Ghost Story: Levels of Hell

[other one]

4 hours ago, Biblican said:

Interesting. But from my experience, demons don't tend to stay in one place where there are no people. There has been paranormal activity in abandoned houses which to me doesn't fit the demons mode of operation. Your thoughts?

There is a spot on Tinker Air Force base where the morgue was during WWII that now has the Defense Printing that has many many spiritual entities within it.  Everyone that I know that has worked there nights has had interfaces with them.  Two of the ladies there would invite them home with them for the weekend.

Most everyone thinks they are ghosts, but ghosts don't respond to the name of Jesus. 

 

[Biblican]

16 minutes ago, other one said:

There is a spot on Tinker Air Force base where the morgue was during WWII that now has the Defense Printing that has many many spiritual entities within it.  Everyone that I know that has worked there nights has had interfaces with them.  Two of the ladies there would invite them home with them for the weekend.

Most everyone thinks they are ghosts, but ghosts don't respond to the name of Jesus. 

 

That's really true. If its a demon it will have to leave in Jesus' name.

[Biblican]

2 hours ago, OneLight said:

First, scripture does not say Paradise is no longer there.  Man does.  When Jesus spoke the parable, He was painting a picture so that we would have an understanding of what happens when a person dies.  When Jesus rose and led captivity captive, there is no scripture telling us He destroyed, or closed paradise.  It shows His authority as He has the keys to Hades and death.  Don't forget to take what you have been told and hold it up to scripture to see if what you heard is scriptural or of man.

Second, if you are implying with your theory that those who died before Jesus rose from the dead were captive in paradise, then where did the disciples get the idea that when they saw Jesus walking on water that He was a ghost? 

Keep studying and discover the difference between scriptural truth and the doctrine and stories of men.

Peter said that Jesus ministered to those in hell. Because He came there was no longer any need for Paradise which was basically a holding place for the righteous dead until Messiah came. So I think it's logical to think that it's empty now and no longer needed.

Paradise was for the righteous dead. Apparently the disciples believed that there were ghosts. Ghosts then were probably seen as disembodied pagans who would not rate Paradise which was seen then as just for Jews.

[Biblican]

4 hours ago, grahampaul said:

Do you know what a soul is? there is nothing immortal about the soul. when a man dies his soul no more.

The soul is the person of anyone who we are. The word is identified with God and Jesus in the original languages in both testaments. There is no indication in scripture that the soul ceases to exist after the death of the body.

[Biblican]

4 hours ago, tim_from_pa said:

Interesting story, and this would make a good movie, but sorry to say this is not Biblical at all.  And while I do not deny spirits such as poltergeists, we have to realize what they are:  demonic entities and should not be given any sympathy or attention.

For the rest of the Christians reading this, the unbiblical concept of the "immortal soul" fosters stories like these even if inadvertently.  We sleep until the resurrection, otherwise if there is a disembodied soul floating around, whether on earth or in heaven, then a fully conscious being like that would not need a resurrection. It would be pointless as the soul in spirit form is then merely a transition devoid of any body. "The soul that sins will die"  Ezekiel 18:20.

I do not believe that we sleep until the resurrection. The scriptures that seem to point to that are all in the Old testament and before the resurrection. Once the believing soul has been unified with the Holy Spirit it must ascend with the Spirit. That is why Paul knew he would be with Christ immediately upon his death. 

When my friend's husband died, her grown daughter was allowed to see his soul fly up and out of his body. He was a Christian.

[Biblican]

5 hours ago, Slibhin said:

Obviously you've never read the Tanakh. Sheol is not hell, and Lucifer only appears in Christian translations. Satan is mentioned twice, both times as one of G-d's angels.

Not true at all. The Old Testament we have is from the Septuagint. Lucifer is another name for Satan who is a fallen angel and God's enemy. Some of the Hebrew writings make him the good guy which I find disturbing.

[Michael37]

2 hours ago, Biblican said:

Peter said that Jesus ministered to those in hell. Because He came there was no longer any need for Paradise which was basically a holding place for the righteous dead until Messiah came. So I think it's logical to think that it's empty now and no longer needed.

Paradise was for the righteous dead. Apparently the disciples believed that there were ghosts. Ghosts then were probably seen as disembodied pagans who would not rate Paradise which was seen then as just for Jews.

For your consideration

1Pe 3:20
(20)  who disobeyed long ago when God waited patiently in the days of Noah while the ark was being built. In the ark a few people, only eight souls, were saved through water.
 

Against Christ Preaching To The Dead

The reference to Jesus preaching is not to be construed as taking place after His death, but rather the "quickening" of His Spirit in Noah so as to preach through him to those who because of their unbelief are now in Hades, that is "prison".

The translation is a difficult one because it ends up giving the impression that Jesus went from His crucifixion to preach to those in Hades, but Peter was simply saying those who drowned in the flood are in Hades as of the time of his writing the epistle, and they were preached to by Christ in Noah before the flood.

The following earlier verses deal with "the Spirit of Christ being in those who preached prior to His incarnation.   

1Pe 1:9-12
(9)  Receiving the end of your faith, even the salvation of your souls.
(10)  Of which salvation the prophets have enquired and searched diligently, who prophesied of the grace that should come unto you:
(11)  Searching what, or what manner of time the Spirit of Christ which was in them did signify, when it testified beforehand the sufferings of Christ, and the glory that should follow.
(12)  Unto whom it was revealed, that not unto themselves, but unto us they did minister the things, which are now reported unto you by them that have preached the gospel unto you with the Holy Ghost sent down from heaven; which things the angels desire to look into.

[other one]

5 hours ago, Slibhin said:

So to make this somehow marginally tie into the topic: The Torah expressly forbids necromancy, spirit talking, divining or any sort of witchcraft/sorcery. Speaking to the dead is specifically mentioned as a forbidden act which implies there are spirits of some sort. They are probably bad news and Hashem said we are not to even attempt to deal with them, likely for that reason.

He was not speaking to dead people, but the fallen angels that left their place and came into our physical world.....    they were placed in a prison that is sometimes translated ad hell.   Not reading the New Testament would keep that understanding from your conversations.

[OneLight]

11 hours ago, Biblican said:

Peter said that Jesus ministered to those in hell. Because He came there was no longer any need for Paradise which was basically a holding place for the righteous dead until Messiah came. So I think it's logical to think that it's empty now and no longer needed.

Paradise was for the righteous dead. Apparently the disciples believed that there were ghosts. Ghosts then were probably seen as disembodied pagans who would not rate Paradise which was seen then as just for Jews.

I would appreciate it if you would provide where you found this in scripture. Book, chapter and verse would be sufficient. This way we could discuss scripture instead of personal beliefs.  Scripture is where the truth is found.

[Neighbor]

6 hours ago, Slibhin said:

The "Old" Testament and the Tanakh are not the same book, and if you had read it you'd be aware of this. They are translated differently and the Tanakh has 24 books instead of whatever the "Old" Testament has because we don't divide them as you do. Lucifer, the devil and so on do not exist in Judaism because they are not supported in any of the Tankah, Talmud or the Midrash.

Hi,

I started writing on the subject of interest then researched for an item and came across this https://www.jewishvirtuallibrary.org/the-tanakh The presentation with history of the various divides in Scripture is well written so I deleted my own less informative account. I suggest the link's information may be of   help in resolving some of the differences of opinion being expressed on this thread's little aside.