The Two Witnesses & The Detail Missed By The Experts

[TrueFollowerOfChrist]

On 12/13/2023 at 4:51 PM, Paul2 said:

The two witnesses symbolically fulfill the second half of the 70th week laying dead in the street, with each day representing a year

I don't know if I'm misunderstanding this or not, but are you saying the witnesses being dead in the street for 3 days is not literal, but symbolic? I think the text is clear they will literally be dead for 3 days before they are resurrected again. 

[Shilohsfoal]

3 hours ago, TrueFollowerOfChrist said:

I don't know if I'm misunderstanding this or not, but are you saying the witnesses being dead in the street for 3 days is not literal, but symbolic? I think the text is clear they will literally be dead for 3 days before they are resurrected again. 

Don't forget the half day.Three and a half days 

That way, when you see them die,you will know what time of day it will be when Christ comes.Three a half days after those two witnesses are killed, Jesus will be over Jerusalem in a cloud.You will know what time of day that cloud ascends from Jerusalem and the hour the earthquake strikes Jerusalem.You will know when the seventh Trump sounds three and a half days in advance.

 

⁴² Watch therefore: for ye know not what hour your Lord doth come.

[douggg]

6 hours ago, Keras said:

So; are the souls of all the martyrs since Stephen, not under the Altar in heaven? Revelation 6:9-11

No, because those souls will have taken part in the rapture/resurrection event before the great tribulation takes place.     

The souls of them martyred during the great tribulation are those under the Altar in the fifth seal.   Jesus tells them to wait a little longer until their number is complete (verse 11).    

Then when Jesus returns, he will avenge their blood on them who killed them.    Which can only be done if them who killed them are alive at the time. 

 

9 And when he had opened the fifth seal, I saw under the altar the souls of them that were slain for the word of God, and for the testimony which they held:

10 And they cried with a loud voice, saying, How long, O Lord, holy and true, dost thou not judge and avenge our blood on them that dwell on the earth?

11 And white robes were given unto every one of them; and it was said unto them, that they should rest yet for a little season, until their fellowservants also and their brethren, that should be killed as they were, should be fulfilled.

[Keras]

6 hours ago, douggg said:

No, because those souls will have taken part in the rapture/resurrection event before the great tribulation takes place.   

If only you had any proof of your 'rapture/ resurrection' event, then the rest of your theory would work.  As it is, your end times scenario is a hopeless muddle. 

[douggg]

49 minutes ago, Keras said:

If only you had any proof of your 'rapture/ resurrection' event, then the rest of your theory would work.  As it is, your end times scenario is a hopeless muddle. 

keras, in order for Jesus to revenge the blood of the slain martyrs, those who had slain them must be alive.     The ones who had martyred Stephen for example are long, long dead.

The ones in the fifth seal are the great tribulation martyrs.    Jesus will avenge their blood the day that He returns on the wicked.

 

10 And they cried with a loud voice, saying, How long, O Lord, holy and true, dost thou not judge and avenge our blood on them that dwell on the earth?

 

Edited December 21, 2023 by douggg

[Diaste]

23 hours ago, douggg said:

The book that Jesus removed the seven seals to reveal what is inside is about the events that will take place in the 7 year 70th week of Daniel 9:27 to complete the seventy weeks determined on Daniel's people the Jews and Jerusalem.

And to complete the mystery of God, spoken of Revelation 10:7....

7 But in the days of the voice of the seventh angel, when he shall begin to sound, the mystery of God should be finished, as he hath declared to his servants the prophets.                                 

The mystery of God is God's plan to undo all the damage done to creation by Satan and his angels.   And to redeem mankind.   And to restore the earth.   

The mystery of God is the whole of the bible.

Indeed. I agree with that idea. We already know what's going to happen at the 1st trump. It's hasn't happened, it is revealed what will happen when the time arrives.

[Diaste]

16 hours ago, Keras said:

 

Just like any information, things described happen when the right time comes.

This is true.

16 hours ago, Keras said:

  With the first five Seals, their time came when Jesus Ascended to heaven and took the scroll from the hand of God. 

Uh huh. Why do you think that? 

16 hours ago, Keras said:

You and Dougggg like to play fast and loose with the as Written sequence of Revelation. Placing the Sixth Seal at the time of Jesus' Return, is wrong and contradicts much Prophecy. The Glorious Return is described in Rev 19-20, It does not match Rev 6:12-17

No?

Then why do we see this?

"And when I saw the Lamb open the sixth seal, there was a great earthquake, and the sun became black like sackcloth of goat hair, and the whole moon turned blood red, 13and the stars of the sky fell to the earth like unripe figs dropping from a tree shaken by a great wind."

Immediately after the tribulation of those days:

‘The sun will be darkened,

and the moon will not give its light;

the stars will fall from the sky,

and the powers of the heavens will be shaken.b’

30At that time the sign of the Son of Man will appear in heaven,c and all the tribes of the earth will mourn. They will see the Son of Man coming on the clouds of heaven,

The above passage in Matt 24 is the return of Jesus. It's the same as what is seen in Rev 6 regarding the sun, moon and stars. So either Rev 6:12-13 and Matt 24:29-30 are the same event and have the same timing, the return of Jesus, or these are two separate unrelated events occurring what? Hundreds or thousands of years apart?\

Is there any evidence the one has occurred and Jesus did not return?

Just because Rev 6:12-13 does not say "Jesus return at this time." it's abundantly clear Jesus is returning at the 6th seal as wrath is now imminent, everyone knows it, and everyone knows Jesus and God are bringing that wrath up front and personal to everyone on earth. It's even said the people can see the Lamb and God;

“Fall on us and hide us from the face of the One seated on the throne, and from the wrath of the Lamb. 17For the great day of Theirc wrath has come, and who is able to withstand it?”

[TrueFollowerOfChrist]

13 hours ago, Shilohsfoal said:

Don't forget the half day.Three and a half days 

That way, when you see them die,you will know what time of day it will be when Christ comes.Three a half days after those two witnesses are killed, Jesus will be over Jerusalem in a cloud.You will know what time of day that cloud ascends from Jerusalem and the hour the earthquake strikes Jerusalem.You will know when the seventh Trump sounds three and a half days in advance.

 

⁴² Watch therefore: for ye know not what hour your Lord doth come.

I'm not sure if I understand your answer correctly but I'll say this. I don't believe the 2 witnesses will do their 42 months of ministry before the tribulation. I also don't believe their ministry will be the last 42 months of the Tribulation. I believe the 42 months of the witnesses will be the 1st half of the Tribulation. I believe their deaths will be at the same time as the AC breaking the covenant with Israel at the midpoint of the Tribulation. I don't know what time is the day they will die but I believe they will literally be dead for 86 hours. It looks like you believe the resurrection of the witnesses will be at the same time as the return of Jesus to the earth. I don't believe that, but I'm not dogmatic about it. I honestly don't know the timing of these things, I've simply stated what I believe. I may be wrong or I may be right. We will find out one day.

[Shilohsfoal]

17 minutes ago, TrueFollowerOfChrist said:

I'm not sure if I understand your answer correctly but I'll say this. I don't believe the 2 witnesses will do their 42 months of ministry before the tribulation. I also don't believe their ministry will be the last 42 months of the Tribulation. I believe the 42 months of the witnesses will be the 1st half of the Tribulation. I believe their deaths will be at the same time as the AC breaking the covenant with Israel at the midpoint of the Tribulation. I don't know what time is the day they will die but I believe they will literally be dead for 86 hours. It looks like you believe the resurrection of the witnesses will be at the same time as the return of Jesus to the earth. I don't believe that, but I'm not dogmatic about it. I honestly don't know the timing of these things, I've simply stated what I believe. I may be wrong or I may be right. We will find out one day.

The two witnesses occupy Jerusalem during the persecution of the saints.They are killed and then come to life on resurrection day when Christ raises the dead.Both good and bad in Israel is resurected at that time.

 

The king of the north does not break his agreement with Israel.It is Israel policy that Israel and all the nations around Israel that have attacked Israel should be nuked into oblivion.And that is what takes place 3.5 days after the beast from.the abyss has taken control of Jerusalem.The abomination of desolation placed in Jerusalem which causes the earthquake and the cloud to ascend into heaven is all Israel policy.The policy is called the Samson option.It is to be implemented after Israel has been overwhelmed by its enemies.

The Samson Option (Hebrew: ברירת שמשון, b'rerat shimshon) is the name that some military analysts and authors have given to Israel's deterrence strategy of massive retaliation with nuclear weapons as a "last resort" against a country whose military has invaded and/or destroyed much of Israel

 

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Samson_Option

 

 

¹² And I beheld when he had opened the sixth seal, and, lo, there was a great earthquake; and the sun became black as sackcloth of hair, and the moon became as blood;

¹³ And the stars of heaven fell unto the earth, even as a fig tree casteth her untimely figs, when she is shaken of a mighty wind.

¹⁴ And the heaven departed as a scroll when it is rolled together; and every mountain and island were moved out of their places.

¹⁵ And the kings of the earth, and the great men, and the rich men, and the chief captains, and the mighty men, and every bondman, and every free man, hid themselves in the dens and in the rocks of the mountains;

¹⁶ And said to the mountains and rocks, Fall on us, and hide us from the face of him that sitteth on the throne, and from the wrath of the Lamb:

¹⁷ For the great day of his wrath is come; and who shall be able to stand?

 

 

You can determine this day 1290 days before it takes place.You can determine what time of day this takes place 3.5 days before it takes place.

If you watch.

 

 

⁴² Watch therefore: for ye know not what hour your Lord doth come.

 

 

 

 

Edited December 21, 2023 by Shilohsfoal

[Shilohsfoal]

Why people believe it's good to kill and torment other people in Jesus name is beyond me.Christians should know better than to believe Jesus sends his witnesses to kill others in Jesus name.They should be preaching the gospel and healing the sick.They should be like good Samaritans and help the aflicked.Insted christians on this board believe your continuing Jesus work by tormenting other people.Killing anyone who opposes you.

Think about what you believe.