The alive and remaining are changed - doesn't that mean all the rest died?

[angels4u]

Maybe the 7 th day means creation was completed?

[Omegaman 3.0]

1 minute ago, George said:

I'll start a separate thread on the parallels of the 7 days of creation, types and shadows... The problem is I'll forget so remind me after this discussion is concluded.    Remind me to explain 1 Cor 15 Pauls reversal order and the 1/4 2/5 3/6 and 7 connection.  

Oy vey, I'll try!

 

[DeighAnn]

2 hours ago, Josheb said:

This op is about whether or not the people of Revelation 6:9-11 are alive or dead. 

This op is about 

1 Thessalonians 4:14 For if we believe that Jesus died and rose again, even so them also which sleep in Jesus will God bring with him.

1 Thessalonians 4:15 For this we say unto you by the word of the Lord, that we which are alive and remain unto the coming of the Lord shall not prevent them which are asleep.

1 Thessalonians 4:16 For the Lord himself shall descend from heaven with a shout, with the voice of the archangel, and with the trump of God: and the dead in Christ shall rise first:

1 Thessalonians 4:17 Then we which are alive and remain shall be caught up together with them in the clouds, to meet the Lord in the air: and so shall we ever be with the Lord.

[Selah7]

1 hour ago, Josheb said:

Yes, and............. ? 

 

Yes, the events described occur on earth. Where, exactly, does any of that say Jesus is physically on earth?  

 

Because if that text does not actually say Jesus is on earth, then all of you who make it say something it does not actually state should stop adding to scripture, especially since that particular book promises curses for those who do so. Believe what it states and be suspicious of eschatological teachers who make the text say things it does not state. 

 

And think about what is stated. How can the earth flee from the face of the one on the throne if the throne is on the earth ruling the earth? 

The events happen on the earth, and they happen as a consequence of Christ's reign but he is not actually phycially on the planet in this text 

Zechariah 14
(4) And His feet shall stand in that day upon the mount of Olives, which is before Jerusalem on the east, and the mount of Olives shall cleave in the midst thereof toward the east and toward the west, and there shall be a very great valley; and half of the mountain shall remove toward the north, and half of it toward the south.

(5) And ye shall flee to the valley of the mountains; for the valley of the mountains shall reach unto Azal: yea, ye shall flee, like as ye fled from before the earthquake in the days of Uzziah king of Judah: and the LORD my God shall come, and all the saints with thee.

When Christ returns, this is where His feet will touch the ground.  This will occur on "the Day of the Lord" (the beginning of the 1,000-year Millennium.  God will shake the earth and shower it with fire and brimstone. The earthquakes will level the cities to the point where no stone will be able to stand on top of another. The Mount of Olives will split, and those two mighty mountains will tremble.

[DeighAnn]

1 hour ago, Josheb said:

Yes, the events described occur on earth. Where, exactly, does any of that say Jesus is physically on earth? 

Zechariah 14:1 Behold, the day of the LORD cometh, and thy spoil shall be divided in the midst of thee.

Zechariah 14:2 For I will gather all nations against Jerusalem to battle; and the city shall be taken, and the houses rifled, and the women ravished; and half of the city shall go forth into captivity, and the residue of the people shall not be cut off from the city.

Zechariah 14:3 Then shall the LORD go forth, and fight against those nations, as when he fought in the day of battle.

Zechariah 14:4 And His feet shall stand in that day upon the mount of Olives, which is before Jerusalem on the east, and the mount of Olives shall cleave in the midst thereof toward the east and toward the west, and there shall be a very great valley; and half of the mountain shall remove toward the north, and half of it toward the south.

ISN'T this enough for the on or not on 'earth' question to be put to rest?

[George]

16 minutes ago, Alive said:

The truth is, I am concerned you will wake up one day in 20 years, and wonder before the Lord why you wasted so much time on this current events end time diversion…..look away from unto Him.

Being about His business. I know this may appear harsh, but it needs to be expressed. We all need it.

All I do is preach revival... the reality is I've traveled 77,000 miles in this pandemic, preaching a positive message of the Kingdom, repentance, and revival 2-5 times a week, along with sending out a daily word of encouragement to 25,000 people daily...

The only reason I'm on this thread is because I was requested to do so.

Now that I'm here...I'll stay till the discussion has run it's course. 

[Michael37]

27 minutes ago, angels4u said:

Is it that God created everything in 7 days and the 8th day is the beginning of a new creation?

Hi angels4u,

The difference between cardinal and ordinal numbers should be noted.

• Cardinal numbers are used to express quantity but not order.
• Ordinal numbers are used to express position of order but not quantity.

God's Creation Work took 6 days.

God's Rest took 1 day, namely the 7th day, which was the 1st day of completed Creation Work, but not of the full Creation cycle, which includes the 7th Day for Rest.

The next day was the 8th day, which was the 1st day after the completed Creation Work & Rest cycle of 7 days. 

By association with such things as Noah and his family being 8 souls saved to restart humanity after the Great Flood, and the resurrection of Christ being an 8th day from the start of the week He was crucified in, the number 8 has indeed come to mean NEW START.

[Selah7]

28 minutes ago, Alive said:

He is a son of God, the same as the rest of us and I love Him.

Do you mean like in a seat higher up in the building?

Sorry…been there. Its a bad place to be.

Not sure what you’re saying here, Alive.  No worries, though.  I know everyone’s a little stressed right now; we’re all pretty passionate about what we believe and things can escalate sometimes.  

[Omegaman 3.0]

3 minutes ago, angels4u said:

Maybe the 7 th day means creation was completed?

Maybe it means what it says?

1Thus the heavens and the earth were finished, and all the host of them. 2And on the seventh day God finished his work that he had done, and he rested on the seventh day from all his work that he had done. 3So God blessed the seventh day and made it holy, because on it God rested from all his work that he had done in creation.

To me, Thus, refers to the 6 days that went before. If that is the case, then creation was finished in 6 days. Then of course verse 2 confuses the issue with finished on the 7th.  Does that mean He did something  on the 7th day that had not been done on the 6th? If so, nothing was listed. The only thing it says specifically that He did on the 7th day, was to rest from the work he HAD done. To me that sounds like, regarding the original creation, that he punched the time clock and stopped.

This is also our model, 6 days work, cease on the 7th. I think you are right (personally) in what you said, that on the 7th day, it was completed, in other words creation was already complete at day 7 - not that He was still completing it on day 7, but that is just be.

However, I think, and I may be wrong, that George is alluding to all of the other meanings packed into this section, not the actually nuts and bolt of what God was doing merely in space and time. It is also interesting to note, that Jesus was not a law keeper regarding the Pharisaical understanding of the sabbath. As Lord of the sabbath, His understanding is the final word.

[Omegaman 3.0]

10 minutes ago, George said:

I'll stay till the discussion has run it's course. 

After 34 pages, that ought to occur soon, but some threads just don't die on their own, especially if there are a few people who insist on saying the same things they have already said, 20 or 30 times, as if we did not hear them the first time. Of course that happens too, when someone joins in (like I have)  who has not read the entire thread (as I have not) because who wants to read 30 something pages or people repeating themselves?