The purpose of the Millennium

[DeighAnn]

Since 2 Peter 2 speaks to the flood of Noah's time 'the heavens and the earth which are now'... 

4 For if God spared not the angels that sinned, but cast them down to hell, and delivered them into chains of darkness, to be reserved unto judgment; 5 And spared not the old world, but saved Noah the eighth person, a preacher of righteousness, bringing in the flood upon the world of the ungodly; 6 And turning the cities of Sodom and Gomorrha into ashes condemned them with an overthrow, making them an ensample unto those that after should live ungodly;


to 'when' is Peter speaking in 2 Peter 3?

3 Knowing this first, that there shall come in the last days scoffers, walking after their own lusts, 4 And saying, Where is the promise of his coming? for since the fathers fell asleep, all things continue as they were from the beginning of the creation. 5 For this they willingly are ignorant of, that by the word of God the heavens were of old, and the earth standing out of the water and in the water: 6 Whereby the world that then was, being overflowed with water, perished: 7 But the heavens and the earth, which are now, by the same word are kept in store, reserved unto fire against the day of judgment and perdition of ungodly men.

 

[DeighAnn]

If one believes there will be a New Heaven and a New Earth and ANOTHER Jerusalem in the following 'age',

then why is it hard to believe in one BEFORE this 'age'?  The only possible 'time' this part of the Bible fits is in the past...at least no one has been able to place it anywhere else...yet

 

19My bowels, my bowels! I am pained at my very heart; my heart maketh a noise in me; I cannot hold my peace, because thou hast heard, O my soul, the sound of the trumpet, the alarm of war.

20Destruction upon destruction is cried; for the whole land is spoiled: suddenly are my tents spoiled, and my curtains in a moment.

21How long shall I see the standard, and hear the sound of the trumpet?

22For my people is foolish, they have not known me; they are sottish children, and they have none understanding: they are wise to do evil, but to do good they have no knowledge.

23I beheld the earth, and, lo, it was without form, and void; and the heavens, and they had no light.

IF the earth would have had 'no light' then Noah and his family and all the animals would have frozen to death.
 

24 I beheld the mountains, and, lo, they trembled, and all the hills moved lightly.

25 I beheld, and, lo, there was no man, and all the birds of the heavens were fled.

No 'Noah', no bird to send forth from the ark...

 

26 I beheld, and, lo, the fruitful place was a wilderness, and all the cities thereof were broken down at the presence of the LORD, and by his fierce anger.

During the flood, it was under water, it didn't become 'a wilderness' first.




 

27 For thus hath the LORD said, The whole land shall be desolate; yet will I not make a full end.

28 For this shall the earth mourn, and the heavens above be black: because I have spoken it, I have purposed it, and will not repent, neither will I turn back from it.

We see the EARTH as a place with the heavens above BLACK.  Again, NOT during the flood of Noahs day is that given. 


Only one time are we given that kind of info and that is at the beginning of us 'partaking' in the flesh and blood body of the dust of the earth, the days of being a 'human', before we RETURN to God, and as Jesus said 'like the angels'...aka spiritual bodies.



1 In the beginning God created the heaven and the earth. 2And the earth was without form, and void; and darkness was upon the face of the deep. And the Spirit of God moved upon the face of the waters.

 

[BornAgain490]

35 minutes ago, DeighAnn said:

IF the earth would have had 'no light' then Noah and his family and all the animals would have frozen to death.

Says who?  God protected Noah and all those on the ark.   If you doubt that, then you must also question whether the laws of gravity vanished when the sun stood still for a whole day?  (Joshua 10:13).   God is able to do that which man could never do. 

[Diaste]

9 hours ago, BornAgain490 said:

Says who?  God protected Noah and all those on the ark.   If you doubt that, then you must also question whether the laws of gravity vanished when the sun stood still for a whole day?  (Joshua 10:13).   God is able to do that which man could never do. 

I know, right? I get there are physical laws and they are beneficial, but they are also chains. God has no such restraints and can literally do anything at any moment. 

Some out there are like Jesus rose again and saved us from our sins, what a miracle! God can do anything! Then those same people think God required natural processes to bring forth life as we see it, and is somehow bound by those same processes. SMH.

[AdHoc]

13 hours ago, BornAgain490 said:

Be fair, now: hayetah tohu wabohu has more than one interpretation.  It can, and does translate, "was without form and void (or empty)", consistent with the textual reading in the English translations. 

Thomas Chalmers, who began the nonsense of a gap between Gen. 1:1 and 2, was more concerned with his peers in the scientific community calling him nuts for not siding with scientists who rejected young earth creationism. 

Chalmers started a division and a cult that attracted many weak wishy-washy followers who call themselves "Bible believers."

"without form and void" is not what we discuss. We discuss the verb "was". In 1611 English "was" means "come to pass". Just use it equally in Genesis 1:2 and Isaiah 45:18. Both have the same context - God creating. God says He DID NOT make it a chaos. You imply that He did. I'm willing to bet you don't think that. But equally you should acknowledge that there is evidence of a period after creation when the earth became something it was not when God had finished. It's not like this theory hangs on one point. The covering of the earth with water is something established, and darkness, despite heaven being full of light, is also indicative of God's judgment.

[Desopixi Seilynam]

"I wisdom was set up from everlasting, before ever the earth was.
When there were no fountains abounding with water, I was brought forth."

Proverbs 8:23-24

The water was created first, water flowing from God Himself (Rev 22:1)
Before that God wisely planned to die on behalf of His creation.

"In the beginning God created the heavens and the earth.
Now, the earth (that is the water) was without form and empty,
and darkness covered the face of the deep (the water)
and the Spirit of God was hovering over the water."
Genesis 1:1-2

There is the original translation as can still be found in a 1400 Bible.

"..I alone stretched out the heavens. By myself I made the earth and everything in it"
Isaiah 44:24

Satan did not exist before the skies were made.
The Creator has never been subject to Satan in any way shape or form.

 

 

[BornAgain490]

1 hour ago, AdHoc said:

God says He DID NOT make it a chaos. You imply that He did.

No I'm not: "was  formless and void" does not imply chaos. You're translation "became" implies God created, and then had to destroy what He created because it was chaotic. 

There is no gap. 

The six days of creation is "the beginning." 

[other one]

The purpose of the Millennium.

 

I personally think the purpose of the Millennium is to show all creation how everything should be without the influence of Satan.  After he's turned loose, he corrupts people again and deserves everything he's getting when he is put away eternally.

 

 

[AdHoc]

3 hours ago, Desopixi Seilynam said:

"I wisdom was set up from everlasting, before ever the earth was.
When there were no fountains abounding with water, I was brought forth."

Proverbs 8:23-24

The water was created first, water flowing from God Himself (Rev 22:1)
Before that God wisely planned to die on behalf of His creation.

"In the beginning God created the heavens and the earth.
Now, the earth (that is the water) was without form and empty,
and darkness covered the face of the deep (the water)
and the Spirit of God was hovering over the water."
Genesis 1:1-2

There is the original translation as can still be found in a 1400 Bible.

"..I alone stretched out the heavens. By myself I made the earth and everything in it"
Isaiah 44:24

Satan did not exist before the skies were made.
The Creator has never been subject to Satan in any way shape or form.

 

 

 

3 hours ago, BornAgain490 said:

No I'm not: "was  formless and void" does not imply chaos. You're translation "became" implies God created, and then had to destroy what He created because it was chaotic. 

There is no gap. 

The six days of creation is "the beginning." 

Heaven is God's Throne - the seat of governing the universe. All the laws of nature, like gravity - a governing law, would have been included. Then God would have been faced with His first problem. He is a holy God and so is ever so distinct from that which is created - though it be glorious. He must humble Himself to look down at the Creature (Psalms). Then, to make a place of fellowship where He could be "covered" with a mediator, He would have built the Tabernacle of heaven - the one that Moses had to copy. Then He would have created the heavenly host - the angels, and they in turn would have been ordered into Principalities - for government.

With this in place we come to Job 38 where, in verse 7, the angels rejoiced at His prowess and wisdom in laying the foundations of the earth. Whether all this took microseconds or billions of years is moot. God is ALL-Mighty. But what is confirmed is that God had a plan and an orderly sequence.

As soon as "chaos" entered the picture, one can be very sure that another person, entity or force is at work. We were not there when this happened, but it has pleased God to reveal a little bit of it - for His glory. Each of us as access to the Bible and God has given Talents to men to be language specialists, Apostles, Teachers and Elders. Peer pressure is enormous. Professors are subject to constant scrutiny by equally qualified men. Any translation work that wasn't representable would be laughed to scorn. Wild translations would end up damaging egos - and we know from the Forum how explosive that can be. Ego is man's downfall - and YET, it is a wonderful policeman. If there are clues, they are inserted in the picture we have. If they are absurd, we discard them.

If God created water first, consider this. Without a source of heat the temperature would be absolute zero. That is -273°C / -460°F. The water would be useless. But ... God is All-mighty and He could make the water flow at that temperature. If He did though, He would have made laws just to break them. Why make them if they are counter-productive and then why break them if an intelligent man could have not made them at all. You see. All is possible with God but we are dealing with the highest instance of intelligence in existence.

If He says that he created heaven and earth to be inhabited, and he covers the earth with deep water, two possibilities exist. Either He is not truthful, or something ugly happened that needed covering with water. If He then tells us that He covered the earth s second time because of very evil behavior, we can safely assume that this was the reason for the first covering. And even more so when He institutes BAPTISM and makes idol-wordhipers be dunked (Josh.24:2, 14).

We could always be wrong, but a strong indication of a certain series of events is at hand.

[BornAgain490]

4 minutes ago, AdHoc said:

As soon as "chaos" entered the picture, one can be very sure that another person, entity or force is at work.

I reject that interpretation/translation: chaos.  

The statement: "And the earth was formless and void", is simply stating that in the creative process, in the beginning when God created the heavens and the earth, God created the earth without form and empty, meaning there was no life in it. 

God then tells us what He did to form the earth and to fill it with life in the days following the first day of creation.

God's word confirms that the six days of creation are the beginning.  Exodus 20:11, "For in six days the Lord made heaven and earth, the sea and all that in them is."  

Revelation confirms that the first heaven and the first earth.  Rev. 21:1

Jesus Christ, God in the flesh, confirms that the six days of creation are the beginning. Matthew 19:4; Mark 10:6. 

Peter even acknowledges that scoffers (unbelievers) will say, "all things continue as they were from the beginning of the creation."  Peter 2:4. 

29 minutes ago, AdHoc said:

If God created water first, consider this. Without a source of heat the temperature would be absolute zero. That is -273°C / -460°F. The water would be useless.

God is omnipotent. He is not hamstrung by what we mere humans know. 

 

32 minutes ago, AdHoc said:

God is All-mighty and He could make the water flow at that temperature.

Full stop 🛑 

 

33 minutes ago, AdHoc said:

If He did though, He would have made laws just to break them.

Says who?  God knew what, when, where, how, and why He was doing when He created time, matter, space, the heavens and the earth and all that is in them.  What little we know is, by God's grace, that which God has revealed to us. To God be glory forever. Amen. 

 

44 minutes ago, AdHoc said:

If He says that he created heaven and earth to be inhabited, and he covers the earth with deep water, two possibilities exist. Either He is not truthful, or something ugly happened that needed covering with water.

Or, both of your assumptions are wrong.  The right view is that the earth was without form and void in the beginning because that was how God began His sovereign creative process. 

 

48 minutes ago, AdHoc said:

If He then tells us that He covered the earth s second time because of very evil behavior, we can safely assume that this was the reason for the first covering.

God tells us of His creative process in the beginning: the earth was formless and void and covered in water.  God did nor create life until day three. 

God tells us why He destroyed life in the flood of Noah's day.