Defense of the Pre Trib Rapture

[iamlamad]

5 hours ago, Diaste said:

 

Yes. I remember all that from past discussions. 

I guess we'll just have to wait and see. Time is the true test. 

There isn't a 2000 year gap in all of the Revelation. Why are you finding one?

Anyone that imagines the first seal is the Antichrist seems to find a 2000 year gap. I don't. The first seal was opened as soon as Jesus ascended and got the book, according to John's writing.

[Diaste]

18 hours ago, iamlamad said:

The first seal was opened as soon as Jesus ascended and got the book, according to John's writing.

But then a 2000 year + gap to the 7th seal. 

[Diaste]

18 hours ago, iamlamad said:

That is the way it usually works. But so what? God delights in prospering His children. However, I know at least one person that printed on the cover of his book:  "This Book is never to be sold" or something like that.  I think my first book is free on some websites. 

It is also very probable that a second purpose was realized: others are blessed from their testimony. 

If so, good for them.  

[iamlamad]

3 hours ago, Diaste said:

But then a 2000 year + gap to the 7th seal. 

It is what we call "the church age." 

[Diaste]

20 hours ago, iamlamad said:

It is what we call "the church age." 

I mean, a 2000 gap year is fine as long as it's how you see it. So there is a long gap. Sure you're correct on why there is a gap?

[WilliamL]

On 6/27/2022 at 4:44 PM, WilliamL said:

On 6/27/2022 at 4:36 PM, iamlamad said:

 I have heard His voice many times over my life. I KNOW His voice. He is my Lord. I am His sheep that knows HIs voice. 

Your single-witness, self-testimony means nothing. Where is your second witness for the things you say?

 

On 6/27/2022 at 5:44 PM, iamlamad said:

The second witness is the very scriptures Jesus spoke about.

"The very scriptures Jesus spoke about" don't mention your name at all!

[Linkin]

It is so funny to even discuss the rapture as an event that takes us to heaven.

If you have that belief in mind it is clear you do not know your bible very well.

It is also clear you have the Greek Platonic corrupted version of the bible in mind.

That view holds to the idea that physical flesh is corrupt and we must escape it by  ascending to heaven. That idea is what we call reincarnation, not resurrection to eternal life, which is the only way to eternal life described in the bible.

[Linkin]

The hope [of Christians and Jews] is to inherit the ''land'' not ascend to heaven.
John 3:13 And no one has ascended into the Heaven except the one who descended from heaven.........[ie Jesus] 
The perfect tense of the verb requires that after ascending, the Son remained in heaven at the time these words were stated. This is proof that verse 13 was John’s commentary after the ascension, rather than being part of Jesus’ dialogue with Nicodemus.
This was written decades after Jesus ascended to heaven and after all the apostles except John who wrote it had died.

Acts 2:29-34 David died and was buried.....and he did not ascend to heaven.

Without the Resurrection of the Body, there is no Hope for Life after Death

1 Cor 15:12-19

12 But if it is preached that Christ has been raised from the dead, how can some of you say that there is no resurrection of the dead? 13 If there is no resurrection of the dead, then not even Christ has been raised. 14 And if Christ has not been raised, our preaching is useless and so is your faith. 15 More than that, we are then found to be false witnesses about God, for we have testified about God that he raised Christ from the dead. But he did not raise him if in fact the dead are not raised. 16 For if the dead are not raised, then Christ has not been raised either. 17 And if Christ has not been raised, your faith is futile; you are still in your sins. 18 Then those also who have fallen asleep in Christ are lost. 19 If only for this life we have hope in Christ, we are of all people most to be pitied.

God comes to dwell with man, NOT man goes to dwell with God

Revelation 21:3 And I heard a loud voice from the sky saying: “Look! ‘The tent of God is with men; and He will dwell with them; and they will be His people; and God Himself will be with them – their God.’***
***Paraphrase of Ezekiel 37:27 Ezekiel 43:7. The Renewed Jerusalem is a dwelling suitable for the SOVEREIGN OVER ALL to cohabitate with perfected mankind. Yet, even this magnificent city is called God’s “tent,” because even its splendor is inadequate to fully reflect the glory of the SOVEREIGN OVER ALL!
Also Psalm 5:11 [LXX] 

God placed Adam [Man] in the Garden on planet Earth.

Both Job & Daniel see God only after they have been resurrected back to life.

Job 19:25 I know that my redeemer lives, and that in the end he will stand on the earth.
26 And after my skin has been destroyed, yet in my flesh I will see God;

Daniel 12:13 As for you, go your way till the end. You will rest [die], and then at the end of the days you will rise [be resurrected] to receive your allotted inheritance.”

[Linkin]

The rapture comes at the end of the tribulation. Those who are living will be changed, the dead are raised to life and we are all transported to near Jerusalem to be eye witnesses of the battle of Armageddon. Then the 1000 year reign of Messiah begins from Jerusalem.

 

Psalm 2:7 The promise made to Jesus by His Father was to make the nations his inheritance and the ends of the land his possession.

The promise to Abraham was to inherit the land. Gen. 13:15, 17:8, etc.

Repeated to Isaac and Jacob. Gen 26:3-5, Gen. 28:10-15..Etc..

Galatians 3:29 And if you are the Anointed one’s, then you are Abraham’s seed and heirs according to the promise.

Hebrews 11.. etc..

 

 

 

[iamlamad]

On 7/1/2022 at 2:47 PM, WilliamL said:

 

"The very scriptures Jesus spoke about" don't mention your name at all!

When Jesus was speaking to me about Revelation chapters 4 & 5, He referenced the first 4 verses of chapter 4 and asked me "Why was I not immediately seen at the right hand of the Father - there are over a dozen verses saying that is where I went to be?"

Then He referenced  Chapter 5, verses 1-4 and asked why He was not immediately found worthy in that first search John watched.

Then He referenced 4:5 and asked me why the Holy Spirit was there in the throne room when "I said I would send Him down as soon as I ascended..."

Anyone can make up answers to His questions, but He showed me HIS intent.  He was showing John the throne room of the past - a point in time while Jesus was under the earth and then resurrected and then ascended.

You can choose to believe or not believe His words to me.

However, the fact remains, John saw the father on the throne but did not see Jesus at His right hand.

The fact remains, John wrote of a search for one worthy to take the book and that search ended in failure - which is why John wept much.

The scripture is clear: the Holy Spirit was there in the throne room in chapter 4 but arrived with Jesus when He ascended and was immediately sent down in chapter 5.