What About The Palestinians ?

[other one]

5 hours ago, Renskedejonge said:

https://m.jpost.com/christianworld/article-780106

We can only pray and hope.

[warrior12]

Check out " Son Of Hamas" on youtube videos.    There you would hear it from the horses mouth.

[Neighbor]

6 hours ago, Slibhin said:

This may surprise you... Jews are human beings and not a hive mind like the borg.

Hi, Overall a nice and I presume thorough dissertation of your viewpoints. While I do think you have an errant understanding of  the viewpoint of some here, including myself, I do appreciate the detail you have included.

I find I have question of you! You say you believe or you follow or practice Torah; do you follow only the first five scrolls of what I call the Old Testament, or do you also accept the additional books of the old testament  as being from God? Example; do you accept or reject Zechariah?

And if you accept Zechariah as being the inspired word of God recorded accurately by scribes, do you see Israel as being a heavy stone today?

As I mentioned above somewhere ; Zechariah 12:3  "And it shall happen in that day that I will make Jerusalem a very heavy stone for all peoples; all who would heave it away will surely be cut in pieces, though all nations of the earth are gathered against it."

If you accept that  do you see it is possible that may be  happening right now, this day?

[warrior12]

7 hours ago, Marilyn C said:

Israel is helping those Arabs by getting rid of Hamas and its evil doctrine. The Arabs of Gaza have an opportunity to now spend the financial help on schools, better hospitals, food, farming etc and NOT on miles of tunnels for terrorism.

Wishful thinking is not the reality that is in the Islamic world.   They are trapped in their doctrine and it is forever so as it cannot be reformed or changed in anyway.  A deeper dive into their theology reveals much that was previously hidden or not exposed.  Now there are many who studies their books and scholars who have written about their main book and their prophet teachings, exposing their ideology.

Do you know the penalty if a muslim living in an Islamic state leave Islam ?.  Answer that question and you see why many who want to escape are trapped and have to endure great suffering or the worst if they want to live and explore free will. 

[Marilyn C]

3 minutes ago, warrior12 said:

Wishful thinking is not the reality that is in the Islamic world.   They are trapped in their doctrine and it is forever so as it cannot be reformed or changed in anyway.  A deeper dive into their theology reveals much that was previously hidden or not exposed.  Now there are many who studies their books and scholars who have written about their main book and their prophet teachings, exposing their ideology.

Do you know the penalty if a muslim living in an Islamic state leave Islam ?.  Answer that question and you see why many who want to escape are trapped and have to endure great suffering or the worst if they want to live and explore free will. 

So true. I merely said `The Arabs of Gaza have an opportunity...` I know as you do the awful consequences for those leaving Islam and that those caught up in that wicked religion is just torment.

[other one]

13 hours ago, Slibhin said:

Most Jews in Israel want peace with Palestine which includes their own statehood. Most Palestinians want the same thing.

Hamas does not want two states, they want Israel gone, period, and there lies the problem.  Palestinians have been offered two states as far back as Arafat and refused.

[Neighbor]

40 minutes ago, Slibhin said:

Since it seems you guys are unwilling to do this we are at an impass.

Is that so? You just made a lengthy presentation, an interesting one, but when asked about a small bit of it  your response is a defense of, I don't like the rules? Com'n you're tougher than that, you can go  into depth at will, and have.

If there is impasse is it not now unilaterially by you? Going to really run away if rules aren't bent even further for you?  You can do better, I know it. How about sharing if the entirety of the Old Testament is what you live by  or whether you are  more  Karaite like and only adhere to the Torah the first five scrolls/books? 

I ask not to blindside, but to find out  if you will, or can, discuss the portion of Zechariah I have twice now asked you about in  posts above.  Might you share about your understanding of that passage from Zechariah 12:3 and really on through about 14:2 ish?

[FJK]

14 hours ago, Slibhin said:

This may surprise you... Jews are human beings and not a hive mind like the borg. You got Orthodox Jews, like myself, and super liberal Jews like the reformed guys. I reject the reformed, conservative and messianics as Jews, but hey freedom of religion I always say. I'm sure they have strong opinions about me. We also have zionist Jews, anti-zionist Jews, and jews like me who don't give any religious significance to Israel whatsoever.

Hi Slibhin. I can't tell you how much I appreciate your reply.

We seem to think and see the world alike on so many things it amazes me, I almost never find anyone that actually thinks and views the world anywhere near the way I do. 

The criticisms you have of the Jews, the divisions within them, are almost exactly those I have of the Christian church and Christians in general, seems that both Jews and Christians are divided among themselves and fail to achieve what God intends for them because of it (not sure if you see the world in terms of God having a specific will for us, as nations and as individuals, or not).

As for the Messiah, don't let those who worship and look for a false Messiah, whether here or anywhere you run across them, influence your view of what he is to (genuine) Christians .  He is to us the same as he is to you, the bringer of peace, reconciliation with God and a return to being what God created us to be when he first formed and placed us in the Garden to start with.  The death and destruction he will bring is God removing the evil of this world and those who are given over to it along with it, much like God removed the world of Noah and its evil, or removed Sodom and Gomorrah from the world, in earlier days.  It will be a beginning of something better and the end of something evil in the only way it can be done.

Totally aside from this, and only slightly related to what has been discussed here, do you consider saying some thing negative about someone, or about yourself, to be a sin?  It is, after all, saying something negative about a creation of God and that is indirectly implying something negative about God himself.  Just a thought, a small piece of a much larger one.

May the Lord watch over you today and bring you fulfillment

 

[RdJ]

15 hours ago, Slibhin said:

This may surprise you... Jews are human beings and not a hive mind like the borg. You got Orthodox Jews, like myself, and super liberal Jews like the reformed guys. I reject the reformed, conservative and messianics as Jews, but hey freedom of religion I always say. I'm sure they have strong opinions about me. We also have zionist Jews, anti-zionist Jews, and jews like me who don't give any religious significance to Israel whatsoever.

Point being, we are people as well with multiple views and opinions. Some of the extreme elements, whom Netanyahu has aligned himself with, think they are entitled to anything they want and are quite bigoted. They wanted to jail Christians for trying to convert Jews... a law I and many of my kin strongly opposed by the way. These are the guys who have been arrested for throwing rocks and spitting at Christians and other Jews. They are hateful, religious bigots and I don't care what they think.

Most Jews in Israel want peace with Palestine which includes their own statehood. Most Palestinians want the same thing.

You see friend, once there is money and power to be had the worst people will be there to try and take it. There is a lot of money and power to be had in the status quo, for both sides, and as long as those evil men stay there this will never end. Netanyahu is a psychopath who wants to stay in power at any cost. In fact he tried to seize more by gutting the judiciary which causes massive protests and threats from the army to step down if he passed them. Hamas stole power by winning an "election" at the barrel of a gun.

Half of Palestine is under 18 and have never known anything else other then Hamas, because if anyone tries to speak out they get shot... because they're terrorists and that's what terrorists do. Netanyahu propped them up and didn't do anything because they served his interests and as long as they weren't bothering Israel he didn't care what they did to their own people.

The reason some Palestinians hate Israel so much is because of the apartheid conditions they live under. But also because Israel keeps bulldozing their homes for illegal settlements... and they are illegal under the international law they themselves agreed to abide by. The settlers have been known to do violence to Palestinians without consequences because they know the IDF and police will protect said settlers and take retribution on the Palestinians. This is not my opinions, this is a fact observed by countless people and world courts.

Hamas are a bunch of vicious murderers and antisemites who never should have been allowed to even take power... but once again we get back to the machinations of evil men. One of the reasons Israelis are so angry is because Netanyahu is directly responsible for Hamas being there in the first place.

I want both sides to make peace and I want hamas obliterated. I want Palestine to either get their own state or be integrated into Israel as full citizens with equal rights. They have been there for thousands of years in one form or another. It has a long history, sometimes part of Israel and sometimes not. Some people, the same kind who claim the holocaust never happened, like to engage in historical revisionism to claim Palestine isn't real or some other nonsense.

Do terrorists use Palestine as a staging ground for rocket attacks and other terrorism? Yes, absolutely. Would that happen if Israel did not create the conditions that gave rise to groups like hamas? Probably not. There will always be terrorists who just hate Jews and Israel, but we can't control the evil hearts of evil men. What we CAN do is not drink the same poison that they do. Some people, including on this forum, are no different then hamas. They certainly use the exact same rhetoric as hamas the nazis.

Hitler, in order to justify his views towards Jews tried to send them to other countries. Every one of them rejected us for the same reasons Egypt and neighbouring countries are not willing to take Palestinian refugees. The nazi's equated Jews with rats and vermin... people now equate Palestinians with rats and vermin. Scroll up and you can now see some think genocide is just fine and called for... just like the nazi's. Same solution, different demographic. How on earth am I supposed to reason with anyone who has the heart of a mass murderer? You don't. Their minds are so poisoned but their hatred that they have abandoned all humanity and certainly are far, far away from G-d.

The Messiah, as I have learned on this forum, is very different to Jews and Christians. We believe he is a bringer of peace to the world, Christians think he is a bringer of death and an instrument of their revenge. Sorry, I'll never believe in that Messiah because that totally contradicts every single prophecy and teaching on him.

Is that a more fleshed out answer for you? Do you understand my point of view as reasonable or are we at an impasse? 

The son of a Hamas leader became christian. He stands behind Israel but he does not want the Palestinians killed. Only Hamas. He thinks that once they get rid of them they can live in peace.

That is interesting. They dehumanize them. There's a prophecy from an old Norwegian christian woman from the 60s who said that Europe would be flooded with immigrants and people would begin to hate them and treat them like they treated the Jews before WWII and then the measure of our sins will be full.

I find it so weird that a Palestinian who lives peaceful in my country, if I treat him evil I sin against God, but say his brother still lives in Gaza oh you must be pro Israel and let them kill them all. I actually thought it was false propaganda and that they really try to only kill Hamas, but I Googled it yesterday and apparently Nethanyahu says stuff like they're Amalek and kill them all. 

I saw a video once of a Jewish guy in Israel who was trying to get peace by giving leaflets to Palestinians. Turns out a lot are descendents of Jewish people who wanted to keep living in Israel and were then forced to convert to Islam. They said in the search for lost tribes we forgot to look in our own backyard. They still have Jewish customs secretly.

 

 

 

[other one]

2 hours ago, Slibhin said:

I don't care about the opinions of genocide advocates. Even worse is I seem to be the only one here who is bothered by it. This thread makes me wonder what Christians say when the doors are closed and they're away from scrutiny.

Why are you here then?  Sounds like to put down Christians.  I'm not two faced Slibhin, I say the same things on either side of the door and no matter who's present.