A Long Hair, Tattoo Pastor

[Openly Curious]

 

 

I did not mean to put anyone to shame. I thought it would make an interesting topic for an intelligent conversation. I simply like to see how other people think about things and why? But if you think I am causing judgment upon people then maybe I should stop posting all together. Since that has never been my intent.

 

No, LadyKay, you should NOT stop posting.  Good grief, some people are going to get all sideways and take offense if you post about roasting marshmallows so why let others intimidate you?  Because that's what's going on here and it's a shame.  I think it's an interesting topic and, if the (sniff) holier than thou crowd can take a breath, maybe we can continue the discussion. 

Heck I've been waiting on the discussion to go some where not for anyone to stop posting. What brand of marshmellows do you use I might not like that brand but I will give em a try just in case there is a chance I might like em. I'm use to labels before a person even knows where I'm coming from nothing new there.But I think we'll all liv

 

 

i haven't seen any label attached to you here.  You berated LadyKay unfairly and I pointed that out.  It's what we do here; we have differences of opinions but try to respect the views, and feelings, of others.  

 

 

I explained myself but I see it didn't mean much in your opinion and view. Got anything to add to the thread.  Perhaps your true feelings and opinion toward the man mentioned in the OP.

[missmuffet]

These threads of reflecting on self do not go well on Worthy.People get defensive and think you are judging them.I will stay away from posting those kinds of subjects again.

[LadyKay]

These threads of reflecting on self do not go well on Worthy.People get defensive and think you are judging them.I will stay away from posting those kinds of subjects again.

 

 

 

(sigh)

[His_disciple3]

then I guess Samson was a sinner however by one of his sins of having long hair, he was blessed by God for that sin, I think maybe Christians should quit casting stones at others, or quit pointing out the splinters in others eye and worry about our self a little more! I think locks would Flop wouldn't they? Openly Curious . but then again I never knew God to bless a sin?

Judg 16:17-19
17 That he told her all his heart, and said unto her. There hath not come a razor upon mine head; for I have been a Nazarite unto God from my mother's womb: if I be shaven, then my strength will go from me, and I shall become weak, and be like any other man.
18 And when Delilah saw that he had told her all his heart, she sent and called for the lords of the Philistines, saying, Come up this once, for he hath shewed me all his heart. Then the lords of the Philistines came up unto her, and brought money in their hand.
19 And she made him sleep upon her knees; and she called for a man, and she caused him to shave off the seven locks of his head; and she began to afflict him, and his strength went from him.
KJV

[Openly Curious]

then I guess Samson was a sinner however by one of his sins of having long hair, he was blessed by God for that sin, I think maybe Christians should quit casting stones at others, or quit pointing out the splinters in others eye and worry about our self a little more! I think locks would Flop wouldn't they? Openly Curious . but then again I never knew God to bless a sin?

Well I would think if you think that Samson was a sinner then you DO NOT know your bible at all. I want to let you know right now that I don't think haveing long hair is a sin and have even stated so. I guess you just didn't like the fact that you do have a measuring stick now and are without excuse in knowing how to tell long from short.

Who said Samson was a sinner Samson I never did he was a righteous judge in whom God used greatly against the Philistines who were enemies of God's people Israel. It is you who speaks in ignorance about Samson concerning his hair. If you want to go into a further discussion on Samson I would be abiliged to discuss it with you to see what kind of person he was in the eyes of the Lord and in relation to the Nazerite vow he took before the Lord concerning his hair. Which you have attributing it to sin that God blesses and not me. I am not ignorant on the matter of Samson.

You seem bent on telling me how you feel on the matter I hope you can take my feelings and thoughts and beliefs as well. But I don't take kindly to you saying things that I have never ever said. You can not show or back up your claims you've made towards me or my belief. I can't help but to wonder just how many stones you have tucked away in your little bag. I know about how to use a shield thankfully.

If you don't like it because you got a difinition of the word "long" in scripture in which you asked for and now can tell if something is long because it flops or not then that's your problem locks and all. Not one single time have I passed any kind of judgment or condemnation on those who have long or short hair as you have stated that I have done. But you have a measuring stick but you don't have to acknowledge it if you do not want to use it. But you know if your grass is long or short and needs to be cut or maybe you don't know the difference.

I never knew God to bless a sin either where did I ever say that God did bless sin. Talk about a stretch. Again I never once said having short or long hair was a sin nor have I judge anyone in hair length as being in sin. So go ahead and rant but I hope you don't mind if I do the same defend my postition against your accusation and misrepresentation of what I have said.

 

Judg 16:17-19

17 That he told her all his heart, and said unto her. There hath not come a razor upon mine head; for I have been a Nazarite unto God from my mother's womb: if I be shaven, then my strength will go from me, and I shall become weak, and be like any other man.

18 And when Delilah saw that he had told her all his heart, she sent and called for the lords of the Philistines, saying, Come up this once, for he hath shewed me all his heart. Then the lords of the Philistines came up unto her, and brought money in their hand.

19 And she made him sleep upon her knees; and she called for a man, and she caused him to shave off the seven locks of his head; and she began to afflict him, and his strength went from him.

KJV

What does Delilah's deception working on behalf of the Philistine's behalf have to do with hair length being a sin. Samson took a Nazerite vow as a seperation unto God and him being tricked out of breaking that vow by the enemies of God finding out his secret of seperation and devotion to God in keeping the vow caused no sin to be committed within Samson life. How foolish and ignorant to think such a thing. The enemy gained the upper hand over God's chosen vessel and they shaved his head which broke the vow of seperation between God and Samson.

But be it known that while ole Samson was down at that old mill house grinding totally humiliated by the enemy as they had plucked out Samsom's eyes. Which is one of the first things the devil will take from you when you fall into deception and that is your spiritual sight. But the enemy didn't recognize that while they had Samson in such a defeated place that his hair began to grow back down in that mill grinding and blinded didn't it. His hair locks and all began to grow again and the vow was still being honored between God and Samson. Record and testimony of Samson in the bible is that he killed more Philistines in his death than he did he did in his entire lifetime.

It is you who is saying that hair length is a sin and that you never seen a sin that God blesses.

[Guest Butero]

I have 3 people I need to address on this topic because of things they wrote while I was away.

 

@ Fresno Joe.  If you really believe that we are not to judge another man's servant, even by scripture, how come you judged men who had more than one wife, when there is nothing in the Old or New Testament that says polygamy is a sin?  In reality, you can't judge anyone for anything they do, because whether they be adulterers, homosexuals, thieves, anything, if they call themselves a Christian, who are you to judge another man's servant?

 

@ His Disciple.  If you have no beard, there is nothing to round.  That is common sense.  Being clean shaven is not rounding the corners of your beard, however, if you feel it is, then you should start warning men to stop shaving.  Most of us would be ok with it, as it is a hassle and most of us do it for the benefit of others.  As to the question of what is long and what is short, how about we leave that up to the individual to decide?  If a man honestly thinks his hair is short, so be it.  If a woman honestly thinks her hair is long, so be it.  All I know is when I give a description of someone, I have no problem saying if they have long or short hair.  Once again, this is common sense.

 

@ 1 To 3:  You do realize that the teaching on hair length is 100 percent New Testament don't you, and so it has zero to do with the old law?  Hair length is a sign of being in submission to authority.  I disagree 100 percent with Shiloh's take on why hair length was an issue to Paul.  Even women who wear head coverings understand the meaning it conveys.  If you believe it is wrong to murder, steal, commit adultery, curse your Father and Mother, etc., you do follow things from the Old Testament law, whether you know it or not.  Now, picking and choosing and why we do that is an interesting topic I am more than equipped to discuss.  Nearly every person that goes around calling people legalists and rejecting the law will at times say we must keep part of the law.  They pick and choose all the time, and don't see their hypocrisy when they do it.  If you have a problem with homosexuals, you have that problem based on the law, unless it is just pure bias because you don't like it.  If you think killing is wrong, you are doing so based on the law.  Jesus himself said he didn't come to do away with the law, but to fulfill it. 

 

There are 3 types of laws in the Old Testament.  There are laws that dealt with the office of the Levitical Priesthood, and we don't keep them today because they were only to continue till the cross.  There are laws dealing with Israel being a separate people from the gentile nations, and we never were required to keep them because we are all one body of believers, made up of Jew and gentile, so the symbolism has changed.  That is what the vision Peter had dealt with.  The only laws we need concern ourselves with today are moral laws, and Paul was so strong about them, he warned that those who don't keep them will not inherit the kingdom of heaven.  Jesus never once broke the law of Moses.  Had he done so, he would have defiled himself and not been able to be a sacrifice for our sins, as he would have been a sinner.  Sin according to 1 John is the transgression of the law.  At the time when Jesus was doing his ministry, it was before the cross, meaning everyone was under the entire law, so there is no way he would have broken the law and encouraged others to follow his lead.  If you would like to, I would be more than happy to take you on in dealing with this topic in a Soap Box debate.  I have studied this topic for years.  I know all of the arguments on your side, and I know how to defeat them.  If you wish to do that, let me know.   

[FresnoJoe]

@ Fresno Joe.  If you really believe that we are not to judge another man's servant, even by scripture,

 

 

Even

 

Neither pray I for these alone, but for them also which shall believe on me through their word; That they all may be one; as thou, Father, art in me, and I in thee, that they also may be one in us: that the world may believe that thou hast sent me.

 

And the glory which thou gavest me I have given them; that they may be one, even as we are one:  I in them, and thou in me, that they may be made perfect in one; and that the world may know that thou hast sent me, and hast loved them, as thou hast loved me.

 

Father, I will that they also, whom thou hast given me, be with me where I am; that they may behold my glory, which thou hast given me: for thou lovedst me before the foundation of the world. John 17:20-24

 

By Scripture

 

Let no corrupt communication proceed out of your mouth, but that which is good to the use of edifying, that it may minister grace unto the hearers.

 

And grieve not the holy Spirit of God, whereby ye are sealed unto the day of redemption.

 

Let all bitterness, and wrath, and anger, and clamour, and evil speaking, be put away from you, with all malice:

 

And be ye kind one to another, tenderhearted, forgiving one another, even as God for Christ's sake hath forgiven you. Ephesians 4:29-32

 

~

 

Set a watch, O LORD, before my mouth; keep the door of my lips. Psalms 141:3

 

Love, Your Brother Joe

[Guest Butero]

If that is true Fresno Joe, why did you have a problem when I said in another thread that if a Christian man with 4 wives came to my church, I would accept him as a brother in the Lord because there is no scripture that forbids polygamy?  Wasn't that judging another man's servant?  There isn't a single Old or New Testament scripture that forbids polygamy, so you used a scripture pertaining to Kings multiplying wives to themselves.  How far do you take this?  Do you really believe we are not to judge any professing Christian ever?  The Bible does forbid homosexual relations.  Would you accept a man and his partner if they said they were Christians, even though they were in fornication and sodomy?  The Bible does forbid a brother from marrying his sister in the Old Testament.  If a brother is married to his sister, would you welcome the family into your church with open arms and fully accept what they are doing because they are professing Christians?  Or does this only apply in areas you pick and choose?  I have a lot of people accuse me of picking and choosing where to apply scripture.  Do you do this across the board, or are their limits, and what determines the limits if they do exist? 

[MorningGlory]

 

 

 

I explained myself but I see it didn't mean much in your opinion and view. Got anything to add to the thread.  Perhaps your true feelings and opinion toward the man mentioned in the OP.

 

 

Sure. I don't think long hair and tattoos are appropriate on ANY man but I don't believe they're sinful.  Would I want my pastor to look that way?  No.  But having those attributes would not make him any less Godly.  Just unfashionable and tacky.  There's a difference between judgment and opinion.  And I believe OPINIONS are what the OP was asking for.

[missmuffet]

 

 

 

 

I explained myself but I see it didn't mean much in your opinion and view. Got anything to add to the thread.  Perhaps your true feelings and opinion toward the man mentioned in the OP.

 

 

Sure. I don't think long hair and tattoos are appropriate on ANY man but I don't believe they're sinful.  Would I want my pastor to look that way?  No.  But having those attributes would not make him any less Godly.  Just unfashionable and tacky.  There's a difference between judgment and opinion.  And I believe OPINIONS are what the OP was asking for.

 

I don't think this would turn me off just from the outward appearance.It would all depend on what he says about the Bible and God.He could have a wonderful heart and be the best sermon I have ever heard.I tend to observe people.Get a feel of their true Character,integrity,morals and values by what they say and do and where their heart really is.Sometimes this does not take very long.