Not that many of you want to know, but some of my thoughts on free will

[Omegaman 3.0]

11 hours ago, Riverwalker said:

You are free to make any choice you want.  But you are not free from the consequences of those choices.

But I have to disagree, we often want things we do not choose to pursue.  

I am not sure what you are disagreeing with. Did I say you cannot choose or  do things against your desires?

[Riverwalker]

12 minutes ago, Omegaman 3.0 said:

I am not sure what you are disagreeing with. Did I say you cannot choose or  do things against your desires?

You said 

2.      “but you are not free to choose what it IS that you want to do”

And is with that, that I disagree

[Omegaman 3.0]

8 hours ago, Dennis1209 said:

Interesting theological thoughts, but my thoughts and perspective differ. I think everything the Lord does is 100%. The way I'm interpreting your post is; we could be partially robotically programmed or predestined. Omniscience, knowing the beginning from the end is not predestination.

 

And I am not saying that omniscience is the same as predestination, but if God knows that something is going to happen, it will happen, and as such is no more escape able that the concept of predestination is. 

Foreknowledge is not the cause of how things come about (in my opinion) but the do coincide.

However I should probably clarify that I do not equate omniscience to foreknowledge, though I am not saying that they are totally isolated from each other.

When we speak of omniscience, we mean knowing everything,even the future. The problem is that the Bible sometimes uses knowledge in a different way. 

Adam knew his wife

Joseph did not know Mary until after Jesus was born

Depart from me, I never knew you

For those he foreknew,He also predestined

I submit that the first two there are talking about a special intimacy, certainly I do not need to make case that Adam and Eve and Joseph and Mary had just become aquainted.

I suggest that the second two are also not about mere intellectual knowledge of facts is mere familiarity.

Jesus when He says depart from me, He is not saying that He was never aware of them, He is saying that they never has an intimate love relationship with them.

Same with those He foreknew. In terms of head knowledge. God knows about everyone, but He does not predestine everyone to be confirmed tongue image of His Son.

That is reserve for those He foreknew, as in foreloved.

"Jacob I loved, but Esau I hated!" Harsh, but that is what the text says!

 

 

 

 

 

 

[Omegaman 3.0]

26 minutes ago, Riverwalker said:

You said 

2.      “but you are not free to choose what it IS that you want to do”

And is with that, that I disagree

So are you saying that you can WANT to have rotting chicken livers on your pancakes for breakfast tomorrow by simply choosing to want that? I know I do not have the ability to choose what it is that I want. Now maybe I could chose to eat them, and aquire a taste for them and then I would want them, but for now, I just want what I want without choosing to want the things I do!

[Guest clancy]

There are a lot of wants on here,?..

The Word want seems to have left me.....I guess I’ve handed everything over to God...you can’t win over God.....So, now I involve God in everything and I mean everything, I’ve learnt my lesson......it’s now, do I need that Lord....that’s just my thoughts on the subject of “ Wants”.

[DeighAnn]

10 hours ago, Willa said:

I tend to think of it all as a giant chess game.  God is the master player and has a countermove for any move we could dream up.  He will always win.  But he gives us the choice to make any move we wish.  He may even set us up to severely limit our choices.  He may guide us like He did Jonah.  

I do too!!, 
though I see it as not between us and God but God and Satan and us.  When we see Satan in the garden causing disobedience to Gods command, or  the land promised to Gods People being inhabited causing all those wars, the fallen angels almost completely polluting the blood line through which Christ would come causing the flood of Noahs time, the infiltration of the priests causing errors in the scribing of the WORD, the killing of all children under 2 years, etc. just to name a few there is a definite adversary out there fighting against Gods overall plan.  

 

[DeighAnn]

8 hours ago, Omegaman 3.0 said:

"Jacob I loved, but Esau I hated!" Harsh, but that is what the text says!

Made me study my heritage in God a lot closer. 

Also made me realize God 'places' souls for specific purposes at specific times by 'knowing' them.  

Matthew 20:14 Take that thine is, and go thy way: I will give unto this last, even as unto thee.

Matthew 20:15 Is it not lawful for me to do what I will with mine own? Is thine eye evil, because I am good?

Matthew 20:16 So the last shall be first, and the first last: for many be called, but few chosen.

[Michael37]

13 hours ago, SONshine said:

We cannot choose nothin’. 

Not without exercising some of our God-given senses and abilities . . . otherwise many Scriptures make no sense.

[Justin Adams]

Hyperbole; over and under statements that are polemic in nature are all over our scriptures. I have a somewhat eastern mentality and recognize this. Some do not and take the words used over literally in may cases and medically sanitized of all inferences.

So me and God decide to have a chess match. God says, "I will win without predestinating any of your moves. I will win because I am God".

So I say. "Agreed". Therefore we never have that match.

Did it happen or not?

[DeighAnn]

5 hours ago, Justin Adams said:

Hyperbole; over and under statements that are polemic in nature are all over our scriptures. I have a somewhat eastern mentality and recognize this. Some do not and take the words used over literally in may cases and medically sanitized of all inferences.

So me and God decide to have a chess match. God says, "I will win without predestinating any of your moves. I will win because I am God".

So I say. "Agreed". Therefore we never have that match.

Did it happen or not?

Yes, God has a plan.  It goes accordingly until it doesn't. He steps in and adjusts direction when necessary with those He already justified, the game continues until all those who love Him are collected and all those who don't are blotted out.