The Battle of Gog and Magog

[Marilyn C]

39 minutes ago, Spock said:

Don't leave me hanging Marilyn. Who?

By the way, many experts include Turkey in Ezekiel 38/39. Togomarah being one reference. 

 

Hi Spock,

I believe & was taught that although the Great soviet Union appears to have broken up it is still a large confederacy - (Ez. 38)

* Russia,

* former Republics of the USSR (a great company. v.4)

* Iran (Persia), Libya, & Ethiopia. (v. 5)

* Slavic Nations. (many people.... v. 6)

Thus when God puts hooks in the great bear`s jaws, when God is ready, not Putin, etc then they will all come down to the mountains of Israel, for spoil, & there we know God will deal with them - annihilating 5/6ths of the great army.

So who then is left in the Middle East? It is the old Assyrian area (Iraq, Syria & Jordan) Saudia Arabia, Kuwait, Bahrain, Qatar, UAE, Oman & Yeman. (10 nations) mostly all Sunni. The Islamic Confederacy. But obviously it cannot rise to great power till the Russian Confederacy is done away with.

We wont have long to wait. Marilyn.

[Spock]

21 hours ago, Marilyn C said:

Hi Spock,

I believe & was taught that although the Great soviet Union appears to have broken up it is still a large confederacy - (Ez. 38)

* Russia,

* former Republics of the USSR (a great company. v.4)

* Iran (Persia), Libya, & Ethiopia. (v. 5)

* Slavic Nations. (many people.... v. 6)

Thus when God puts hooks in the great bear`s jaws, when God is ready, not Putin, etc then they will all come down to the mountains of Israel, for spoil, & there we know God will deal with them - annihilating 5/6ths of the great army.

So who then is left in the Middle East? It is the old Assyrian area (Iraq, Syria & Jordan) Saudia Arabia, Kuwait, Bahrain, Qatar, UAE, Oman & Yeman. (10 nations) mostly all Sunni. The Islamic Confederacy. But obviously it cannot rise to great power till the Russian Confederacy is done away with.

We wont have long to wait. Marilyn.

Wow!  Awesome Marilyn.  Many experts have those nations gone in a Psalm 83 war, but you don't.  Cool!  

I don't know what to make of psalm 83.  Any thoughts would be appreciated.  

By the way, what you wrote makes sense to me (not saying I fully agree, but it makes sense). Thanks. You rock! 

Spock

[Marilyn C]

5 hours ago, Spock said:

Wow!  Awesome Marilyn.  Many experts have those nations gone in a Psalm 83 war, but you don't.  Cool!  

I don't know what to make of psalm 83.  Any thoughts would be appreciated.  

By the way, what you wrote makes sense to me (not saying I fully agree, but it makes sense). Thanks. You rock! 

Spock

 

Hi Spock,

That`s a good idea, to follow every lead, like a detective. So here`s some very interesting facts concerning the 6-day war which I believe (& was taught) is the part fulfilment of Ps. 83.

 

Speaking three weeks after the war ended, as he accepted an honorary degree from Hebrew University, Yitzhak Rabin gave his reasoning behind the success of Israel:

Our airmen, who struck the enemies' planes so accurately that no one in the world understands how it was done and people seek technological explanations or secret weapons; our armored troops who beat the enemy even when their equipment was inferior to his; our soldiers in all other branches... who overcame our enemies everywhere, despite the latter's superior numbers and fortifications-all these revealed not only coolness and courage in the battle but...an understanding that only their personal stand against the greatest dangers would achieve victory for their country and for their families, and that if victory was not theirs the alternative was annihilation.^[163]

 

Within six days, Israel had won a decisive land war. Israeli forces had taken control of the Gaza Strip and the Sinai Peninsula from Egypt, the West Bank and East Jerusalem from Jordan, and the Golan Heights from Syria.

 

 

Psalm 83.

V. 1 - 5 We see the enemies of God & Israel are conspiring together saying `Come let us wipe them out as a nation.`

In 1967 different countries around Israel took counsel together with one accord to destroy Israel from being a nation. For the first time in history these countries forgot their differences. They formed a confederacy to declare a `Jehud` - holy war to wipe the name of Israel from remembrance. These actual words were frequently broadcast over Radio Cairo & published in world newspapers. Unknowingly they were practically quoting directly from prophecy given 25 centuries ago. (Ps. 83: 4)


V. 6 - 8 Even the participants were accurately delineated - under ancient names.


ANCIENT NAME.....................MODERN NAME

Edom, Moab, Ammon................Jordan
Hagarenes, Amalek, Philistines...Egypt
Ishmaelites......................Arabia
Gebal, Tyre......................Lebanon
Assyria..........................Syria, Iraq


V. 9 - 18 And what was the outcome?

`Fill their faces with dishonour,....let them be ashamed & dismayed...let them be humiliated.....` (V. 16 & 17)

 

 

I said partial fulfillment as we can see that `the forever,` has not yet been outworked. God often writes the end even though there is a gap. (eg. Isa. 61: 2. the verse the Lord quoted, however he did not say the last part of the sentence as it would be another 2000 years before that would happen. Luke 4: 19)

 

Marilyn.  

 

 

 

[WilliamL]

14 hours ago, Spock said:

I don't know what to make of psalm 83.  Any thoughts would be appreciated.  

This is a copy of one of my posts on the topic:

Psalm 83: Israel, Muslims, and Arabs

This is a popular but misguided teaching these days. Psalm 83 speaks about an event that took place in 485 BC, when the newly-crowned Emperor Xerxes of Persia, dealing with rebellions throughout his empire at the death of Darius, allowed the enemies of the rebellious Jews to punish them for him. (He had more pressing concerns with a rebellion already occurring in his much more important province of Egypt, and a brewing rebellion in Babylon.) Nothing in this Psalm speaks of the events as taking place in the future of Asaph's days; on the contrary, they speak of events that he experienced.

Other Psalms written by Asaph make this clear. In Psalm 74, he wrote:

1  O God, why hast thou cast [us] off for ever? [why] doth thine anger smoke against the sheep of thy pasture? ... 3 Lift up thy feet unto the perpetual desolations; [even] all [that] the enemy hath done wickedly in the sanctuary. ...6 ...they break down the carved work thereof at once with axes and hammers. 7 They have cast fire into thy sanctuary, they have defiled [by casting down] the dwelling place of thy name to the ground. 8 They said in their hearts, Let us destroy them together: they have burned up all the synagogues of God in the land.

Synagogues/meeting places were an institution begun during the Babylonian captivity, and brought back with Zerubbabel's emigration.

Ps. 80:4 O LORD God of hosts, how long wilt thou be angry against the prayer of thy people? 5 Thou feedest them with the bread of tears; and givest them tears to drink in great measure. 6 Thou makest us a strife unto our neighbours: and our enemies laugh among themselves.

All of these things are things which Asaph was experiencing, not prophesying about.

The Book of Lamentations, despite its non-biblically-supported attribution to Jeremiah, was probably also written by Asaph, or at least by a contemporary. That book begins,

1:1 How doth the city sit solitary, [that was] full of people! [how] is she become as a widow! she [that was] great among the nations, [and] princess among the provinces, [how] is she become tributary! 2 ...all her friends have dealt treacherously with her, they are become her enemies. ...10 The adversary hath spread out his hand upon all her pleasant things: for she hath seen [that] the heathen entered into her sanctuary, whom thou didst command [that] they should not enter into thy congregation.

The mention of Jerusalem as being "princess among the provinces" denotes this book as being written during the era of the Persian Empire, when Judah was truly a province. During the era of the Babylonian Empire, Judah was a vassal kingdom, never a province. Those among the Jews left in Judah after Nebuchadnezzar carried off captives to Babylon--which captives included all the priests he had not killed -- had plenty of food left for them to harvest. (Jer. 40:10) In contrast,

Lam. 4:9 [They that be] slain with the sword are better than [they that be] slain with hunger: for these pine away, stricken through for [want of] the fruits of the field.

Final point of many other possible points of evidence: Lamentations 4:20 reads, "The breath of our nostrils, the anointed of the LORD, was taken in their pits, of whom we said, Under his shadow we shall live among the heathen." Now, can you see Jeremiah or anyone of his day calling Zedekiah "the breath of our nostrils"?? Hardly.

This same anointed king, which the Jews had crowned over Judah in defiance of the Persian Emperor, causing him to send his loyal allies against Judah, is also spoken of in Psalm 89, another Psalm of this era:

89:39 Thou hast made void the covenant of thy servant: thou hast profaned his crown [by casting it] to the ground. ... 51 Wherewith thine enemies have reproached, O LORD; wherewith they have reproached the footsteps of thine anointed.

But God did allow this reproach, because the Jews did not have his permission to anoint another king over his people until the coming of the Messiah of the house of David. The Jews had been presumptuous, thinking that the prophecies of Isaiah about a Messiah were to be fulfilled in their day; and God allowed their enemies to spank them.

 

See that site for more posts on the subject.

[Spock]

18 hours ago, Marilyn C said:

 

Hi Spock,

That`s a good idea, to follow every lead, like a detective. So here`s some very interesting facts concerning the 6-day war which I believe (& was taught) is the part fulfilment of Ps. 83.

 

Speaking three weeks after the war ended, as he accepted an honorary degree from Hebrew University, Yitzhak Rabin gave his reasoning behind the success of Israel:

Our airmen, who struck the enemies' planes so accurately that no one in the world understands how it was done and people seek technological explanations or secret weapons; our armored troops who beat the enemy even when their equipment was inferior to his; our soldiers in all other branches... who overcame our enemies everywhere, despite the latter's superior numbers and fortifications-all these revealed not only coolness and courage in the battle but...an understanding that only their personal stand against the greatest dangers would achieve victory for their country and for their families, and that if victory was not theirs the alternative was annihilation.^[163]

 

Within six days, Israel had won a decisive land war. Israeli forces had taken control of the Gaza Strip and the Sinai Peninsula from Egypt, the West Bank and East Jerusalem from Jordan, and the Golan Heights from Syria.

 

 

Psalm 83.

V. 1 - 5 We see the enemies of God & Israel are conspiring together saying `Come let us wipe them out as a nation.`

In 1967 different countries around Israel took counsel together with one accord to destroy Israel from being a nation. For the first time in history these countries forgot their differences. They formed a confederacy to declare a `Jehud` - holy war to wipe the name of Israel from remembrance. These actual words were frequently broadcast over Radio Cairo & published in world newspapers. Unknowingly they were practically quoting directly from prophecy given 25 centuries ago. (Ps. 83: 4)


V. 6 - 8 Even the participants were accurately delineated - under ancient names.


ANCIENT NAME.....................MODERN NAME

Edom, Moab, Ammon................Jordan
Hagarenes, Amalek, Philistines...Egypt
Ishmaelites......................Arabia
Gebal, Tyre......................Lebanon
Assyria..........................Syria, Iraq


V. 9 - 18 And what was the outcome?

`Fill their faces with dishonour,....let them be ashamed & dismayed...let them be humiliated.....` (V. 16 & 17)

 

 

I said partial fulfillment as we can see that `the forever,` has not yet been outworked. God often writes the end even though there is a gap. (eg. Isa. 61: 2. the verse the Lord quoted, however he did not say the last part of the sentence as it would be another 2000 years before that would happen. Luke 4: 19)

 

Marilyn.  

 

 

 

Thanks Marilyn,

You have stated a pretty good case for applying the  6 day war to psalm 83, at least partially.  

One question now: ezekiel 38/39 says Israel will be dwelling securely in the land before the war.  How do you see this applying?  I mean, are they dwelling securely now?  So what has to happen for this to take place?  This is one reason why I considered the possibility this battle takes place after a peace treaty. But I certainly can't be dogmatic here.

do you see another alternative to show Israel dwelling securely?  Thanks.

spock

[Spock]

William,

im not ignoring you on this thread so please don't think that. I'm sure you know I believe you are brilliant and I look up to you for wise counsel concerning scripture.  However, I'm not feeling you on this thread.  Not to say you aren't right, but I'm pursuing other leads. 

Spock

[Marilyn C]

6 hours ago, Spock said:

Thanks Marilyn,

You have stated a pretty good case for applying the  6 day war to psalm 83, at least partially.  

One question now: ezekiel 38/39 says Israel will be dwelling securely in the land before the war.  How do you see this applying?  I mean, are they dwelling securely now?  So what has to happen for this to take place?  This is one reason why I considered the possibility this battle takes place after a peace treaty. But I certainly can't be dogmatic here.

do you see another alternative to show Israel dwelling securely?  Thanks.

spock

Hi Spock,

Ah...the `dwelling securely.` Good point there bro. So here is my take on that.

I see that the coming Global Leader arises a step at a time. Thus I believe he will step into the volatile Middle East (soon) & bring a measure of peace there. This is BEFORE the 7 year peace treaty. So this is what I am looking for in the next few years.

`Through his cunning he shall cause deceit to prosper under his hand; and he shall magnify himself in his heart. He shall destroy many in their prosperity...` (Dan. 8: 25  NKJ)

`And through his policy he shall cause trickery to prosper in his hand; & mind, & in their security he will corrupt & destroy many.` (Dan. 8: 25  Amp)

Remember for this person to be recognised by the world as a peace maker with Israel (after the Russian war) then he would have had to show some measure of ability to bring peace in that region. The many warring factions there will need a `cunning` person to bring them together even for `spoil` sake.

So here`s watching how prophecy unfolds, (I believe) in our day.

Marilyn.

 

 

Edited February 26, 2016 by Marilyn C

[Spock]

4 hours ago, Marilyn C said:

Hi Spock,

Ah...the `dwelling securely.` Good point there bro. So here is my take on that.

I see that the coming Global Leader arises a step at a time. Thus I believe he will step into the volatile Middle East (soon) & bring a measure of peace there. This is BEFORE the 7 year peace treaty. So this is what I am looking for in the next few years.

`Through his cunning he shall cause deceit to prosper under his hand; and he shall magnify himself in his heart. He shall destroy many in their prosperity...` (Dan. 8: 25  NKJ)

`And through his policy he shall cause trickery to prosper in his hand; & mind, & in their security he will corrupt & destroy many.` (Dan. 8: 25  Amp)

Remember for this person to be recognised by the world as a peace maker with Israel (after the Russian war) then he would have had to show some measure of ability to bring peace in that region. The many warring factions there will need a `cunning` person to bring them together even for `spoil` sake.

So here`s watching how prophecy unfolds, (I believe) in our day.

Marilyn.

 

 

Thanks.  So you see this man of intrigue being present BEFORE the Gog massacre and then cleaning things up and help restoring sanity to the area and ultimately the war.  Obviously, some kind of peace treaty will be ushered in which will bring about temple sacrifices being reinstituted and perhaps a new temple of some sort (I know you believe the temple is already in place). I'm not as convinced on that one.

thanks again.  Well, let's watch the Gog nations form and let's watch God put his hook in them.

spock

[Watching for Jesus]

13 hours ago, Spock said:

One question now: ezekiel 38/39 says Israel will be dwelling securely in the land before the war.  How do you see this applying?  I mean, are they dwelling securely now?  So what has to happen for this to take place?  This is one reason why I considered the possibility this battle takes place after a peace treaty. But I certainly can't be dogmatic here.

do you see another alternative to show Israel dwelling securely?  Thanks.

spock

Spock

I believe Israel is dwelling safely because they have fled into the wilderness and are being protected by God at the time that Gog comes down.

Revelation 12:6 And the woman fled into the wilderness, where she hath a place prepared of God, that they should feed her there a thousand two hundred and threescore days.

Revelation 12:14 And to the woman were given two wings of a great eagle, that she might fly into the wilderness, into her place, where she is nourished for a time, and times, and half a time, from the face of the serpent.

[WilliamL]

7 hours ago, Marilyn C said:

Hi Spock,

Ah...the `dwelling securely.` Good point there bro. So here is my take on that.

I see that the coming Global Leader arises a step at a time. Thus I believe he will step into the volatile Middle East (soon) & bring a measure of peace there. This is BEFORE the 7 year peace treaty. So this is what I am looking for in the next few years.

`Through his cunning he shall cause deceit to prosper under his hand; and he shall magnify himself in his heart. He shall destroy many in their prosperity...` (Dan. 8: 25  NKJ)

`And through his policy he shall cause trickery to prosper in his hand; & mind, & in their security he will corrupt & destroy many.` (Dan. 8: 25  Amp)

Remember for this person to be recognised by the world as a peace maker with Israel (after the Russian war)...

?? If he makes peace after the Russian War, then before that war, which you say is the Ezekiel 38-39 war, whence comes the 'dwelling securely in villages without walls or bars or gates?' (38:11) Am I missing something?