Congress should be calling for a state of war

[gdemoss]

This is why I said scripturally discern and not spiritually discern, Gary. If you can get me a scripture that prophetically points to the judgement of the united states I'd be willing to at least hear you out on it.

Steve

The problem with this is that one must be able to spiritually discern what the scriptures say prophetically.

Rev 19:10 And I fell at his feet to worship him. And he said unto me, See [thou do it] not: I am thy fellowservant, and of thy brethren that have the testimony of Jesus: worship God: for the testimony of Jesus is the spirit of prophecy.

The gift of prophecy didn't cease to function upon the completion of the canon. It is still in full effect. According to Paul one needs to be a prophet in order to confirm/deny the truth of what the prophet is saying.

1Cr 14:29-30 Let the prophets speak two or three, and let the other judge. If [any thing] be revealed to another that sitteth by, let the first hold his peace.

1Cr 14:37 If any man think himself to be a prophet, or spiritual, let him acknowledge that the things that I write unto you are the commandments of the Lord.

Being able to discern 'scripturally', meaning that their is a clear proof text that spells out something is for anyone and everyone but God has given the gift of prophecy unto those who he wills for his purposes. And that being edification of the church. Being able to see the end of the gentile church upon us is a very important revelation because a call to repentance of the church must be sounded out with it. The biggest problem we have today is not enough people having the gift of prophecy and therefore able to judge that which is said by those who prophesy.

When I first began understanding the bible in a prophetic nature on top of a literal manner, I thought that everyone would be able to see and understand what I do as it is clear to me. That hasn't been the case at all though and I am wrote off as a nut job most of the time.

Can I link together scripture that will show that what I say is true? Yes. Most do not accept what I show them as truth. There are those who do and when they understand what I am showing them their lives change immediately. They begin to remove the sin out of their lives and seek Gods face to avoid the coming judgment.

Oh I think judgement is well on the way and the waves are already touching the shore

I guess no one understood what I meant by fifth column?

I did not understand your post to mean you thought Muslims were in any way righteous even though it seems that some took it that way

I just think words are flying too fast....no human being has the answer to the spiritual problem that is exhibiting itself

Gary

[Steve_S]

This is why I said scripturally discern and not spiritually discern, Gary. If you can get me a scripture that prophetically points to the judgement of the united states I'd be willing to at least hear you out on it.

Steve

The problem with this is that one must be able to spiritually discern what the scriptures say prophetically.

Rev 19:10 And I fell at his feet to worship him. And he said unto me, See [thou do it] not: I am thy fellowservant, and of thy brethren that have the testimony of Jesus: worship God: for the testimony of Jesus is the spirit of prophecy.

The gift of prophecy didn't cease to function upon the completion of the canon. It is still in full effect. According to Paul one needs to be a prophet in order to confirm/deny the truth of what the prophet is saying.

1Cr 14:29-30 Let the prophets speak two or three, and let the other judge. If [any thing] be revealed to another that sitteth by, let the first hold his peace.

1Cr 14:37 If any man think himself to be a prophet, or spiritual, let him acknowledge that the things that I write unto you are the commandments of the Lord.

Being able to discern 'scripturally', meaning that their is a clear proof text that spells out something is for anyone and everyone but God has given the gift of prophecy unto those who he wills for his purposes. And that being edification of the church. Being able to see the end of the gentile church upon us is a very important revelation because a call to repentance of the church must be sounded out with it. The biggest problem we have today is not enough people having the gift of prophecy and therefore able to judge that which is said by those who prophesy.

When I first began understanding the bible in a prophetic nature on top of a literal manner, I thought that everyone would be able to see and understand what I do as it is clear to me. That hasn't been the case at all though and I am wrote off as a nut job most of the time.

Can I link together scripture that will show that what I say is true? Yes. Most do not accept what I show them as truth. There are those who do and when they understand what I am showing them their lives change immediately. They begin to remove the sin out of their lives and seek Gods face to avoid the coming judgment.

Oh I think judgement is well on the way and the waves are already touching the shore

I guess no one understood what I meant by fifth column?

I did not understand your post to mean you thought Muslims were in any way righteous even though it seems that some took it that way

I just think words are flying too fast....no human being has the answer to the spiritual problem that is exhibiting itself

Gary

Again, I ask you to provide specific scripture with regards to judgement on the United States.

[gdemoss]

This is why I said scripturally discern and not spiritually discern, Gary. If you can get me a scripture that prophetically points to the judgement of the united states I'd be willing to at least hear you out on it.

Steve

The problem with this is that one must be able to spiritually discern what the scriptures say prophetically.

Rev 19:10 And I fell at his feet to worship him. And he said unto me, See [thou do it] not: I am thy fellowservant, and of thy brethren that have the testimony of Jesus: worship God: for the testimony of Jesus is the spirit of prophecy.

The gift of prophecy didn't cease to function upon the completion of the canon. It is still in full effect. According to Paul one needs to be a prophet in order to confirm/deny the truth of what the prophet is saying.

1Cr 14:29-30 Let the prophets speak two or three, and let the other judge. If [any thing] be revealed to another that sitteth by, let the first hold his peace.

1Cr 14:37 If any man think himself to be a prophet, or spiritual, let him acknowledge that the things that I write unto you are the commandments of the Lord.

Being able to discern 'scripturally', meaning that their is a clear proof text that spells out something is for anyone and everyone but God has given the gift of prophecy unto those who he wills for his purposes. And that being edification of the church. Being able to see the end of the gentile church upon us is a very important revelation because a call to repentance of the church must be sounded out with it. The biggest problem we have today is not enough people having the gift of prophecy and therefore able to judge that which is said by those who prophesy.

When I first began understanding the bible in a prophetic nature on top of a literal manner, I thought that everyone would be able to see and understand what I do as it is clear to me. That hasn't been the case at all though and I am wrote off as a nut job most of the time.

Can I link together scripture that will show that what I say is true? Yes. Most do not accept what I show them as truth. There are those who do and when they understand what I am showing them their lives change immediately. They begin to remove the sin out of their lives and seek Gods face to avoid the coming judgment.

Oh I think judgement is well on the way and the waves are already touching the shore

I guess no one understood what I meant by fifth column?

I did not understand your post to mean you thought Muslims were in any way righteous even though it seems that some took it that way

I just think words are flying too fast....no human being has the answer to the spiritual problem that is exhibiting itself

Gary

Again, I ask you to provide specific scripture with regards to judgement on the United States.

What would you expect to see?

Gary

[Steve_S]

This is why I said scripturally discern and not spiritually discern, Gary. If you can get me a scripture that prophetically points to the judgement of the united states I'd be willing to at least hear you out on it.

Steve

The problem with this is that one must be able to spiritually discern what the scriptures say prophetically.

Rev 19:10 And I fell at his feet to worship him. And he said unto me, See [thou do it] not: I am thy fellowservant, and of thy brethren that have the testimony of Jesus: worship God: for the testimony of Jesus is the spirit of prophecy.

The gift of prophecy didn't cease to function upon the completion of the canon. It is still in full effect. According to Paul one needs to be a prophet in order to confirm/deny the truth of what the prophet is saying.

1Cr 14:29-30 Let the prophets speak two or three, and let the other judge. If [any thing] be revealed to another that sitteth by, let the first hold his peace.

1Cr 14:37 If any man think himself to be a prophet, or spiritual, let him acknowledge that the things that I write unto you are the commandments of the Lord.

Being able to discern 'scripturally', meaning that their is a clear proof text that spells out something is for anyone and everyone but God has given the gift of prophecy unto those who he wills for his purposes. And that being edification of the church. Being able to see the end of the gentile church upon us is a very important revelation because a call to repentance of the church must be sounded out with it. The biggest problem we have today is not enough people having the gift of prophecy and therefore able to judge that which is said by those who prophesy.

When I first began understanding the bible in a prophetic nature on top of a literal manner, I thought that everyone would be able to see and understand what I do as it is clear to me. That hasn't been the case at all though and I am wrote off as a nut job most of the time.

Can I link together scripture that will show that what I say is true? Yes. Most do not accept what I show them as truth. There are those who do and when they understand what I am showing them their lives change immediately. They begin to remove the sin out of their lives and seek Gods face to avoid the coming judgment.

Oh I think judgement is well on the way and the waves are already touching the shore

I guess no one understood what I meant by fifth column?

I did not understand your post to mean you thought Muslims were in any way righteous even though it seems that some took it that way

I just think words are flying too fast....no human being has the answer to the spiritual problem that is exhibiting itself

Gary

Again, I ask you to provide specific scripture with regards to judgement on the United States.

What would you expect to see?

Gary

I don't know, that's why I'm asking you to provide it. When I said scripturally discern I meant Holy Spirit led scriptural discernment as opposed to extra-scriptural discernment, meaning personal revelation. I don't know what to expect, but it seems that you're making a claim that you've had personal revelation with regards to specific scripture that is pertinent to the united states being judged and if that's the case I'd like to see what scripture to which you refer. I apologize if I'm errant in my interpretation of your previous statements in that regard.

Steve

[gdemoss]

This is why I said scripturally discern and not spiritually discern, Gary. If you can get me a scripture that prophetically points to the judgement of the united states I'd be willing to at least hear you out on it.

Steve

The problem with this is that one must be able to spiritually discern what the scriptures say prophetically.

Rev 19:10 And I fell at his feet to worship him. And he said unto me, See [thou do it] not: I am thy fellowservant, and of thy brethren that have the testimony of Jesus: worship God: for the testimony of Jesus is the spirit of prophecy.

The gift of prophecy didn't cease to function upon the completion of the canon. It is still in full effect. According to Paul one needs to be a prophet in order to confirm/deny the truth of what the prophet is saying.

1Cr 14:29-30 Let the prophets speak two or three, and let the other judge. If [any thing] be revealed to another that sitteth by, let the first hold his peace.

1Cr 14:37 If any man think himself to be a prophet, or spiritual, let him acknowledge that the things that I write unto you are the commandments of the Lord.

Being able to discern 'scripturally', meaning that their is a clear proof text that spells out something is for anyone and everyone but God has given the gift of prophecy unto those who he wills for his purposes. And that being edification of the church. Being able to see the end of the gentile church upon us is a very important revelation because a call to repentance of the church must be sounded out with it. The biggest problem we have today is not enough people having the gift of prophecy and therefore able to judge that which is said by those who prophesy.

When I first began understanding the bible in a prophetic nature on top of a literal manner, I thought that everyone would be able to see and understand what I do as it is clear to me. That hasn't been the case at all though and I am wrote off as a nut job most of the time.

Can I link together scripture that will show that what I say is true? Yes. Most do not accept what I show them as truth. There are those who do and when they understand what I am showing them their lives change immediately. They begin to remove the sin out of their lives and seek Gods face to avoid the coming judgment.

Oh I think judgement is well on the way and the waves are already touching the shore

I guess no one understood what I meant by fifth column?

I did not understand your post to mean you thought Muslims were in any way righteous even though it seems that some took it that way

I just think words are flying too fast....no human being has the answer to the spiritual problem that is exhibiting itself

Gary

Again, I ask you to provide specific scripture with regards to judgement on the United States.

What would you expect to see?

Gary

I don't know, that's why I'm asking you to provide it. When I said scripturally discern I meant Holy Spirit led scriptural discernment as opposed to extra-scriptural discernment, meaning personal revelation. I don't know what to expect, but it seems that you're making a claim that you've had personal revelation with regards to specific scripture that is pertinent to the united states being judged and if that's the case I'd like to see what scripture to which you refer. I apologize if I'm errant in my interpretation of your previous statements in that regard.

Steve

Steve, I appreciate your patience and I am working to understand. I truly want to be able to cut to the chase and help you understand what I am seeing in the scriptures that leads me to believe the things I have said about the United States. The problem is that it isn't as simple as looking at a few scriptures and pointing out the way it is laid out. Much of what I learned in the first few years of study was like basic math. I read, understood and followed scripture. As the time passed the math became more and more advanced based upon the initial functions that I learned. The complexity in understanding increases as well. And when I begin to try to explain this I fear that I will come off as being condescending when that is in no way what I am desiring as we are to condescend to men of low estate and not be condescending.

I have no real confidence that anything will be sufficient based upon the interactions that I have had with you on related threads. Much of my understanding of 'what' the United Sates is and how it came to be aids in my understanding of how God will judge her. But when speaking about human government in another thread you disagreed with that which I saw. If you don't agree with me about how God raises up and governs nations in our present age, then you will never see the coming judgment in the scriptures. Everything revolves around the church and Israel including human government. According to scripture God founded the nations and set their boundaries according to his own will.

It is my sincere desire that you and everyone else that I talk to come to understand how all of this that is happening all around us is contained within the scriptures as it pertains to Gods people. One of the Devils greatest accomplishments is getting Gods people to reject knowledge. It is by this method that he can then destroy them.

Gary

[Sevenseas]

If I may? What I personally see and believe regarding all of the above, is that God does not treat one nation or one people differently

than another. If it was bad for Israel, it is bad for the US, Canada, Australia, UK....doesn't matter

If sin of one sort or another calls down God's wrath on one population, it will do so on another committing the same sin

That, is a very simplistic view

I certainly agree about God raising up and governing nations and agree because that is, simply put, what scripture validates and

illustrates.

To understand, you have to have a good working knowledge of the Bible...both testaments and not just certain passages.

Judgement with regards to the US, would, using the above understanding of the Bible, would be the same as for any other nation

committing the grievous sins that the US is committing. No exceptions. It's been coming for awhile now.

When I read the 'who am I going to vote for' threads, I start to worry. Why? Because there is no third choice.

I may be wrong and let Gary clarify, but I do not think he is actually stating that the Bible is specifically stating judgement on the US

in the way God declared judgement on Israel when they turned their back on Him. (meaning the US is not mentionned by name

or even necessarily location although Gary may think otherwise I don't know)

IMO, I see a good amount of myopic introspection and a solid dose of tunnel vision going on with regards to the future.

I am not aiming the above at anyone. I do not see where, in scripture, blatant sin goes unpunished. Does anyone really believe that having

Obama another 4 yrs is going to bless your nation? I don't.

[Steve_S]

This is why I said scripturally discern and not spiritually discern, Gary. If you can get me a scripture that prophetically points to the judgement of the united states I'd be willing to at least hear you out on it.

Steve

The problem with this is that one must be able to spiritually discern what the scriptures say prophetically.

Rev 19:10 And I fell at his feet to worship him. And he said unto me, See [thou do it] not: I am thy fellowservant, and of thy brethren that have the testimony of Jesus: worship God: for the testimony of Jesus is the spirit of prophecy.

The gift of prophecy didn't cease to function upon the completion of the canon. It is still in full effect. According to Paul one needs to be a prophet in order to confirm/deny the truth of what the prophet is saying.

1Cr 14:29-30 Let the prophets speak two or three, and let the other judge. If [any thing] be revealed to another that sitteth by, let the first hold his peace.

1Cr 14:37 If any man think himself to be a prophet, or spiritual, let him acknowledge that the things that I write unto you are the commandments of the Lord.

Being able to discern 'scripturally', meaning that their is a clear proof text that spells out something is for anyone and everyone but God has given the gift of prophecy unto those who he wills for his purposes. And that being edification of the church. Being able to see the end of the gentile church upon us is a very important revelation because a call to repentance of the church must be sounded out with it. The biggest problem we have today is not enough people having the gift of prophecy and therefore able to judge that which is said by those who prophesy.

When I first began understanding the bible in a prophetic nature on top of a literal manner, I thought that everyone would be able to see and understand what I do as it is clear to me. That hasn't been the case at all though and I am wrote off as a nut job most of the time.

Can I link together scripture that will show that what I say is true? Yes. Most do not accept what I show them as truth. There are those who do and when they understand what I am showing them their lives change immediately. They begin to remove the sin out of their lives and seek Gods face to avoid the coming judgment.

Oh I think judgement is well on the way and the waves are already touching the shore

I guess no one understood what I meant by fifth column?

I did not understand your post to mean you thought Muslims were in any way righteous even though it seems that some took it that way

I just think words are flying too fast....no human being has the answer to the spiritual problem that is exhibiting itself

Gary

Again, I ask you to provide specific scripture with regards to judgement on the United States.

What would you expect to see?

Gary

I don't know, that's why I'm asking you to provide it. When I said scripturally discern I meant Holy Spirit led scriptural discernment as opposed to extra-scriptural discernment, meaning personal revelation. I don't know what to expect, but it seems that you're making a claim that you've had personal revelation with regards to specific scripture that is pertinent to the united states being judged and if that's the case I'd like to see what scripture to which you refer. I apologize if I'm errant in my interpretation of your previous statements in that regard.

Steve

Steve, I appreciate your patience and I am working to understand. I truly want to be able to cut to the chase and help you understand what I am seeing in the scriptures that leads me to believe the things I have said about the United States. The problem is that it isn't as simple as looking at a few scriptures and pointing out the way it is laid out. Much of what I learned in the first few years of study was like basic math. I read, understood and followed scripture. As the time passed the math became more and more advanced based upon the initial functions that I learned. The complexity in understanding increases as well. And when I begin to try to explain this I fear that I will come off as being condescending when that is in no way what I am desiring as we are to condescend to men of low estate and not be condescending.

I have no real confidence that anything will be sufficient based upon the interactions that I have had with you on related threads. Much of my understanding of 'what' the United Sates is and how it came to be aids in my understanding of how God will judge her. But when speaking about human government in another thread you disagreed with that which I saw. If you don't agree with me about how God raises up and governs nations in our present age, then you will never see the coming judgment in the scriptures. Everything revolves around the church and Israel including human government. According to scripture God founded the nations and set their boundaries according to his own will.

It is my sincere desire that you and everyone else that I talk to come to understand how all of this that is happening all around us is contained within the scriptures as it pertains to Gods people. One of the Devils greatest accomplishments is getting Gods people to reject knowledge. It is by this method that he can then destroy them.

Gary

Act 17:26 And hath made of one blood all nations of men for to dwell on all the face of the earth, and hath determined the times before appointed, and the bounds of their habitation;

Act 17:27 That they should seek the Lord, if haply they might feel after him, and find him, though he be not far from every one of us:

Act 17:28 For in him we live, and move, and have our being; as certain also of your own poets have said, For we are also his offspring.

I'm assuming you're using these verses for your assumption. I don't necessarily disagree with your statement in general, however, blessings aren't promised to any given nation in this scripture and even if we do take this to still be valid and occurring then obviously all nations have different roles which cannot be discerned using scripture, which is my point. The main point of contention we have here is that I don't believe that the united states can be scripturally proven to have been set up by God with any special dispensation or blessing in and of itself. I've never said that it wasn't and if you read the post you referred to in the other thread closely enough you'd seen that personally I think that there is a good chance that it was. However, that's another topic for another day and is all conjecture as I cannot see a way to specifically prove it with the scripture that we have, which is why I asked you for them in the first place.

Steve.

[oldzimm]

Forgive me, I didn't read all the post, but I felt that I must say something.

War is something you just don't jump into for a reaction to an action, you better make sure that all the facts are on the table.

War is pure hell, you have to be in a war to truly understand the hell war really is. (been there, done it and I do have a T-shirt of it)

I'm not saying we should or shouldn't go to war, but if we do...............(one of my pet peeves).............. don't send our brave men and women somewhere with one arm tied behind their back. Let our Armed Forces go in, kick butt and get out of there.

[other one]

Forgive me, I didn't read all the post, but I felt that I must say something.

War is something you just don't jump into for a reaction to an action, you better make sure that all the facts are on the table.

War is pure hell, you have to be in a war to truly understand the hell war really is. (been there, done it and I do have a T-shirt of it)

I'm not saying we should or shouldn't go to war, but if we do...............(one of my pet peeves).............. don't send our brave men and women somewhere with one arm tied behind their back. Let our Armed Forces go in, kick butt and get out of there.

The only way you can win a culture war as this is, is to exterminate one side or the other either by death, or conversion.

that makes what we face something very difficult to deal with. I don't think the American people have the stomach for the extermination by death of Islam..... I know I don't. I don't think we can just send them all to hell at the end of a gun and be what Jesus taught us to be.

BTW in case you don't know or have forgotten, we in the USA have been at war with islam since the days of Thomas Jefferson. We've kicked their butts on more than one occasion, but they keep breeding..... and true islam will sit back for multi generations to regain their strength to fight you.....

[Bold Believer]

Forgive me, I didn't read all the post, but I felt that I must say something.

War is something you just don't jump into for a reaction to an action, you better make sure that all the facts are on the table.

War is pure hell, you have to be in a war to truly understand the hell war really is. (been there, done it and I do have a T-shirt of it)

I'm not saying we should or shouldn't go to war, but if we do...............(one of my pet peeves).............. don't send our brave men and women somewhere with one arm tied behind their back. Let our Armed Forces go in, kick butt and get out of there.

Amen Zimm.

HOWEVER...anyone with a TV, radio or a handy newspaper can see what pacifying this lot can do. Just before WW2, British Prime Minister Neville Chamberlain appeased HItler and the Nazis. Had he put his foot down and said no to the invasion of Czechoslovakia, the war would have started early, but I believe it might also have ended early. The Nazis were not as militarily powerful at the time of their advance into Czechoslovakia as they became later, and they could have been stopped or stalled. But no. Chamberlain wanted 'peace in our time' and instead we got 6 years (counting from 1939) of bloody war. IF we continue to appease these Islamo-fascists, we will wind up with war. We need to take them out ASAP. Showing strength will send them home. On their own power, or in body bags...their choice.