666 or 616

[SavedOnebyGrace]

If you go on YouTube and look up Into the Multiverse with Josh Peck interviewing Carl Gallups, you'll get a whole new perspective on what 666 means.  I believe it's worth considering.

[dprprb]

16 hours ago, other one said:

When you get right down to it, it really doesn't matter.

If you don't worship the beast you won't get to the point of taking the mark.......  you can't be tricked into taking the mark......   so we should just make sure we are tuned into the Holy Spirit for it is He that will get us through it all

Your point is very well understood and in the past I have avoided the investigation of it for that reason but I also realize the potential for connections to other passages and greater understanding is a worthy pursuit if the OP has this purpose in mind. That's why I submitted 2 Samuel because God sends the angel of disease and begins the wholesale destruction of Israelites because King David  loses the reknown faith and courage that brought him before Goliath.  God says "Stop" (world ending parallel here) to the angel at the threshing floor.  So what other passages might illuminate not just the number but the circumstances under which it arises in Revelations?

Brakelites link continues to associate the value with "counting" in both Roman numerals and Babylonia sexagesimal

[other one]

Quote

John 10:26-29
 27 "My sheep hear My voice, and I know them, and they follow Me; 28 and I give eternal life to them, and they shall never perish; and no one shall snatch them out of My hand. 29 "My Father, who has given them to Me, is greater than all; and no one is able to snatch them out of the Father's hand.
NASB

no one written in the book of life can be fooled, tricked or accidentally take the mark of the beast....

If you are not in the book of life......    well it really doesn't matter to them for they will fall down and worship the beast and are lost anyway.    The mark will just be the physical showing of allegiance to the devil.

The Chip really doesn't fulfill the text of scripture so to warn people that it is or might be, could be stopping people from some life easing things in the future.....     but since it has already proven to cause cancerous tumors in some animals, I don't think it a good idea for anyone to get one put inside their body........   anywhere inside thier body.

However in a watch band or bracelet.....    it's really just a small credit card with wifi        

[brakelite]

8 hours ago, other one said:

no one written in the book of life can be fooled, tricked or accidentally take the mark of the beast....

If you are not in the book of life......    well it really doesn't matter to them for they will fall down and worship the beast and are lost anyway.    The mark will just be the physical showing of allegiance to the devil.

The Chip really doesn't fulfill the text of scripture so to warn people that it is or might be, could be stopping people from some life easing things in the future.....     but since it has already proven to cause cancerous tumors in some animals, I don't think it a good idea for anyone to get one put inside their body........   anywhere inside thier body.

However in a watch band or bracelet.....    it's really just a small credit card with wifi        

Satan is a master of deception...one of his tricks is to get people to believe that once they confess Jesus everything is hunky dory and  nothing can go wrong, like having their names scrubbed from the book of life.  Jesus said there was a condition to ones name remaining on the books. That is to overcome. Revelation 3:5.

As to Satan's other arts of deception, there are many. First, disguise the nature of the beast and its image. Anyone who does not accurately identify Antichrist, will end up on the side of Antichrist. All the reformers agreed as to who Antichrist was. Today, no-one agrees with them anymore and look to imaginary monsters in the future, while cosying up to the very one the reformers accurately identified, and died at his hands with that testimony on their lips. Never mind the future, already most of the Christian world worships at the Antichrist's feet. It is only a matter of time before they accepthis mark, with full assurance that they are doing God's will!!!

[other one]

Jesus says that no one can be snatched from the Father's hand....    Satan can not trick a truly saved person into taking the mark...      the trick in surviving the coming end times is to make sure you are really saved and you trust the Holy Spirit to get us through.....   The Spirit will not let satan have you no matter what.   So don't worry about it.

As I said if one is not in the book of life, then they have no hope.....   so instead of  pushing folks to not to do something that remotely might be the mark, we should be introducing them to Jesus so both they and us don't have to worry about it.

[SavedOnebyGrace]

7 minutes ago, JohnD said:

The 616 number / interpretation is only to obfuscate the issue. If you can't wow 'em with your wit baffle 'em with your bull**! -- Devil's Guide on How to Oppose God 101.

These kinds of "coincidences" the 6-6-6 make up of mankind are extrabiblical prophetic indications (like when Jesus said the rocks would cry out, or the heavens declare the glory of God). I am reassured by these signs, and at times use them to try to reason with unbelievers (like the biogenesis argument which sends atheists and humanists fleeing for their mommies). But the prophetic hardcopy is in the Bible.

Because we can get bogged down by the extrabiblical and obscure the biblical interpretation / clarification as to what 666 actually is.

Counting numbers (gametria and all sorts of puzzles) is typically the chiefest extrabiblical tail chase on the subject. However, we are explicitly told:

Revelation 22:18–19 (AV)
18 For I testify unto every man that heareth the words of the prophecy of this book, If any man shall add unto these things, God shall add unto him the plagues that are written in this book:
19 And if any man shall take away from the words of the book of this prophecy, God shall take away his part out of the book of life, and out of the holy city, and from the things which are written in this book.

This book.

Revelation alone?

Dr. Chuck Missler used to teach that he recommends Revelation as a superb book for novices to begin studying the Bible:

because it forces you into the rest of all scripture to understand and properly interpret its symbolism.

So even if Revelation alone is specified here, you need the entire Bible to understand it.

As my signature has said for years: the Bible is its own best commentary... interpretation.

So what 666 is (by Bible definition)?

Clearly it is a mark.

The number of man (or a man).

And it is to be counted. ← but that does not mean any old way you choose to count.

One way to count this number is the date the two Jewish Temples were destroyed (Tisha b'Av) 586 BCE  /  70 CE:

The first date is of biblical record the second of biblical prophecy...

...took place exactly 666 years apart using the prophetic calendar of 30 day months / 360 day years. To the day / date.

Is this just another marker for 666 like the protons, neutrons, and electrons?

Possibly.

But in Revelation 13:18 we are essentially instructed to count the number of his name. A name we are not actually given.

Apparently to prevent that counting to be gamatria  / picking out a name like Ronald Wilson Reagan etc.

And we are also warned to stay within the covers of the Bible to do so.  

Continued...

I don't have any major disagreements with what you've written here.  But it should be noted that the 1611 King James Version Bible included the Apocrypha, as did the Geneva Bible before it.  But the Protestant Apocrypha was different than the Roman Catholic Apocrypha.  So even if it was not part of the official Protestant Canon, it was deemed worthy enough to include it in the 1611 KJV Bible.  So anyone claiming that only the 1611 KJV Bible should be the arbiter of differences in interpretation, should keep an open mind with respect to the Apocrypha.  It was deemed worthy enough to be included in the 1611 KJV Bible as part of the Bible.

[Kevinb]

Indeed if we want to look we could attribute 666 as the devil to mean a bunch of things...a quick search I did said it can be translated to www also the Hebrew 666 has be aligned with:

Also "Nero Caesar" in the Hebrewalphabet is נרון קסר NRON QSR, which when used as numbers represent 50 200 6 50 100 60 200, which add to666. The Greek term χάραγμα (charagma, "mark" in Revelation 13:16) .

Interesting though. As a now non believer I'll have issue with science proves the bible... clearly there are massive contradictions been the two. Stellar formation and evolution being a couple of biggies vs God created and Adam and eve. 

[JohnD]

13 minutes ago, Saved.One.by.Grace said:

I don't have any major disagreements with what you've written here.  But it should be noted that the 1611 King James Version Bible included the Apocrypha, as did the Geneva Bible before it.  But the Protestant Apocrypha was different than the Roman Catholic Apocrypha.  So even if it was not part of the official Protestant Canon, it was deemed worthy enough to include it in the 1611 KJV Bible.  So anyone claiming that only the 1611 KJV Bible should be the arbiter of differences in interpretation, should keep an open mind with respect to the Apocrypha.  It was deemed worthy enough to be included in the 1611 KJV Bible as part of the Bible.

Um, if absolutely perfect translations existed, they would be perfectly misinterpreted by most.

As you said the traditions of man (known as the Apocrypha) is not canon.

I wonder, therefore, what is your point? Or your motive (if any) in bringing this up?

[JohnD]

When the Spirit first brought all of this to my attention I was quite ill. It made me physically ill.

He showed how the Jewish people (whom I love) were plowed with (using Samson's terminology 'plowing with my heifer')

by the devil for quite some time.

This is not to single them out because the devil plows with many Christians today (the Church Organization which hijacked the Church organism comes to mind).

Humanity is demonically influenced. 

So this is not to stir up a pitch fork and torch lynch mob.

Anymore than we should cower in fear over everyone we meet in our daily lives (who are influenced by satan).

So I pray this disclaimer derails any such notion AND expresses my heart is still for the Jewish people. And that it is my prayer that most (if not all) of them could be spared being plowed with by this future Temple builder who will appear to them and all the world to be the Messiah.

Matthew 24:24 (AV)
24 For there shall arise false Christs, and false prophets, and shall shew great signs and wonders; insomuch that, if it were possible, they shall deceive the very elect.

In the New Covenant, Christians are the elect (or I would say elect of heaven saved as opposed to the Jews who are elect of this world but not saved):

Romans 11:7 (AV)
7 What then? Israel hath not obtained that which he seeketh for; but the election hath obtained it, and the rest were blinded

Meaning we must pray for the salvation of Jewish people period.

[SavedOnebyGrace]

4 minutes ago, JohnD said:

Um, if absolutely perfect translations existed, they would be perfectly misinterpreted by most.

As you said the traditions of man (known as the Apocrypha) is not canon.

I wonder, therefore, what is your point? Or your motive (if any) in bringing this up?

I bring this up because anyone holding to the inerrancy of the 1611 KJV Bible shouldn't have any problem with the Apocrypha of Ezra (aka 2 Esdras) which is in the 1611 KJV Bible, between the Testaments.  There is important prophecy there that's inline with the Book of Revelations.  Isn't it worthy of study?  The translators of the 1611 KJV Bible evidently thought so.