Reign of the Beast -genuinely Global or just the Mid-East?

[rjp34652]

I've been thinking about this for some time. Will this directly affect everyone alive or just indirectly?

Not being allowed to buy and sell unless you have the mark, how can this apllied to every single nation and every single person on Earth? Will there be pockets of resistance or pockets of self-sustenance?

I'll give you an example of what I mean:

World War 2 was called World War 2 because it affected the entire World and was a war that spanned the globe. Not every nation was involved however, in fact most were not, but every nation was affected by it in some way or another, either at the time or shortly afterwards. Some nations were hardly affected at all, but nevertheless were acutely aware of what was going on.

Will the reign of the anti-christ be the same? I mean, if it literally does involve submission on the part of every single person on the planet, then who will be there to resist this submission and tell others to resist too? There has to be a resistance movement or free areas that try to fight back.

If the entire World is under submission then how can there be a Mystery Babylon? How can sailors watch her burn from afar (Rev 18:17) and mourn for her? Would the beast allow these sailors to be freely sailing in ships?

Many good questions. One good answer.

The nation of Israel is the focus of all Biblical prophecy.

Events in the middle east have a ripple effect that spreads throughout the world, but the center of it all is Israel. Americans tend to think the universe, the Bible and God all orbit the United States, but nothing makes any sense if that attitude is adopted. Until the 19th century it was generally accepted that Israel was the center of all prophecy. Then heresy blossomed and all traditional interpretations were up for grabs. Everything changed - from Darwin to Darby and from Freud to the Federal Reserve Banking act.

Today nothing remains from the old world and the traditional interpretation of scripture. Today we are 'enlightened' and we've used our light to bring the world to edge of the abyss of total destruction. Satan is worshipped in our cities and schools and God is dissed everywhere. The King of Israel is coming back to assume His rightful throne IN ISRAEL.

Inspect the other prophetic issues in this light and things will strangely come into focus.

but that's just me, hollering from the choir loft...

Edited April 16, 2013 by rjp34652

[back2thebible]

I've been thinking about this for some time. Will this directly affect everyone alive or just indirectly?

Not being allowed to buy and sell unless you have the mark, how can this apllied to every single nation and every single person on Earth? Will there be pockets of resistance or pockets of self-sustenance?

I'll give you an example of what I mean:

World War 2 was called World War 2 because it affected the entire World and was a war that spanned the globe. Not every nation was involved however, in fact most were not, but every nation was affected by it in some way or another, either at the time or shortly afterwards. Some nations were hardly affected at all, but nevertheless were acutely aware of what was going on.

Will the reign of the anti-christ be the same? I mean, if it literally does involve submission on the part of every single person on the planet, then who will be there to resist this submission and tell others to resist too? There has to be a resistance movement or free areas that try to fight back.

If the entire World is under submission then how can there be a Mystery Babylon? How can sailors watch her burn from afar (Rev 18:17) and mourn for her? Would the beast allow these sailors to be freely sailing in ships?

Many good questions. One good answer.

The nation of Israel is the focus of all Biblical prophecy.

Events in the middle east have a ripple effect that spreads throughout the world, but the center of it all is Israel. Americans tend to think the universe, the Bible and God all orbit the United States, but nothing makes any sense if that attitude is adopted. Until the 19th century it was generally accepted that Israel was the center of all prophecy. Then heresy blossomed and all traditional interpretations were up for grabs. Everything changed - from Darwin to Darby and from Freud to the Federal Reserve Banking act.

Today nothing remains from the old world and the traditional interpretation of scripture. Today we are 'enlightened' and we've used our light to bring the world to edge of the abyss of total destruction. Satan is worshipped in our cities and schools and God is dissed everywhere. The King of Israel is coming back to assume His rightful throne IN ISRAEL.

Inspect the other prophetic issues in this light and things will strangely come into focus.

but that's just me, hollering from the choir loft...

Important note is America is not mentioned in the last days scenario..........and its pretty evident why

[Steve_S]

BB who is Apolyon in Revelation?

WW the whole earth is to be divided up in 10 regions not just the EU as some suggest because the Antichrist will rule the whole world. This was done by the Club of Rome.

1. NAFTA (America, Canada and Mexico) 2. The E.U. – countries of the European Union, Western Europe as a whole 3. Japan 4. Australia, New Zealand, South Africa 5. Eastern Europe, Pakistan, Afghanistan, Russia and the former countries of the Soviet Union 6. Central and South America, Cuba and Caribbean Islands 7. The Middle East and North Africa 8. The rest of Africa, except South Africa 9. South and Southeast Asia, including India 10. China (Mongolia is now included with China) The islands of the seas, for the most part, fit in with the closest regio

Apollyon is the angel of the bottomless pit. His name means 'destroyer'. He is said to be 'over' the locusts. Since I understand the locusts to be Roman soldiers, I believe Apollyon to be a spirit being leading them to destroy. That is the reason they were there: to destroy, so it makes sense that Apollyon/Abaddon would be their spiritual leader.

The reason that I asked this question is not because I needed an answer. You don't have to understand eschatology to be saved. Alll you need is to be a devoted Christian. However, some people benefit from prophecy, it helps them to keep a perspective on things. Signs of the end times can prepare us all for the worst. If God doesn't want to us speculate or look for answers then we might as well all take our Bibles and tear out the pages of Revelation and throw them away.

I know that people have their different opinions but I'm looking for holes in arguments, not to mock, but to find the answers myself. I have flexible opinions on the matter, so I have no pride in being right or wrong. Salvation is more important than anything. I'd rather be stubbornly steadfast in a belief for twenty years then have it changed at the last minutre, than stick with it if its wrong!

However, the Global or not-Global thing I think is very important. It could mean the difference between us all looking out for one thing but not for another.

Forgetting the 'Nero' bit for the time-being (was he, wasn't he? I'll get my head round that later) I'm still intrigued by this eikoumenething. I've learnt a new word today thanks to Bold Believer.

Does Eikomune still mean the World as known at the time, or does its area expand with knowledge? If so, then Eikomune today would also include North America and so on.... in fact everywhere on the planet.

Can we truly see a Global influence of colossal proportions, or should we be focussing on Israel, the Middle East and possibly Europe?

Again, this question is not life or death, but I think that it's an important one to consider. I welcome more opinions.

The idea of the known world (eikoumene) in our time will necessarily be different because we know more of the nations in our world. There are of course, still parts of the world we know little of. To a first century believer, (and that's whom Revelation was written to primarily) the known world was ruled by Rome.

Daniel IS the best place to start. Daniel 9:22-30 has been called by some teachers the very key to understanding the rest of eschatology.

Trying to make fulfilled prophecies fit into timeframes for which they were never intended muddies the waters. That's why there are so many different understandings. Historical understanding is extremely important. Scripture and history go hand in hand. God is the God of history, and His Word and history agree. That's why I can say with confidence that Nero IS 666.

Patriot, Nero is NOT 'the antichrist'. He was the 666 of Revelation 13 however.

The known world was not ruled by rome in the first century, a bit of it was. First century believers, especially in greece, would've certainly known of the parts of europe rome hadn't been able to conquer. Germany, for instance, obliterated an entire roman column, 3 legions, that were under varus when Augustus was emperor and Rome never went back. The parthian empire had soundly defeated rome in battles, as well, and it was on the mideast's doorstep and would've been well known throughout Israel, greece, rome, etc., on top of scythia, dacia. I mean, there was a lot of "known world" that rome had attempted to defeat and hadn't been able to, specifically with regards to germania and parthia. The parthians effectively ended the first triumvirate by killing crassus in a meeting for terms after the romans had lost a battle. They held the standards for decades until augustus retrieved them through diplomacy.

[Littlelambseativy]

Danielzk - Jesus never told Peter that he, Peter, was the rock upon which Jesus would build His church - Jesus told Peter that He, Jesus , was the Rock upon which He, Jesus, would build His church. Peter died, he was human Christ lives and the church is built upon Jesus the Rock - of all ages.

Apollyon is another name for Satan just as Devil is and Lucifer was his name as a cherub.

[rjp34652]

*** edited out the insult ***Look...the Beast (nation) was Rome. It was Daniel's Fourth Beast. It ruled the entire KNOWN world.

There IS no 'antichrist'. Nero (a Roman emperor, the 6th) was 666. His name adds up to 666 in the alpha numerical system of his time. He died of a head wound, self inflicted. His secretary finished him off. The Roman Empire nearly collapsed because it plunged into civil war over the vacant emperorship. After the death of Nero came what is referred to historically as the year of four emperors. One emerged (Gaius) but was quickly murdered and Vespasian took his place. Vespasian was the father of Titus, the Roman General who took Jerusalem. Much of Revelation refers to these events, and how God delivered the Church. The final chapters (20 & 21) are for US. The last Christians. John tells us that Satan is released after having been bound, and he (Satan) gathers up an army and commences to attack Believers, the Church and all they stand for. Then Christ comes, burning the earth up and destroying the wicked.

The word Antichrist is never used in Revelation anywhere. The facts of the matter is that the word is only by John (the writer of Revelation, incidentally) in his letters (1, 2, John) and only 5 times. Antichrists (yes, plural) are defined by John so that there is no question as to what they are. Furthermore, antichrists came out of the Church, they were heretics called Gnostics.

Don't be fooled by modern teachings that have no basis in Scripture.

There are more than 80 references to the antiChrist in the old and new testaments - beginning in the book of Genesis. You are correct in stating that except for the writings of John the actual word isn't used. However, neither is the name of Jesus or the Christ mentioned in prophecy either. Indirect references and phrases with contextual meanings are the most common usage as in 'son of David' meaning Christ.

With regard to the antiChrist and of greater consideration than the use of a single word are predictions associated with the antiChrist. Events, circumstances, national alliances, actions and policies of these groups are described quite liberally throughout holy text.

Historical figures such as emperor Nero, Napoleon and Hitler have displayed qualities similar to Biblical and traditional expectations of antiChrist. None have assumed all the aspects of what is to be expected.

until today.....

Mohammad al-Mahdi, the twelfth imam of shia Islam, the prophesied redeemer of Islam will rule for 7 years before the Day of Judgment. Or so we are led to believe by saracen scholars. The strange agreement/parallel of 7 years time between Islamic and Christian prophecies is not the only one either.

Isa(1) will return to aid al-Mahdi against the false messiah Masih ad-Dajjal (2) and his followers, the people of the book (3).

Jesus said, "the day will come when men will kill you believing they are doing God a service".

Sharia law will require punishment for refusal to accept al-Mahdi and Islam in the form of dhimmitude(4) and/or beheading(5). This particular punishment is also mentioned in Biblical scripture as being identified with antiChrist justice.

The parallels between Biblical descriptions and prophecies of the antiChrist and al-Mahdi AS WELL AS those of the Qur'an and Hadith literature are absolutely chilling.

For a scholarly review I recommend the following;

THE ISLAMIC ANTICHRIST

by Joel Richardson

It is wise to do one's homework. An educated mind is the best defense against heresy.

and that's just me, hollering from the choir loft....

(1) Isa - from the Qur'an, a reference to a muslim Jesus the son of Mariam.

(2) Masih ad-Dajjal - Jesus the Son of God .

(3) people of the book - from the Qur'an, a reference to Jews and Christians

(4) dhimmitude - second class living conditions of a non-Muslim in an Islamic state under Sharia law. Includes the payment of a head tax.

(5) beheading - non-payment of the head tax or simply the penalty of persecution of Muslims (anything opposing Islam is considered persecution).

Edited May 2, 2013 by rjp34652

[Littlelambseativy]

One - Jesus did say that there would be many anti-christs.

True - the gentile church is now being concentrated on by the Father ONLY to make Israel jealous. We are now the main concern of Jesus but it has and always will be ISRAEL.

Amazing to watch how God is sidelining the "New World" especially the US though the antichrist will still demand his "piece of flesh" from it and God will permit it because it abandoned Him. Sad when the land which sent missionaries is now the heathen land needing them.

[TheresaJ]

I've been thinking about this for some time. Will this directly affect everyone alive or just indirectly?

Not being allowed to buy and sell unless you have the mark, how can this apllied to every single nation and every single person on Earth? Will there be pockets of resistance or pockets of self-sustenance?

I'll give you an example of what I mean:

World War 2 was called World War 2 because it affected the entire World and was a war that spanned the globe. Not every nation was involved however, in fact most were not, but every nation was affected by it in some way or another, either at the time or shortly afterwards. Some nations were hardly affected at all, but nevertheless were acutely aware of what was going on.

Will the reign of the anti-christ be the same? I mean, if it literally does involve submission on the part of every single person on the planet, then who will be there to resist this submission and tell others to resist too? There has to be a resistance movement or free areas that try to fight back.

If the entire World is under submission then how can there be a Mystery Babylon? How can sailors watch her burn from afar (Rev 18:17) and mourn for her? Would the beast allow these sailors to be freely sailing in ships?

If you really care to know then see this

*** embedded link removed. videos are to be in the video forums only ***

Edited May 12, 2013 by OneLight

[guysmith]

I've been thinking about this for some time. Will this directly affect everyone alive or just indirectly?

Not being allowed to buy and sell unless you have the mark, how can this apllied to every single nation and every single person on Earth? Will there be pockets of resistance or pockets of self-sustenance?

I'll give you an example of what I mean:

World War 2 was called World War 2 because it affected the entire World and was a war that spanned the globe. Not every nation was involved however, in fact most were not, but every nation was affected by it in some way or another, either at the time or shortly afterwards. Some nations were hardly affected at all, but nevertheless were acutely aware of what was going on.

Will the reign of the anti-christ be the same? I mean, if it literally does involve submission on the part of every single person on the planet, then who will be there to resist this submission and tell others to resist too? There has to be a resistance movement or free areas that try to fight back.

If the entire World is under submission then how can there be a Mystery Babylon? How can sailors watch her burn from afar (Rev 18:17) and mourn for her? Would the beast allow these sailors to be freely sailing in ships?

Hello WillowWood,

IMHO, it is worldwide.

For example, all nations will be gathered to fight against Jerusalem.

Zechariah 14

14 A day of the Lord is coming, Jerusalem, when your possessions will be plundered and divided up within your very walls.

² I will gather all the nations to Jerusalem to fight against it;

And......

Matthew 24:²² “If those days had not been cut short, no one would survive, but for the sake of the elect those days will be shortened.

.....hints at a worldwide Extinction Level Event.

In Yehoshua,

Guy Smith

[rjp34652]

 

The beginning of most eschatological mis-understanding and mis-interpretation begin with forgetting that prophecy always focuses on Jesus and Israel. Even well-meaning people who love the Jews and Israel run amok when they place too much focus on The Church and it's role in God's plan. It is just a parenthesis, nothing more. That is why you have people insisting that the Church has to go through the Tribulation and help Israel along spreading the gospel, because they don't understand what the Church's role is. The Church has no place in that Age, not so Church believers get an easy out, (they haven't, even since the very beginning), or because they get some kind of escape card. The Church isn't there because it does not belong there. The Church is no different than Mosaic Israel was. Special, unique, and for a limited time only. Loved, and rewarded when it obeys God, but also for a limited time period none-the-less.

 

 

I enjoyed your post, especially the parts about the heretical get-out-of-jail-free card that so many protestant churches accept as gospel - except it isn't.  

 

Another topic not addressed clearly in eschatological discussions is the current apostate church.   A great falling away was predicted just before the final events of human history are about to unfold.  Europe, the bulwark of Christendom for all of Christian history except for the past few decades, is now a secular wasteland.  Currently being invaded by Muslim influences and peoples, it will not stand much longer in its atheistic philosophy.   Some believe Britain will be an Islamic state before the end of the decade.  Islam is the future.

 

Organizations eager to fill their coffers with donations claim falsely that the gospel is spreading.   It isn't.  

 

In China it's claimed the church is experiencing phenomonal growth, but no one questions how statistics are gathered and published in a secret underground church.  Truly no one knows what's going on in the Chinese church except the Holy Spirit.  The same is true in C.A & S.A.  I've personally visited the continent and talked to missionaries from remote locations and can attest that the population there is rapidly returning to its pagan gods.   The Inca and Amazonia descendents are worshipping the old religion once again.   In C.A., especially Honduras, Guatemala, etc. I've talked to people that have spent extended time there (including my son) who tell the same tale.   India is experiencing a resurgence of its old Hindu pantheism and Africa is still torn from the Indian Ocean coast to the Atlantic with corruption, war and famine.   Christianity struggles to keep its head above water there.

 

On the other hand, Islam is experiencing a world wide boom time.  Not since the heady days of Moorish expansionism in the first millennium has there been such a  rush of theological and political growth.

 

In the church, God is clearing out the dead wood.

 

Only a clear understanding of Biblically based eschatological teaching can provide a firm anchor to those who are called by the Master's name.  In the midst of an unsettled political climate one thing remains steady as a rock; the Bible.   If the Christian now wishes to understand why the church is in decline and why global events are hurtling toward some seemingly terrible future, he only has to read the last chapter to know who the ultimate winners will be.

 

I'm serious about this.   Everything seems to be coming apart at the seams.  Whether we agree totally with one another on the interpretation of every line or not is irrelevant.  

 

God has provided these predictions of the future for a reason.

 

It is my firm belief that we should hang onto them as never before.  The Bible promises hope.  We need to grab on and hold tight.

 

and that's just me, hollering from the choir loft...

Edited June 2, 2013 by rjp34652

[silviawang]

maybe china,the nation worship dragon,idols,gods,and deny GOD,reject JESUS generation after generation