Running Gator Posted June 21, 2016 Group: Royal Member * Followers: 8 Topic Count: 91 Topics Per Day: 0.03 Content Count: 10,596 Content Per Day: 3.69 Reputation: 2,743 Days Won: 25 Joined: 06/16/2016 Status: Offline Share Posted June 21, 2016 4 minutes ago, woundeddog said: oh please That is a very non-committal answer. But I guess since you have wrongly guessed the books were filled with necromancy that you have not. Have you read CS Lewis or JRR Tolkien? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
LadyKay Posted June 22, 2016 Group: Royal Member Followers: 12 Topic Count: 385 Topics Per Day: 0.10 Content Count: 7,692 Content Per Day: 1.93 Reputation: 4,809 Days Won: 3 Joined: 05/28/2013 Status: Offline Share Posted June 22, 2016 4 hours ago, Out of the Shadows said: I had no issue with them 15 years ago and have none now, except I find them poorly written. If anyone is ok with Toliken or Lewis should not complain about the content of Harry Potter, just the lack of skill in writing by Rowling. Finely! I found someone here who thinks like me ! Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
woundeddog Posted June 22, 2016 Group: Diamond Member Followers: 6 Topic Count: 44 Topics Per Day: 0.01 Content Count: 1,370 Content Per Day: 0.25 Reputation: 1,054 Days Won: 0 Joined: 06/21/2009 Status: Offline Birthday: 07/18/1868 Share Posted June 22, 2016 3 hours ago, Out of the Shadows said: Have you read CS Lewis or JRR Tolkien? I've read them both, and came away mostly unimpressed. Personally Idont think the whole Harry Potter world is edifying for Christians and since its primarily aimed at children it certainly doesn't point them to Jesus-- casting spells is not the type of thing that Jesus would endorse, so I have to give Harry a thumbs down Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
SIC Posted June 22, 2016 Group: Diamond Member Followers: 13 Topic Count: 34 Topics Per Day: 0.01 Content Count: 2,436 Content Per Day: 0.84 Reputation: 2,625 Days Won: 3 Joined: 05/02/2016 Status: Offline Birthday: 08/11/1989 Share Posted June 22, 2016 It's harmless.. I am a huge fan of both the books and movies. That doesnt affect my walk with Christ Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Annika Posted October 8, 2016 Group: Members Followers: 2 Topic Count: 4 Topics Per Day: 0.00 Content Count: 26 Content Per Day: 0.01 Reputation: 14 Days Won: 0 Joined: 10/03/2016 Status: Offline Share Posted October 8, 2016 I feel like I'm resurrecting a really old thread here, but I see this debate is still going on so I'll throw in my two cents. I'm inclined to agree with SIC, although growing up in an atheistic household has probably biased me somewhat. Harry Potter is a fiction -- it is not real, and I feel like it's insulting to children's intelligence to automatically assume that they cannot tell it is a fiction. This being said, fiction can negatively influence our thinking. For example, A Clockwork Orange was banned for a while after inciting a spate of violent behaviour from those individuals who could not distinguish between what was real and what was not. Modern day video games can lead people astray. The problem is that in this world, we cannot eternally wrap up our children in cotton wool. Sooner or later they're going to have to face the world and all the evil that is in it, and when they do they are likely to rebel against a blanket censorship of "inappropriate" reading material -- particularly when the parents concerned have not bothered to properly vet the books that are banned. This is likely to have the opposite effect to what well-meaning parents intend when they censor books like Harry Potter. Whilst others might disagree with me, I feel Harry Potter is actually a book we should encourage our children to read. JK Rowling herself said that there was an underlying Christian theme to her writing, specifically the seventh and last book where "good" triumphs over "evil". Values which we should be encouraging in children are present throughout the series, and this is what I as a young, impressionable reader internalised. Not the witchcraft (which I understood to be a fantasy element) but the following values and messages: Sacrifice - Harry willingly goes to what he believes to be his death knowing that it is only through this that he may defeat evil once and for all (interesting parallel here, don't you think?) Harry's friends willingly act as body doubles for Harry so they can protect him and therefore the greater cause, resulting in their own deaths and injuries. All too aware that he must die, Dumbledore does not cling to life but sacrifices himself early, knowing that the Elder Wand will only bring suffering or corruption to the bearer -- unless he dies undefeated. Ron sacrifices himself in the real-life game of chess so that his friends can proceed to destroy the Philosopher's Stone. Love - Snape's love for Lily resulted in him becoming a double agent, pretending to serve the Dark side when in reality he was gathering intelligence for Dumbledore and the rest of the Order. Harry's love for Sirius resulted in him risking life and limb to venture into the Ministry to save his godfather. Narcissa Malfoy's love and concern for her son Draco causes her to turn her back on Voldemort's cause. Dumbledore's love and guilt for his deceased sister Ariana, which caused him to turn his back on evil and devote the rest of his life to goodness and the defeat of evil. We Must Battle On No Matter What - When the love of her life abandoned her, Hermione did not allow her own heartbreak to get in the way of standing by what she knew to be right. Despite the loss of one of her sons, Molly Weasley continued fighting and vanquished one of Voldemort's closest followers. Grief-stricken after his brother's death, Ron wants to kill the Death Eaters. Harry continues to battle on after Cedric is killed, despite this experience having a profound psychological impact on him. I won't list all the examples because there are literally hundreds, if not thousands, littered throughout the pages of every book. Sin Leads To Unhappiness - Petunia lived her life in a state of hatred due to her own jealousy of her magical sister. Snape's deep-set prejudice against those without pedigree magical heritage led him to lose the love of his life, though he never stopped repenting and trying to atone for this. Merope Gaunt's means of forcibly coercing her crush to love her meant that she eventually became loveless and destitute. Draco Malfoy's own sins caught up with him when he ended up caving under the stress of doing Voldemort's bidding. Yes, some characters commit misdemeanours aplenty with little direct consequence (I'm thinking of the Weasley twins here) but the majority end up unhappy as a direct result of their own sin. Forgiveness And Loving Your Enemies - Hermione forgave Ron for abandoning her. Harry tried to give Voldemort, who was essentially irredeemable, one final chance. Harry saved Draco and Goyle -- his sworn enemies -- from the fire of their own making. Harry and Lupin mutually forgive each other for the judgements they passed on one another, going on to fight together in the Battle of Hogwarts. Harry frequently forgives Hagrid his bumbling mistakes, and Dobby his misguided attempts to "help" him (which end up harming Harry more so than helping him). Harry forgives Snape in the end, so much so that he names his son after him. Don't Judge A Book By Its Cover - Hagrid, a half-giant and therefore discriminated against by many in the wizarding world, was incredibly loyal to Harry. Dobby, a slave to the Malfoy family, only ever had Harry's best interests at heart despite being forced to punish himself every time he did something that went against his family's orders. Lupin, a werewolf, still fought on Harry's side and tried his utmost to protect everyone around him from himself. Wormtail hesitates when confronted with Harry's words, "I saved your life" and this results in his death. Even Sirius Black's pompous, Death Eater brother (whom we all had pinned as a coward at best, a bad guy at worse) was willing to steal the original Horcrux at the cost of his own life but sparing his slave Kreacher's life in the process. I will impress upon whoever's sat through my little spiel (and if you've taken the time to read my huge wall of text, then thank you) the huge emphasis of good versus evil. Yes, in our world witchcraft is not something to be condoned, but if we see it as a metaphor then it is really just a way of showing us how important it is to have "constant vigilance" (to quote Mad-Eye Moody, one of my favourite characters in the entire series). The subject of "Defence Against the Dark Arts" is taught at Hogwarts -- when Voldemort's followers take over the school, it is only then that the "Dark Arts" themselves are taught (which leads to a small band of brave resistance fighters standing up against this twisted system). I see parallels between the pages of Harry Potter and the pages of the Bible, in a loose and figurative sense. Voldemort is an almost Satanic villain, wholly beyond redemption, but acts because of a lack of love. When we do not recognise God's love, we fall into erroneous ways. Voldemort cannot recognise or acknowledge love, and so he becomes evil, placing his mark on his closest followers so they become his for eternity. Harry is perhaps a Christlike figure, willingly going to his death. He has faith that Dumbledore is doing the right thing by saying that he must do this, even though he cannot say with certainty that he will come out of the fight with Voldemort alive. Kind of like how Jesus had faith in his Heavenly Father that he would rise again. Furthermore, the words of Harry's prophecy (as told by Professor Trelawney, perhaps standing in for some kind of prophet or mystic) echo Christianity. Neither can live while the other survives. In this context, the "neither" and "other" are Voldemort (evil) and Harry (love). In the same sense, God (who is represented in the books by goodness and love) will not be acknowledged as sovereign ruler by everyone until the end times, when love will triumph over evil. It's hard for us to live -- really live -- when our lives are so dominated by sin, but in the Kingdom of Heaven we will not have sin, just God's love, for the old order of things will have passed away. And love (not magic and certainly not evil) is the most potent weapon in the Potter universe. It's what protects Harry when he is a baby -- and when he "dies" for his followers during the Battle of Hogwarts, that love protects his followers, the true believers and warriors in Harry's cause, so that evil (Voldemort) literally cannot touch them. He casts his evil spells or "demonic influence" at them, yet the spells bounce off them because of Harry's love. There are so many analogies which make the Potter universe so much more than simply "Satanic material" and I love the rich ways in which the final book mirrors Revelation. A Bible-based study of Harry Potter, focusing on the parallels, could be a really good way to get kids engaged with the Gospel message too. I would say to any parents who aren't sure whether or not to expose their kids to Harry Potter -- let them. There are many far worse fantasy books out there they could be reading, such as Game of Thrones (oh man, that is a sinful book and a half, even to the adult reader who knows it's fantasy). Have a chat with them about it first if you want to (even read it first to check it's OK -- just don't ban it if you've never even read it) and make sure they think critically about it, but in my opinion, a good core message dressed up with fantasy is much more beneficial to a child's enquiring mind than a bad core message dressed up with something that appears Christian but isn't. I've read and still love Harry Potter and I know that while its face is not really particularly "Christian", its core values absolutely are. tl;dr: It has good values, Biblical parallels and at the end of the day, it's nothing more than a story. It can be a great tool to teach children about the Bible, if you choose to use it in this way. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
RustyAngeL Posted October 8, 2016 Group: Worthy Ministers Followers: 23 Topic Count: 155 Topics Per Day: 0.02 Content Count: 7,464 Content Per Day: 1.02 Reputation: 8,810 Days Won: 57 Joined: 03/30/2004 Status: Offline Birthday: 12/12/1952 Share Posted October 8, 2016 On 6/21/2016 at 9:56 PM, woundeddog said: I've read them both, and came away mostly unimpressed. Personally Idont think the whole Harry Potter world is edifying for Christians and since its primarily aimed at children it certainly doesn't point them to Jesus-- casting spells is not the type of thing that Jesus would endorse, so I have to give Harry a thumbs down My personal opinion, if I had kids they would not be allowed near Harry Potter. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
nebula Posted October 8, 2016 Group: Royal Member Followers: 10 Topic Count: 5,823 Topics Per Day: 0.76 Content Count: 45,870 Content Per Day: 5.95 Reputation: 1,897 Days Won: 83 Joined: 03/22/2003 Status: Offline Birthday: 11/19/1970 Share Posted October 8, 2016 How one feels about the book first and foremost comes out of how they feel about the Fantasy genre. I do not know of a single person who does not like Fantasy novel/movies who feels OK with Harry Potter or has anything positive to say about it. A few posts above are evidence to this point. If one doesn't care for The Lord of the Rings, one will most certainly not care for Harry Potter. Now I would be curious about those who are anti-Harry Potter who have also read and enjoyed other fantasy novels (i.e. The Wheel of Time series, any of the David Eddings series, the Shannara series, etc.). Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Churchmouse Posted October 8, 2016 Group: Diamond Member Followers: 4 Topic Count: 91 Topics Per Day: 0.03 Content Count: 2,216 Content Per Day: 0.80 Reputation: 1,014 Days Won: 0 Joined: 09/29/2016 Status: Offline Birthday: 04/02/1958 Share Posted October 8, 2016 6 hours ago, RustyAngeL said: My personal opinion, if I had kids they would not be allowed near Harry Potter. Why would that be? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
angels4u Posted October 8, 2016 Group: Worthy Ministers Followers: 56 Topic Count: 1,664 Topics Per Day: 0.20 Content Count: 19,764 Content Per Day: 2.39 Reputation: 12,164 Days Won: 28 Joined: 08/22/2001 Status: Offline Share Posted October 8, 2016 I realize that I started this topic in 2001 and remember posting it, I didn't change my opinion about the Harry Potter books. Catsmeow's didn't start this topic ,there must have been a mix up with the names in the program when George changed servers.. Do you think we see Harry Potter books laying around in heaven? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Churchmouse Posted October 8, 2016 Group: Diamond Member Followers: 4 Topic Count: 91 Topics Per Day: 0.03 Content Count: 2,216 Content Per Day: 0.80 Reputation: 1,014 Days Won: 0 Joined: 09/29/2016 Status: Offline Birthday: 04/02/1958 Share Posted October 8, 2016 1 minute ago, angels4u said: I realize that I started this topic in 2001 and remember posting it, I didn't change my opinion about the Harry Potter books. Catsmeow's didn't start this topic ,there must have been a mix up with the names in the program when George changed servers.. Do you think we see Harry Potter books laying around in heaven? Why would you think there would be any books in heaven? What would their purpose be? To me they are educational or recreational. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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