeared to you on the road as you came, has sent me that you may receive your sight and ^(M)be filled with the Holy Spirit.” 

Also, it is the same words within the verses you sent me....?????

Charlie

We have to accept that this is what is written down in Acts 9.

But is it written down by an eye witness, by someone who heard the story or interview Paul?

It wouldn't really matter but if someone takes the stand that we have to follow what happened there, then it matters a lot.

Then we need to ask our selves, did the writer put this down as a guidance to us, or just to informed us as to what was known to him. Not word for word. 

[Starise]

1 hour ago, Your closest friendnt said:

He got up and was baptized, 19 and after taking some food, he regained his strength.

The Greek word used here is βάπτω. Transliteration is baptō . Used as a verb.

Strong's- βάπτω báptō, bap'-to; a primary verb; to whelm, i.e. cover wholly with a fluid; in the New Testament only in a qualified or special sense, i.e. (literally) to moisten (a part of one's person), or (by implication) to stain (as with dye):—dip

Thayer's Greek lexicon- 

βάπτω: [future βάψω, John 13:26 T Tr WH]; 1 aorist ἔβαψα; perfect passive participle βεβαμμένος; in Greek writings from Homer down; in the Sept. for טָבַל;
a. to dip, dip in, immerse: τί, John 13:26 [but in 26a Lachmann ἐμβάψας, as in 26b L text R G]; followed by a genitive of the thing into which the object is dipped (because only a part of it is touched by the act of dipping), Luke 16:24 (cf. ἅπτεσθαί τινος, λούεσθαι ποταμοῖο, Homer, Iliad 5, 6; 6, 508; cf. Buttmann, § 132, 25; [Winers Grammar, § 30, 8. c.]).
b. to dip into dye, to dye, color: ἱμάτιον αἵματι, Revelation 19:13 [Tdf. περιρεραμμένον, see under the word περιρραίνω; WH ῥεραντισμένον, see ῤαντίζω]. (Herodotus 7, 67; Anth. 11, 68; Josephus, Antiquities 3, 6, 1.) [Compare: ἐμβάπτω.]

 

 

 

[leah777]

1 hour ago, Your closest friendnt said:

We have to accept that this is what is written down in Acts 9.

But is it written down by an eye witness, by someone who heard the story or interview Paul?

It wouldn't really matter but if someone takes the stand that we have to follow what happened there, then it matters a lot.

Then we need to ask our selves, did the writer put this down as a guidance to us, or just to informed us as to what was known to him. Not word for word. 

Either the Word of God is inerrant, or it isnt. 

[Frits]

2 hours ago, Charlie744 said:

I am not sure what you mean but below is a copy / paste of the verses written in Acts:

And Ananias went his way and entered the house; and ^(L)laying his hands on him he said, “Brother Saul, the Lord ^[c]Jesus, who appeared to you on the road as you came, has sent me that you may receive your sight and ^(M)be filled with the Holy Spirit.” 

Also, it is the same words within the verses you sent me....?????

Charlie

Acts 22:12 KJV And one Ananias, a devout man according to the law, having a good report of all the Jews which dwelt there,
Acts 22:13 KJV Came unto me, and stood, and said unto me, Brother Saul,...
Acts 22:16 KJV ... why tarriest thou? arise, and be baptized, and wash away thy sins, calling on the name of the Lord.

God bless.

[Eternally Gratefull]

6 hours ago, Marathoner said:

I was in your position, @clancy. When the Lord sent me to the fellowship in countryside I was clueless, and when I was told it was time to be baptized in water I assented. That was the extent of my knowledge.

I believe this is a matter of conviction, similar to observing the Sabbath day (sunset Friday to sunset Saturday). When I'm the guest of brothers and sisters who observe the Sabbath day I join them; should I refuse? Should I speak ill of their observance? Not at all.  

To answer the OP, that's how it unfolded for me. But I am in no way convinced that water baptism is a requirement for the Lord never spoke of the water, only that I would go where He sent me.    

Amen, as paul said he became all things to all people,