pretrib Timing of the Rapture

[Last Daze]

18 hours ago, OneLight said:

I am not debating which trumpet is the last trumpet, and scripture is not clear on when it will be blown or which it is, and that is my point.  We don't know, but it will be at the last trump.  Do you disagree?

Since we know that:

• Surely the Lord God does nothing Unless He reveals His secret counsel To His servants the prophets.  Amos 3:7

It must have been revealed to the prophets, so in searching to see if they had written it down somewhere, I found this verse in Zechariah referring to the deliverance of Judah and Ephraim:

• Then the Lord will appear over them, and His arrow will go forth like lightning; and the Lord God will blow the trumpet, and will march in the storm winds of the south.  Zechariah 9:14

There is another passage in Isaiah 27 that references the deliverance of Jacob / Israel that also mentions a trumpet, which to me is a confirmation, a second witness.

• In that day the Lord will start His threshing from the flowing stream of the Euphrates to the brook of Egypt, and you will be gathered up one by one, O sons of Israel.  It will come about also in that day that a great trumpet will be blown, and those who were perishing in the land of Assyria and who were scattered in the land of Egypt will come and worship the Lord in the holy mountain at Jerusalem.  Isaiah 27:12-13

I realize that this doesn't fit into most people's eschatology but His word is immutable.  I haven't read of a trumpet that sounds after this one so it meets all of the criteria.

[Psalms37:4]

On 10/31/2017 at 12:57 PM, Last Daze said:

I have a question about the above "factual statement."  What about the great commission that Jesus reiterated in Matthew 24?

• And Jesus came up and spoke to them, saying, “All authority has been given to Me in heaven and on earth. Go therefore and make disciples of all the nations, baptizing them in the name of the Father and the Son and the Holy Spirit."  Matthew 28:18-19
• This gospel of the kingdom shall be preached in the whole world as a testimony to all the nations, and then the end will come.  Matthew 24:14

Didn't that have to be fulfilled?  If Jesus came for His church the day after His ascension, who would then carry out that directive?  How would the time of the Gentiles be fulfilled?

I'm just posting this to answer your question. Not doing so to debate or argue. Concerning Matthew 24:14, contrary to what many people have been taught by others, the answer is here.

Revelation 14:6-7 New King James Version (NKJV)

⁶ Then I saw another angel flying in the midst of heaven, having the everlasting gospel to preach to those who dwell on the earth—to every nation, tribe, tongue, and people— ⁷ saying with a loud voice, “Fear God and give glory to Him, for the hour of His judgment has come; and worship Him who made heaven and earth, the sea and springs of water.”

I do have a lot of other scriptures to support this but the only problem is if I post them and explain, than I'll have to post a couple of lengthy pages explaining about another prophecy which will shock everyone of what we've all been taught by others. It's really really really profound. 

The only thing I'll reveal for now is this. Ever noticed what follows after verse 14 is the abomination of desolation in verse 15? 

Matthew 24:14-15 New King James Version (NKJV)

¹⁴ And this gospel of the kingdom will be preached in all the world as a witness to all the nations, and then the end will come.

¹⁵ “Therefore when you see the ‘abomination of desolation,’ spoken of by Daniel the prophet, standing in the holy place” (whoever reads, let him understand),

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

[Last Daze]

1 hour ago, Psalms37:4 said:

I'm just posting this to answer your question. Not doing so to debate or argue. Concerning Matthew 24:14, contrary to what many people have been taught by others, the answer is here.

Revelation 14:6-7 New King James Version (NKJV)

⁶ Then I saw another angel flying in the midst of heaven, having the everlasting gospel to preach to those who dwell on the earth—to every nation, tribe, tongue, and people— ⁷ saying with a loud voice, “Fear God and give glory to Him, for the hour of His judgment has come; and worship Him who made heaven and earth, the sea and springs of water.”

 

That could very well be what Jesus was referencing.  I personally believe that the above mentioned angel works through the 144,000 who are on earth during the plagues when the "heaven and earth, the sea and the springs of water" are being affected by the first four plagues.

But there's still the great commission that needed to be fulfilled, the time of the Gentiles, so His return being imminent since His ascension doesn't make any sense to me.  Anyway, thanks for the reply.

 

[simplejeff]

12 minutes ago, Last Daze said:

But there's still the great commission that needed to be fulfilled, the time of the Gentiles, so His return being imminent since His ascension doesn't make any sense to me.  Anyway, thanks for the reply.

Again, as before,  go only by what is written,  and not by the so-called 'theology' or various man-made doctrines or such that were devised by men and through men.

Yes,  it is difficult,  since most of what is taught for several generations is man-made, contrary to, added to, or taken away from (thus all-t0gether different from)
Yahweh's Word.

[Serving]

On 01/11/2017 at 4:35 AM, Dennis1209 said:

I guess the Apostle Paul must have been mistaken, looking for His return in his own lifetime?

Hi Dennis1209,

2 Thess 1:1

1 Paul, and Silvanus, and Timotheus, unto the church of the Thessalonians in God our Father and the Lord Jesus Christ:

Paul knew very well that the Lord was NOT coming in his own lifetime, hence this :

2 Thess 2:1-2

1 Now we beseech you, brethren, by the coming of our Lord Jesus Christ, and by our gathering together unto him,

2 That ye be not soon shaken in mind, or be troubled, neither by spirit, nor by word, nor by letter as from us, as that the day of Christ is at hand.

IF it ever seems that one of God's Apostles is mistaken on a matter of interpretation .. well .. a little advice .. the error is NEVER on the side of God's CHOSEN APOSTLES. 

Thank you.

[Last Daze]

2 hours ago, simplejeff said:

Again, as before,  go only by what is written,  and not by the so-called 'theology' or various man-made doctrines or such that were devised by men and through men.

Can you please be more specific?  Where exactly did what I said not agree with what is written.  And please don't link me to some book.  Post the scripture.

[Dennis1209]

22 hours ago, When Is Jesus Coming? said:

Jesus read this in the jubilee year of His ministry (The favourable year of the Lord):

Luke 4

17and the scroll of the prophet Isaiah was handed to him. Unrolling it, he found the place where it is written:

18“The Spirit of the Lord is on me, because he has anointed me to proclaim good news to the poor. He has sent me to proclaim freedom for the prisoners and recovery of sight for the blind, to set the oppressed free, 19to proclaim the year of the Lord’s favor.”

20Then he rolled up the scroll, gave it back to the attendant and sat down. The eyes of everyone in the synagogue were fastened on him. 21He began by saying to them, “Today this scripture is fulfilled in your hearing.”

Jesus stopped short of reading the next line: 

Isaiah 61

and the day of vengeance of our God, to comfort all who mourn,

This is the Great and Terrible Day of the Lord. Which will also happen on a Jubilee year because Jubilee was when the slaves were set free, which was a prophetic foreshadowing of when God's people will be set free. 

Therefore 29AD + 20 Jubilee's = 2029AD

 

I agree. That's one of the reasons why I suspect the Rapture will occur around that time frame. However, the preciseness of the Jubilee years seem to have been lost after the A.D. 70 diaspora?

[When Is Jesus Coming?]

1 hour ago, Dennis1209 said:

I agree. That's one of the reasons why I suspect the Rapture will occur around that time frame. However, the preciseness of the Jubilee years seem to have been lost after the A.D. 70 diaspora?

The Jubilee was every 50th year and the Bible has all the dates: 

https://guidetothebible.files.wordpress.com/2015/10/guidechronologylatest1.pdf

[Dennis1209]

On 10/31/2017 at 2:57 PM, Last Daze said:

I have a question about the above "factual statement."  What about the great commission that Jesus reiterated in Matthew 24?

• And Jesus came up and spoke to them, saying, “All authority has been given to Me in heaven and on earth. Go therefore and make disciples of all the nations, baptizing them in the name of the Father and the Son and the Holy Spirit."  Matthew 28:18-19
• This gospel of the kingdom shall be preached in the whole world as a testimony to all the nations, and then the end will come.  Matthew 24:14

Didn't that have to be fulfilled?  If Jesus came for His church the day after His ascension, who would then carry out that directive?  How would the time of the Gentiles be fulfilled?

And what area and how many nations were the (known) whole world during the Roman rule at that time? How fast did the Gospel go forth from the Day of Pentecost? 

You do have a valid point and I erred. This is a precondition and I was writing from faulty memory. Lesson learned.

That's why I have you guys around, to correct me when I error.

[Diaste]

On 10/31/2017 at 12:03 PM, Daniel 11:36 said:

Here is the time line:

The Lord will immortalize all of those who belong to Him from the beginning of creation

7 years of tribulation will come next .... the Lord will  bring it all

Satan and his fallen angles will participate on the earth

The beast [Abaddon/Apollyon] in the human little horn will rule with 10 other kings

The false prophet will support this beast with 2 Islamic human clerics

Armageddon will come at the end of the 70th week and last for 30 days

Then the Lord will appear and separate the mortals left on the earth over the next 45 days

All of those who believe in Him of Israel and of the Gentiles will enter and populate His millennial kingdom on the earth as mortals

Those found in unbelief will not

Satan will be sent to the abyss and released to cause another rebellion at the end of the 1000 years

Satan will be sent to the lake of fire where the beast and false prophet were sent at the end of the battle of Armageddon 1000 years before

Then all of the spirits of lost humanity will be sentenced at the great white throne judgment and sent to the lake of fire

And eternity will begin with new heavens and a new earth which will last forever  

The great scriptural error here is equating the entire last week with great tribulation. In Matt 24 Jesus said great tribulation would only occur after the A of D, which occurs in the middle of the week. If the 'rapture' was pre trib it would not occur until just prior to the middle of the week.