IN THE MIDST OF COVID19, WHAT'S NEXT IN BIBLE PROPHECY?

[Jostler]

1 hour ago, CLIVE CAMPBELL said:

I'm not making up what I think will happen. I'm trying to decipher what the Bible says will happen. Again, I believe that God may use that.

All I can say is where I believe the Lord has me focused.  And it's squarely on "birth pains".  Merging all the characteristics of birth pains Jesus told us to watch for gives me a list of things I'm alert to and watching for:

The text I'm most focused on personally is found in Matt 24, Mark 13 and Luke 21.  Three separate acccounts of what we often call the "Olivet Discourse".  Matthew 24 is the most complete account of the three, but all record the same speech by Jesus and each adds detail and depth to the whole.  From that I think we can glean the understanding that birth pains as He described them are a precursor to the "end of the age".  He took pains to caution us not to assume the birth pains are the same as the events that will characterize the end of this age.  The birth pains are signs signifying the time is getting close, the events characterizing the end of the age, and His return are close....but not yet.

 

Quote

Mat 24:4-8

¶

And Jesus answered and said to them: “Take heed that no one deceives you.

 

“For many will come in My name, saying, ‘I am the Christ,’ and will deceive many.

“And you will hear of wars and rumors of wars. See that you are not troubled; for all these things must come to pass, but the end is not yet.

 

“For nation will rise against nation, and kingdom against kingdom. And there will be famines, pestilences, and earthquakes in various places.

 

“All these are the beginning of sorrows.

 

Quote

Mar 13:5-8

¶

And Jesus, answering them, began to say: “Take heed that no one deceives you.

 

“For many will come in My name, saying, ‘I am He,’ and will deceive many.

 

“But when you hear of wars and rumors of wars, do not be troubled; for such things must happen, but the end is not yet.

 

“For nation will rise against nation, and kingdom against kingdom. And there will be earthquakes in various places, and there will be famines and troubles. These are the beginnings of sorrows.

 

Quote

Luk 21:8-11

¶

And He said: “Take heed that you not be deceived. For many will come in My name, saying, ‘I am He,’ and, ‘The time has drawn near.’ Therefore do not go after them.

 

“But when you hear of wars and commotions, do not be terrified; for these things must come to pass first, but the end will not come immediately.”

 

 

¶

Then He said to them, “Nation will rise against nation, and kingdom against kingdom.

 

“And there will be great earthquakes in various places, and famines and pestilences; and there will be fearful sights and great signs from heaven.

 

One thing it seems to me was common to all three accounts and all the writers assigned enough importance to to include, was His warning against being deceived and His assertion that birth pains do NOT mark the end of the age.  They just tell us we're getting close....and it's my understanding they're a wake up call and a call to be more alert and watchful when we see birth pains beginning.

From the combined witnesses we can draw up a list of things He is telling us to watch for, the things that characterize "birth pains".

1.  Wars

2.  Rumours of wars

3.  Nation rising against nation (Original language is important here)

4.  Kingdom rising against kingdom

5.  Famines

6.  Pestilence  (very very general word with broad application)

7.  Earthquakes (widespread, in "diverse" places)

8.  Troubles (pays to look into the Greek word for this)

9.  Fearful sights  (Greek is instructive here)

10.  Great signs from heaven  (Greek is enlightening here too)

 

 

 

Quote

Luk 21:31-32

“So you also, when you see these things happening, know that the kingdom of God is near.

 

“Assuredly, I say to you, this generation will by no means pass away till all things take place.

 

That's a bare outline of where I am personally at with this.  But it would seem, the generation that sees these things beginning, will be the generation that sees them finished, culminating in His second coming.

We've got wars and rumours of wars a plenty....we have pestilence in several locations and forms.  Nation is rising against nation (and to see that some study is required as to how God defines a "nation").  Kingdom is rising against Kingdom.

As I continue to pursue Him for more insights, right now I'm feeling most led to watch for earthquakes, upheavals in nature ("fearful sights":  volcanism, unusually violent weather...etc), and general lawlessness manifesting in civil unrest and conflict between "nations".   There are three ongoing earthquake clusters that have my undivided attention right now.  Krakatoa popped off last Friday and Iceland is reporting some pretty ominous signs that volcanic activity there might be approaching a new eruptive phase.  Two of the three earthquake swarms ongoing have unusual characteristics that *might* point to volcanic cause as opposed to tectonic/fault related causes.

The MOST concerning issue on my mind is war.  The war I foresee will affect just about everyone on a global scale, and is likely to come as a complete surprise to most Americans....and suddenly.

 

FWIW......but   look up.....

Edited April 13, 2020 by Jostler

[Michael37]

3 hours ago, Jostler said:

I see where the confusion came in.  I worded that poorly.  I should have said "destroy the power and influence of nation states" referring to any ability to resist globalist ambitions for one world government."  I probably should have used the word "kingdoms" rather than nations as well.  It is the political, economic and military power to resist the plans to bring all men under one political and religious system and install their little wannabe godlet over it all that satan seeks to destroy.

Kingdom and nation are two different words and the difference seems slight, but that slight difference has pretty profound implications.  Nations as God defines the word are not what satan seeks to destroy...he wants to usurp the rule over them that Father promised Jesus as His inheritance. 

Anyway, my choice of words was poor.  We tend to treat nations and kingdoms as synonyms, and there is some overlap....i used "nation states" to describe what I meant and should have used "kingdoms".  Nations as God defines them will still be in existence in eternity, the new heaven and earth.  I never meant to imply the nations He gave birth to at the scattering associated with the tower of Babel would be destroyed.  But I see where my careless word choice left that impression

All Good! Thanks for the clarification, Jostler. Further to the conversation is the beautiful juxtaposition of nation (ethnos)  to kindred (phulē),  tongue (glōssa)  and people (laos), which we note repeated for emphasis in these verses just in case anyone thought their group wasn't included in Biblical prophecy:

Rev 5:9  And they sung a new song, saying, You are worthy to take the book, and to open the seals thereof: for you were slain, and have redeemed us to God by your blood out of every kindred, and tongue, and people, and nation;

Rev 7:9  After this I beheld, and, lo, a great multitude, which no man could number, of all nations, and kindreds, and people, and tongues, stood before the throne, and before the Lamb, clothed with white robes, and palms in their hands;

Rev 11:9  And they of the people and kindreds and tongues and nations shall see their dead bodies three days and an half, and shall not suffer their dead bodies to be put in graves.

Rev 14:6  And I saw another angel fly in the midst of heaven, having the everlasting gospel to preach unto them that dwell on the earth, and to every nation, and kindred, and tongue, and people,

19 minutes ago, Jostler said:

All I can say is where I believe the Lord has me focused.  And it's squarely on "birth pains".  Merging all the characteristics of birth pains Jesus told us to watch for gives me a list of things I'm alert to and watching for:

The text I'm most focused on personally is found in Matt 24, Mark 13 and Luke 21.  Three separate acccounts of what we often call the "Olivet Discourse".  Matthew 24 is the most complete account of the three, but all record the same speech by Jesus and each adds detail and depth to the whole.  From that I think we can glean the understanding that birth pains as He described them are a precursor to the "end of the age".  He took pains to caution us not to assume the birth pains are the same as the events that will characterize the end of this age.  The birth pains are signs signifying the time is getting close, the events characterizing the end of the age, and His return are close....but not yet.

One thing it seems to me was common to all three accounts and all the writers assigned enough importance to to include, was His warning against being deceived and His assertion that birth pains do NOT mark the end of the age.  They just tell us we're getting close....and it's my understanding they're a wake up call and a call to be more alert and watchful when we see birth pains beginning.

From the combined witnesses we can draw up a list of things He is telling us to watch for, the things that characterize "birth pains".

1.  Wars

2.  Rumours of wars

3.  Nation rising against nation (Original language is important here)

4.  Kingdom rising against kingdom

5.  Famines

6.  Pestilence  (very very general word with broad application)

7.  Earthquakes (widespread, in "diverse" places)

8.  Troubles (pays to look into the Greek word for this)

9.  Fearful sights  (Greek is instructive here)

10.  Great signs from heaven  (Greek is enlightening here too)

That's a bare outline of where I am personally at with this.  But it would seem, the generation that sees these things beginning, will be the generation that sees them finished, culminating in His second coming.

We've got wars and rumours of wars a plenty....we have pestilence in several locations and forms.  Nation is rising against nation (and to see that some study is required as to how God defines a "nation").  Kingdom is rising against Kingdom.

As I continue to pursue Him for more insights, right now I'm feeling most led to watch for earthquakes, upheavals in nature ("fearful sights":  volcanism, unusually violent weather...etc), and general lawlessness manifesting in civil unrest and conflict between "nations".   There are three ongoing earthquake clusters that have my undivided attention right now.  Krakatoa popped off last Friday and Iceland is reporting some pretty ominous signs that volcanic activity there might be approaching a new eruptive phase.  Two of the three earthquake swarms ongoing have unusual characteristics that *might* point to volcanic cause as opposed to tectonic/fault related causes.

The MOST concerning issue on my mind is war.  The war I foresee will affect just about everyone on a global scale, and is likely to come as a complete surprise to most Americans....and suddenly.

FWIW......but   look up.....

As stated in some of my posts, the Bible is full of lists and I do have an appreciable liking for them, so thanks for taking the time to list the birth pains, which our ekklesia sometimes discuss in association with the trinity of groanings described in Romans 8.

[CLIVE CAMPBELL]

2 hours ago, Jostler said:

FWIW......but   look up.....

FOR WHAT IT'S WORTH--had to look that up. Jostler, I want to thank you again for sharing this passage on another one of my posts. I tag on an addendum:

Isaiah 26:20-21 New American Standard Bible (NASB)

 

20 Come, my people, enter into your rooms

And close your doors behind you;

Hide for a little while

Until indignation runs its course.

21 For behold, the Lord is about to come out from His place

To punish the inhabitants of the earth for their iniquity;

...

 

The literal for "runs its course" is "passes over": just like the angel of death "passed over" the Israelites at their first Passover in Egypt.

[luigi]

Birth = delivery of something new.

At the conclusion of the beasts system, there comes a delivery.

Daniel 12:1 And at that time shall Michael stand up, the great prince which standeth for the children of thy people: and there shall be a time of trouble, such as never was since there was a nation even to that same time: and at that time thy people shall be delivered, every one that shall be found written in the book.

Revelation 12:2 And she being with child cried, travailing in birth, and pained to be delivered.

Revelation 12:4 And his tail drew the third part of the stars of heaven, and did cast them to the earth: and the dragon stood before the woman which was ready to be delivered, for to devour her child as soon as it was born.

[abcdef]

On 4/4/2020 at 6:15 PM, CLIVE CAMPBELL said:

Michael, my own view of the Gog/Magog war in Rev 20 is that it is not like a second Armageddon, but a re-telling of the same event. I believe that stanzas that cover the 4 millennia of Israel keep repeating through the book. If you are interested, Google my paper, "The Hermeneutical Key to the Book of Revelation," with the quotation marks. You might also like to read some of my first draft commentary on Rev here:

https://www.faithwriters.com/myaccount/article-manage.php

I couldn't read your paper for some reason.

I believe in a repeating Rev  timeline.

Armageddon is the battle seen in Rev 20.

[CLIVE CAMPBELL]

9 minutes ago, abcdef said:

I couldn't read your paper for some reason.

I believe in a repeating Rev  timeline.

Armageddon is the battle seen in Rev 20.

abcdef, yes, I agree. Here is where you can get to my paper. I would at least change 1 thing now. I now believe that Satan and the demons not active in the 120 years before Noah's 600th year were released from hell (they were bound in 70 AD, I believe) 120 years before the 6000th year (after 14 B, without macro-evolution) in 2030, so, in 1910.

https://www.biblicaltheology.com/Research/CampbellC01.pdf

Here's a first draft of my commentary on Rev 4 too. I've done other chapters on the same site.

https://www.faithwriters.com//article-details.php?id=171099

Love in the Lord,

Clive

[abcdef]

20 minutes ago, CLIVE CAMPBELL said:

abcdef, yes, I agree. Here is where you can get to my paper. I would at least change 1 thing now. I now believe that Satan and the demons not active in the 120 years before Noah's 600th year were released from hell (they were bound in 70 AD, I believe) 120 years before the 6000th year (after 14 B, without macro-evolution) in 2030, so, in 1910.

https://www.biblicaltheology.com/Research/CampbellC01.pdf

Here's a first draft of my commentary on Rev 4 too. I've done other chapters on the same site.

https://www.faithwriters.com//article-details.php?id=171099

Love in the Lord,

Clive

Hi Clive,

What do you think that the next prophetic fulfillment will be? Where are we in the time line?

[CLIVE CAMPBELL]

7 minutes ago, abcdef said:

Hi Clive,

What do you think that the next prophetic fulfillment will be? Where are we in the time line?

abcdef, I think it will be a regional Mideast war, enabling the morning and evening sacrifices to start on the Temple Mount. Or perhaps, vice versa. I believe that these sacrifices will start this year, because once they do, there will be a 1040-day (2300-1260) countdown to the resurrection and rapture. And then 7 years of Tribulation until 6000 years of human history, 4000 years of Jewish history and 2000 years since the resurrection ends in 2030. Nobody knows the day and hour, but that is a good guess at the year.

The Orthodox Jews just tried to do a Passover sacrifice on the Temple Mount, but were denied by Netanyahu.

[abcdef]

12 minutes ago, CLIVE CAMPBELL said:

abcdef, I think it will be a regional Mideast war, enabling the morning and evening sacrifices to start on the Temple Mount. Or perhaps, vice versa. I believe that these sacrifices will start this year, because once they do, there will be a 1040-day (2300-1260) countdown to the resurrection and rapture. And then 7 years of Tribulation until 6000 years of human history, 4000 years of Jewish history and 2000 years since the resurrection ends in 2030. Nobody knows the day and hour, but that is a good guess at the year.

The Orthodox Jews just tried to do a Passover sacrifice on the Temple Mount, but were denied by Netanyahu.

I think that a war in the Middle East is the next event also.

But if you look at the entities involved, it looks like the battle of Armageddon is about to happen.

The kings of the east Iran and Magog have restored Jerusalem surrounded.

[CLIVE CAMPBELL]

11 minutes ago, abcdef said:

I think that a war in the Middle East is the next event also.

But if you look at the entities involved, it looks like the battle of Armageddon is about to happen.

The kings of the east Iran and Magog have restored Jerusalem surrounded.

abcdef, not yet, I think. The 10-nation Commonwealth of Independent States (CIS), headed by Russia, is there. But the 7 years of tribulation will begin with the appearance of the Antichrist (perhaps a Jewish military man) out of 1 of those states that will take down 3 others (perhaps the 3 small "stan" states). I expect that will happen about the same time as the resurrection and rapture and the descent of Moses and Elijah to Jerusalem.