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Concerning Jesus, He wasn't promoting eating unclean animals. The scribes were questioning Jesus' disciples about eating with ceremonially unwashed hands. If Jesus would have declared unclean animals were good to eat, the scribes would have had a legit complaint concerning the Law. Remember Peter's vision? Peter said he never ate anything unclean. So if the disciples were eating unclean food during the time the scribes were questioning Jesus, that would have been a lie. So Jesus didn't declare all animals were clean to eat. In the beginning, our food was the fruits and herbs of the field. Things produced out of the ground. When the perfect creation is restored, I imagine that will be our food again, to enjoy.

Hi @Excalibur Here on Worthy Christian Forums there is room for some degree of emotive discussion on a variety of topics, but as WilliamL has rightly pointed out, (unless quoting Scripture), it is necessary to address the validity of arguments based on their content without bias as to their exponents. There are several passages in the Bible that mention the Antichrist and indicate that the spirit of the Antichrist is already present in the world. Here are a few key verses: 1 John 2:18 – "Children, it is the last hour; and just as you have heard that the Antichrist is coming, even now many antichrists have appeared. This is how we know it is the last hour." 1 John 4:3 – "Every spirit that does not confess Jesus is not from God; this is the spirit of the Antichrist, which you have heard is coming and even now is already in the world." 2 John 1:7 – "For many deceivers have gone out into the world, those who do not acknowledge Jesus Christ as coming in the flesh. This is the deceiver and the Antichrist." These verses suggest that the Antichrist is not just a singular future figure but that there are many who embody the spirit of deception and opposition to Christ. The cumulative effect of this is depicted in Revelation 13, and foretold in 2 Thessalonians 2.

I think you are correct. Many years ago a fellowship I was part of practiced washing our feet as a way of remembering what I think is the meaning. The feet is a metaphor, so to speak for that which picks up dust from the earth as we walk and live in this fallen world that needs cleaning up. We can accomplish this by ministering to one another in fellowship. We know that we are 'clean' as Christ said and have His imputed 'Righteousness' and yet we are subject to worldly dust. There is much more that can be said about this.

I think seeing that sanctify is basically a setting aside for a Purpose--and in this context His Purpose--our sanctification begins when we are Born again into His Kingdom. We are set apart for Him and His Purpose. Our ongoing sanctification is evidenced by His working in us--"we are changed into His likeness from one degree of glory to another" We who are in Christ of the Father have been set aside from the rest of humanity--indeed from the old man Adam into the New Man--Christ. His Eternal Purpose is to have a People--but much more a Family after Kind. His Kind. This is an immutable principle established at Creation's beginning.

Amen! "We have this treasure in an earthen vessel". This is a remarkable thing to study on.

My opinion is that it's a multifaceted thing. As Hinds Feet pointed out the Pharisees were complaining about unwashed hands, which is where Jesus quoting Isaiah comes in. The last part of the quote mentions people are worshiping God in vain and that their rules are manmade. Throughout Jewish history there's been a gradually accumulated body of text held alongside the OT, consisting of the comments of various rabbis throughout history and their interpretations of scripture. So I believe that in part Jesus was referencing that and taking issue with these manmade interpretations and expoundings being placed on a level that was at or near the same level as the Bible as it existed at the time. Looking at the matter of clean and unclean in food we see God communicating to Peter in a dream that He could make the unclean clean and that He was extending His grace to the Gentiles, which must have seemed strange and revolutionary at the time. So I think we get an illustration of salvation in examining it as well.

I don't see it so much as "This guy was going to Hell so he's getting his rewards on earth" so much as an example of an idea expressed by Jesus: to whom much is given much is required. In the story it's pointed out that the man had been exposed to the Law, he just failed spectacularly at even trying to pay attention to it as evidenced by the condition and treatment of Lazarus. God certainly knew the rich man would end up like this, so why let him have good things at all? Even sinners get used by God. Beyond that it's difficult to say. We don't really get much context. But it does seem a reminder of both God's compassion toward the destitute and for the rich to remember the poor and that their wealth is a blessing from God.

The words let there be light begins the separation; where darkness becomes evil by default.

Lev. 10:10 You are to distinguish between the holy and the common, and between the unclean and the clean, Job 14:4 Who can bring a clean thing out of an unclean? There is not one. The concept of clean and unclean can be found throughout the Bible. In the N.T. it generally refers to people. 2Cor. 7:1 Since we have these promises, beloved, let us cleanse ourselves from every defilement of body and spirit, bringing holiness to completion in the fear of God. Our hope is in being cleansed by God Almighty in the twinkling of an eye at the last trumpet!

One cannot rightly comprehend the idea of clean and unclean, or the things that defile without first having a knowledge of the Holy. Holiness is established by sanctification, which is to be set apart for a Divine Purpose. qahdash [H6942] sanctify, hallow, dedicate, consecrate Genesis 2:3 Then God blessed the seventh day and sanctified it, because in it He rested from all His work which God had created and made. And then, after a cathartic moment in history after the Exodus from Egypt... Exodus 13: 1 Then the Lord spoke to Moses, saying, 2 “Consecrate to Me all the firstborn, whatever opens the womb among the children of Israel, both of man and beast; it is Mine.” How does something common become Holy? Exodus 3: 1 Now Moses was tending the flock of Jethro his father-in-law, the priest of Midian. And he led the flock to the back of the desert, and came to Horeb, the mountain of God. 2 And the Angel of the Lord appeared to him in a flame of fire from the midst of a bush. So he looked, and behold, the bush was burning with fire, but the bush was not consumed. 3 Then Moses said, “I will now turn aside and see this great sight, why the bush does not burn.” 4 So when the Lord saw that he turned aside to look, God called to him from the midst of the bush and said, “Moses, Moses!” And he said, “Here I am.” 5 Then He said, “Do not draw near this place. Take your sandals off your feet, for the place where you stand is holy ground.” 6 Moreover He said, “I am the God of your father—the God of Abraham, the God of Isaac, and the God of Jacob.” And Moses hid his face, for he was afraid to look upon God. This provides two things to consider, The Presence and The Voice. Without further Ado, let us move past all of the Levitical treatment of the topic, and move into the Incarnation of the Lord, and His Presence among men. John Thirteen: 2-5 And supper being ended, the devil having already put it into the heart of Judas Iscariot, Simon’s son, to betray Him, Jesus, knowing that the Father had given all things into His hands, and that He had come from God and was going to God, rose from supper and laid aside His garments, took a towel and girded Himself. After that, He poured water into a basin and began to wash the disciples’ feet, and to wipe them with the towel with which He was girded. To rightly comprehend clean and unclean in its application to Gospel Truth, begin here! So let's take a few to fully consider what took place the evening of the Last Supper. First, note that the Lord waited until after dinner before washing His Disciples feet. This might seem odd, but the reason is clearly stated, He waited until after the son of perdition is identified. 6-9 Then He came to Simon Peter. And Peter said to Him, “Lord, are You washing my feet?” Jesus answered and said to him, “What I am doing you do not understand now, but you will know after this.” Peter said to Him, “You shall never wash my feet!” Jesus answered him, “If I do not wash you, you have no part with Me.” 9-11 Simon Peter said to Him, “Lord, not my feet only, but also my hands and my head!” Jesus said to him, “He who is bathed needs only to wash his feet, but is completely clean; and you are clean, but not all of you.” For He knew who would betray Him; therefore He said, “You are not all clean.” Therefore, to move forward consider this question, "What does it mean to be made clean", particularly as it establishes a person as set apart, or Kodesh YHVH. John 15:3 You are already clean because of the word which I have spoken to you. Here is the necessary word study, which I leave for your consumption. katharos [G2513]=clean, pure https://www.blueletterbible.org/lexicon/g2513/kjv/tr/0-1/ Chew on that, and I will be back... Proverbs 9:10 The fear of the LORD is the beginning of wisdom: and the knowledge of the holy is understanding.

BURBANK, CA (Worthy Satire) – In a stunning press conference held next to a pride flag made entirely out of fired employee name tags, Disney CEO Bob Iger confirmed the entertainment giant’s fourth round of layoffs in the past year, touting the move as “a bold step toward financial ruin in the name of progress.” “Some companies stop at going woke,” Iger said, adjusting his Mickey Mouse ears. “But we at Disney are committed to going broke as well — all the way. By 2035, we fully intend to be bankrupt, morally validated, and potentially rebranded as a nonprofit empathy collective.” Industry analysts noted that TV ratings for Disney-owned networks have dropped faster than Snow White’s box office numbers, while revenue has plummeted like a lemming off a Pride Mountain float. Disney+ subscriptions are also in freefall, especially after the launch of its new all-genders musical reboot, Cis-ney’s Fantasia: The Reckoning. “It’s simple math,” said Disney’s Chief Inclusivity Officer, Taylor/Hunter/Leaf. “Fewer viewers means fewer dollars, which means more layoffs. Which means more room for gender-fluid squirrels to headline prime-time slots.” Despite the layoffs, Disney plans to hire more sensitivity coordinators than animators in 2026. The next live-action reboot will feature an all-nonbinary cast of The Avengers battling toxic masculinity with interpretive dance. “Our dream is that one day, no one will see our movies,” Iger said proudly. “And when we’ve lost every shareholder dollar, we’ll know we did the right thing.” Critics warn that this strategy could result in total collapse. “That’s the point,” responded one anonymous Imagineer. “If we don’t bankrupt ourselves for virtue, who will?” Worthy Satire is meant purely for comedic purposes—after all, as Proverbs reminds us, “Laughter is good medicine.” But behind every satire is a real story, video, or event. For the unspun version of the headline, be sure to check out the original source. [ Source of the Satire (Read More…) ] View the full article

This is an example of an ad hominem argument.

The historical record and scripture: The Roman Empire – [Julius Caesar] Daniel 2:32-33 & 40 Finally there will be a fourth kingdom, strong as iron, it will dominate all the others, but as its legs represent, this will be a divided kingdom – its people will be a mixture, it will not remain united. [The Western and Eastern Roman Empires] Daniel 7:7a & 23 The fourth beast, fearsome and very powerful with great iron teeth, crushed and devoured its victims, then trampled what was left. Daniel 9:26 After sixty two weeks, [434 years] the anointed Prince, [Jesus] will be removed and the army [of Rome] will destroy the city and the Temple. [As fulfilled in 70AD.] The Fourth Kingdom: A Last Days resurgence of Rome – [the rise of the 'beast'; the Anti Christ] Daniel 2:33 & 42-43...its feet of part iron and part clay.... Daniel 7:7b-8 ... the fourth beast had ten horns, another horn grew up and uprooted three of the ten. That other horn was very imposing and spoke with great power. As I watched this horn waged war on the holy ones and defeated them. Rev 17:12-13, Rev 13:5-8 Daniel 7:23-24 The explanation is this: This fourth kingdom will take over the whole earth, [The One World Government] The ten horns signify the ten divisions of the world, but another man will arise and defeat three of the first leaders. [ Revelation 13:1-4] Daniel 11:21 Another king will come, a person not worthy of recognition, but he will seize power by intrigue and cunning. [a clever and charismatic man] Daniel 8:23-25 In the last days, when sin is at its height, a powerful king and a master of strategy will arise. He will succeed in whatever he does and will take control of the nations and the holy people. [all the faithful Christians, gathered in all of the holy Land] By cunning and deceit, he will destroy many when they felt secure and did not expect it. He will challenge the ‘Prince of princes’, [the Lord] yet he will be defeated, but not by human hand. Daniel 9:27 The prince, [The world leader, descended from Rome] will make a treaty with many, [that is: not all of the Christians] for one week, [that is: seven years] but at the mid point, he will put a stop to the sacrifices and offerings. [in the new Temple] He will place an ‘abomination’ there, then in the end what has been decreed will come on him. Daniel 7:25 He will defy God and take control of the holy people for 3½ years. [This is the ‘beast’ of Revelation 13:1-8. The One World leader receives a ‘mortal blow’ and his body is taken over by Satan, commencing the ‘forty two months’ Tribulation period] Daniel 11:22-45 His army will be victorious and a leader of the Covenant people will be killed. The military forces of the South will be defeated and he will invade the Middle East, but ships of the Western nations will oppose him, so he will turn back. In the holy Land, he will vent his fury against the people who hold to the Covenant, but will show favour to those who forsake it by believing his promises. His soldiers will desecrate the Temple, setting up an ‘abomination of desolation’. Those of the Lord’s people [Christians] who remain faithful to the Lord, will be resolute and take action. Wise leaders of the nation will guide their people, though for a time some may be killed or captured. They will receive a little help, as many who join them are insincere. This is a period of testing, of refining and purification, for the end is yet to be; at the appointed time. Daniel 7:9, Daniel 8:22, Rev. 13:8 Daniel 11:36-45 This powerful world ruler will do as he pleases, he will promote himself as god, [2 Thess 2:4] uttering terrible blasphemies. Things will go well for him until the time of wrath is completed. [The Tribulation] Near the end, the leader of a Southern confederation will attempt to attack him, so he storms out in full force, sweeping all before him, including the holy Land. He will take control of all Arabia and take their treasure. Then, alarmed by rumours from the North and East, he will hurriedly go back to Israel and camp in the valley of Megiddo, where he will meet his end. [at Armageddon] Daniel 7:11, Revelation 19:17-21 Next: The Kingdom of Jesus – 2 Samuel 22

It doesn't, but it does say they exist during the 1000 year reign of Christ as Isa 2:1-4 says. But my 1000 year reign of Christ is your eternity. So the swords and spears would have to be in both, as we state our positions. In Christ Montana Marv

From their nest, the ground is a long way down.

Amen to all you said - and those Nee books are good! Lee, on the other hand . . . I spent years of discussion with various ones debating what was "baby" (to keep) and what was "dirty bath water" (to throw out) of his teachings and practices. I have generally chosen to move on from that laborious, ongoing debate. Now Sparks' writings I certainly do see as very good and always leading to a healthy focus of Christ in us.

John 15 "Abide in me, and I in you. As the branch cannot bear fruit by itself, unless it abides in the vine, neither can you, unless you abide in me" "I am the vine; you are the branches. Whoever abides in me and I in him, he it is that bears much fruit, for apart from me you can do nothing"

I guess I was following on from your use of the word 'disobedience'...

This also is to wash one another. Colossians 3:13 Forbearing one another, and forgiving one another, if any man have a quarrel against any: even as Christ forgave you, so also do ye.

To your last sentence we cannot say no.

Paul to the Romans speaks of 'obedience to the faith' and 'the obedience of faith'.

Lol sorry I thought you were reffering to something else with my first statement- my mistake.

Hard to think these verses somehow refer to heaven...........

Indeed, it is! Christ is our life, and He's in us to supply us with all we need! He, as the one unique Son of God, is now living and operating in us to transform us into His amazing image, and mature us fully into the many glorified sons of God! As a brother used to say, "Our future's so bright we hafta wear shades!"

Hi @Your closest friendnt "But thanks be to God, which giveth us the victory through our Lord Jesus Christ. 58 Therefore, my beloved brethren, be ye stedfast, unmoveable, always abounding in the work of the Lord, forasmuch as ye know that your labour is not in vain in the Lord." (1 Corinthians 15.57-58)

We can see two sides to this, first the surrender of our members, loving the Lord with all our soul(life) and all our strength(abilities) Romans 6:19 I speak in human terms because of the weakness of your flesh. For just as you presented your members as slaves of uncleanness, and of lawlessness leading to more lawlessness, so now present your members as slaves of righteousness for holiness. And even more importantly, the "hidden man" of the heart, and the Spirit of a renewed mind. "all your heart and all your mind" Matthew 5:8 Blessed are the pure [clean=katharos] in heart, For they shall see God. Let's add a bit more from the Last Supper discourse we began in the OP. John 13: 12-14 So when He had washed their feet, taken His garments, and sat down again, He said to them, Do you know what I have done to you? You call Me Teacher and Lord, and you say well, for so I am. If I then, your Lord and Teacher, have washed your feet, you also ought to wash one another’s feet. 15-17 For I have given you an example, that you should do as I have done to you. Most assuredly, I say to you, a servant is not greater than his master; nor is he who is sent greater than he who sent him. If you know these things, blessed are you if you do them. A significant part of our sanctification and duty to the Lord's Purpose is to minister to one another as equally relevant members of the Body of Christ.

@Alive @Ray12614 @PATrobas This morning I read this in the Supplied Life devotional, which spoke to this same topic. Our job is to just let this wonderful life and Person in us operate! The new covenant operating "Who also made us sufficient as ministers of the new covenant, not of the letter but of the Spirit; for the letter kills, but the Spirit gives life." 2 Corinthians 3:6 The new covenant is based on the divine operation of the Lord's life in us related to everything in our living. We are enjoying Him--His very life and nature, His soul-life with His thoughts. As we merge with Him, we find that our spontaneous reactions become just Himself. The fruit of the Spirit is love, joy, peace, and long-suffering. This is not something you are trying to be. It is something that has grown and manifested itself because you are dealing with the Spirit. Christ is operating and becoming the very content of the church in every member by our participation in His life--by eating His flesh, drinking His blood, staying before the tree of life. As we participate in Him, He operates. Apparently we are just common, ordinary people. Yet hidden within us is the divine life operating and the church becoming the expression of Christ Himself. This all happens by our participating in this Person.

Psalms 1:1-6 Blessed is the man who walks not in the counsel of the wicked, nor stands in the way of sinners, nor sits in the seat of scoffers; 2 but his delight is in the law of the LORD, and on his law he meditates day and night. 3 He is like a tree planted by streams of water that yields its fruit in its season, and its leaf does not wither. In all that he does, he prospers. 4 The wicked are not so, but are like chaff that the wind drives away. 5 Therefore the wicked will not stand in the judgment, nor sinners in the congregation of the righteous; 6 for the LORD knows the way of the righteous, but the way of the wicked will perish. Psalm 1 opens with a sobering warning about the quiet, deadly slide into sin. The man without God doesn’t become a scorner overnight — he drifts there gradually. First, he walks in ungodly counsel, entertaining worldly thoughts. Then, he stands in the path of sinners, embracing their way of life. Finally, he sits in the seat of the scornful, hardened in heart and mocking what is sacred. This progression — from a man without God to scorner — reveals how small compromises grow into full rebellion, dulling the conscience and deadening the soul. In contrast, the righteous man doesn’t merely avoid sin, rather he delights in His Word. God’s Word isn’t a burden to him, but a feast for his soul. It renews his mind, directs his steps, and transforms his desires. He doesn’t follow God out of duty, but out of joy. His obedience is not performance-based — it’s affection. He is like a tree, planted by rivers of water — strong, steady, and nourished by the Spirit. His roots go deep, and his fruit appears in season, feeding others and glorifying God. He is not shaken by droughts or storms, because his source is divine. His secret is not willpower, but the indwelling presence of the Lord. Like an artesian spring, the Holy Spirit flows from within — wisdom, love, joy, power. He doesn’t merely try to live like Yeshua (Jesus) — it’s deeper … he lives through Yeshua. The life of a believer is not just imitation, it’s impartation. It is Christ in us — the hope of glory. (Colossians 1:27) This man is truly blessed. Not because life is easy, but because God is with him. His prosperity is measured not in wealth, but in fruitfulness and eternal purpose. The Lord knows his way — approves of it, delights in it, and watches over it. While the wicked seem to flourish for a time, they are like chaff — weightless, rootless, and blown away. But the righteous man, grounded in truth and filled with grace, will stand forever. In the end, Psalm 1 is not just poetry — it’s a choice of lifestyles. We are either descending into sin or being deeply rooted in Him. One life ends in emptiness, the other in everlasting joy. And the secret is not striving harder, but receiving deeper. Yeshua alone can make you a fruitful tree by rivers of water — thriving now and flourishing forever. Blessed is the man whose roots run deep in Him. View the full article

But that can't be because when Jesus comes it will be with devouring fire and the whole earth is going to be consumed Zephaniah 1:18 KJV Neither their silver nor their gold shall be able to deliver them in the day of the LORD'S wrath; but the whole land shall be devoured by the fire of his jealousy: for he shall make even a speedy riddance of all them that dwell in the land. There isn't going to be any flesh laying around.

Stay there for while and see how it goes. Try to go to an after church get together and get to know folks.

Hard to answer a thats asking to explain something I never said. Honestly I go every so often as its familiar and I know people there to say hi. I get the best feeling at the other 2 but thats maybe because they sing the current songs and have great engaging pastors . Mormon church just has random members give talks and sing 200 year old songs won't judge but imo it makes it pretty boring . The other 2 are more fun, engaging, "alive".

May I suggest a couple of options. 1/ check out the Christianityexplored web site for churches in your area. Then after looking at them on line try visiting them. 2/ make a list of pros and cons for each church. Nearness to home, friendlyness, preaching is it systematic or just an endless appeals, involvement in evangelism and missionaries, ask minister how accountable the church is on finance and on legal issues. From this list is there any church that stands out. Ask each church leader why you should join that church. From the answers etc pray about which church you should join.

not back yet still only one chick but mum and /or dad appear to be in the nest more often maybe to keep an eye out and keep the other chick company ?

Hi @Your closest friendnt. Since today the most conservative of ppl may become quite naturally the clients of tattoo parlors, I guess you can see why many Christians do seem to accept that becoming clients also and being thereafter a tattooed Christian man / Christian woman with Bible ref.s - etc. - inked in can be a rather wholesome experience, right? Interesting you use the words nourishing and empowering. ........................................ I am a nurse in a cardiac ICU. I am also pretty heavily tattooed. I am a well educated, well rounded nurse, and was raised with strong morals and manners. .. I am an extremely traditional person. I've always worn long sleeves ..a professional persona as well as a unique one while I'm not working julieannenw allnurses dot com ....................................

Paul spoke of the Gospel of Jesus Christ that invites anyone to Believe in Jesus Christ that Jesus Christ died for the forgiveness of their sins. The Covenant of Cirumcision is done on boys at eight days old. Just think about that.

Paul to the Romans speaks of 'the obedience of faith' and 'obedience to the faith'.

PS: @Anne2 I see now that you did quote that verse recently that I just posted. (I do think that there will be a literal earthly kingdom also.)

That Above Has No relevance Whatsoever Posting scripture with claims made has direct relevance Jesus Is The Lord

I'll definitely admit it is an area I would like to study more. I have no doubt that when we see Jesus it will be the start of eternity future.

I have nothing to add to my brother's excellent words in this topic. I have isolated the above passage to emphasize the spiritual reality of the Lord's beloved and why He is pleased to display His power in us, His Body. Why? First, so that His name shall be glorified upon this earth. Those who witness the power of the Lord know that it is He, and no other, who does what men deem impossible. Second, it is so that His Body will be strengthened, edified, and equipped to walk in our eternal purpose in Christ. We do so by walking in the Spirit upon this earth. The Spirit of the Lord is always with us --- and we are always with Him --- for we are His temple. Third, it is to make a mockery of the mighty upon their thrones of power in the high places. The spiritual powers of wickedness, those princes who will die like men, gloat upon their thrones in the heart of their dark principalities. These same princes influence the nations of man, having weakened them from days of old, and it is the honor of His holy ones to judge them all. There is no artificial partition separating the saints of God throughout time and space. There is only one true Vine --- Christ (John 15:1) --- and there is no Jew nor stranger in Him. In Him, we are one. (Galatians 3:28). Our revealing is the fourth purpose of the Lord for us all (Romans 8:19). As for the nations? They are deceived.

I think it’s been said many times and is not any new revelation. Fruit is the very natural and unforced result of Christ’s working in us. It’s our practical sanctification. When He touches something in us that is not of Himself, we agree with Him and turn from it. Thereby we are changing from one degree of Glory to another. We decrease and He increases. This is Normal for a son.

46 years

The garden scenario sets a pattern that can be seen in multiple forms throughout scripture ... that is relative to the process happening in us. God starts out with one and all things are gathered again into one. Clean and unclean are just another picture of the dialectic process that began with the words let there be light.

These may encourage you. "Thy word have I hid in mine heart, that I might not sin against thee" Psalm 119:12 "Thy word is a lamp unto my feet, and a light unto my path" Psalm 119:105 Thanks Hadedami... (It works! ^^^^^^^)..

I like this list from Albert Barnes' Commentary on what is to be learned from Luke 16:19-31 1. That the souls of people do not die with their bodies. 2. That the soul is “conscious” after death; that it does not “sleep,” as some have supposed, until the morning of the resurrection. 3. That the righteous are taken to a place of happiness immediately at death, and the wicked consigned at once to misery. 4. That wealth does not secure from death. 5. We should not envy the condition of the rich. 6. We should strive for a better inheritance than can be possessed in this life. 7. The sufferings of the wicked in hell will be indescribably great. Think what is represented by “torment;” by burning flame; by insupportable thirst; by that state where a single “drop” of water would afford relief. Remember that “all this” is but a representation of the pains of the damned, and that this will have no intermission day or night, but will continue from year to year, and age to age, without any end, and you have a faint view of the sufferings of those who are in hell. 8. There is a place of sufferings beyond the grave a hell. If there is not, then this parable has no meaning. It is impossible to make “anything” of it unless it be designed to teach that. 9. There will never be any escape from those gloomy regions. There is a gulf fixed - “fixed,” not movable. Nor can any of the damned beat a pathway across this gulf to the world of holiness. 10. We see the amazing folly of those who suppose there may be an “end” to the sufferings of the wicked, and who, on that supposition, seem willing to go down to hell to suffer a long time, rather than go at once to heaven. If man were to suffer but a thousand years, or even “one” year, why should he be so foolish as to choose that suffering rather than go at once to heaven, and be happy at once when he dies? 11. God gives us sufficient warning to prepare for death. He has sent his Word, his servants, his Son; he warns us by his Spirit and his providence; by the entreaties of our friends and by the death of sinners; he offers us heaven, and he threatens hell. If all this will not move sinners, what would do it? There is nothing that would. 12. God will give us nothing farther to warn us. No dead man will come to life to tell us of what he has seen. If he did we would not believe him. Religion appeals to man not by ghosts and frightful apparitions. It appeals to their reason, their conscience, their hopes, their fears. It sets life and death soberly before people, and if they “will not” choose the former, they must die. If you will not hear the Son of God and the warnings of the Scriptures, there is nothing which you will or can hear. You will never be persuaded, and will never escape the place of torment.

The tendency to embrace the concept of God being an angry Father is done in equal proportion to a person's inability to demonstrate His power. There is a connection between our belief system and what actually flows through us. If we don't see Jesus' life as the ultimate illustration of the will of God, we will continually undermine our ability to display it. The Holy Spirit always wants to demonstrate what God says. God confirmed the word with signs following (Mark 16:20). In Hebrews 2:3-4 it says, "How shall we escape, if we neglect so great salvation; which at the first began to be spoken by the Lord, and was confirmed unto us by them that heard him; God also bearing them witness, both with signs and wonders, and with divers miracles, and gifts of the Holy Ghost, according to his own will?" Having come to understand our Christ identity, we know for sure that God wants to do signs and wonders and confirm His own word because scripture says so. Some Christians think is it so spiritual to say, "I don't need signs and wonders." Jesus actually relied on signs and wonders and manifestations. He went out of the way to make sure the Holy Spirit had an occasion to demonstrate the words He spoke. Jesus said, "I am the bread of life" (John 6:35) and fed the 5,000. He said, "I am the resurrection and the life" (John 11:25) and He raised the dead. He said, "I am the light of the world" (John 8:12) and He opened the eyes of the blind. God always wants to do what He says. The Apostle Paul said, "And my speech and my preaching were not with persuasive words of human wisdom, but in demonstration of the Spirit and of power" (1 Corinthians 2:4). The indwelling Holy Spirit enables us to bear more of the revelation of Jesus than was possible for the original twelve disciples. GOD IS TALKING -- TAKE NOTE AND LISTEN One of the essential gestures of faith is to live with the expectation that the God who said that His sheep hear His voice and who gave His life to restore relationship with each of us would like to communicate with us. This faith leads us to lean into His voice. "Speak Lord, for your servant is listening." - 1 Samuel 3:9 The heart of abiding faith "leans into God," anticipating His voice, looking for our next assignment with regards to our Christ calling manifesting in bruinging forth the Great Commission. Like Jesus, we are to be able to say, "My food is to do the will of Him who sent me." (John 4:34) God talks to us in various ways. He talks through the Bible which contains the Word of God, and He talks to us through the Holy Spirit who brings us life. The Holy Spirit was given the task of not simply revealing all that Jesus possesses, but to actually "disclose" it to us. Every declared promise is a transfer of heavenly resources that enable us to fulfill the purpose of God for our life. THE SPIRIT OF PROPHECY "The testimony of Jesus is the spirit of prophecy." (Rev. 19:10) - This says that if God has done it once, He is ready to do it again. The spoken or written record of whatever Jesus has done carries the prophetic anointing to cause a change in events in the spirit realm so that the miracle spoken of can happen again. Meditating on the promises of God is something we can do in order to determine where we're going in life. When we DECLARE the Word over our own life and prophesy our own DESTINY in agreement with Him, we release the anointing of the Spirit in a greater measure to bring the Word to pass. "…you shall meditate on it day and night….for then you will make your way prosperous, and then you will have good success." - Joshua 1: ALBERT FINCH MINISTRY Statement Of Faith https://www.nf127.org/statement-of-faith Ministry Phone: 281-396-4379

Oh I am so glad you brought this up. One thing I noticed both shared a name. Ge 48:16 The Angel which redeemed me from all evil, bless the lads; and let my name be named on them, This name Israel and the name of my fathers Abraham and Isaac; These also seem in this verse to share the same name on them: Israel? Israel is also variously called ,,,Sons of Jacob, Sons of Israel, children of promise Sons of Jacob are heirs, Sons of Israel is, the firstborn, children of promise to Abraham and let them grow into a multitude in the midst of the earth. 1Ch 5:1 Now the sons of Reuben the firstborn of Israel, (for he was the firstborn; but, forasmuch as he defiled his father’s bed, his birthright was given unto the sons of Joseph the son of Israel: and the genealogy is not to be reckoned after the birthright. 1Ch 5:2 For Judah prevailed above his brethren, and of him came the chief ruler; but the birthright was Joseph’s:) Rom 9:6 Not as though the word of God hath taken none effect. For they are not all Israel, which are of Israel: 7 Neither, because they are the seed of Abraham, are they all children: but, In Isaac shall thy seed be called. 8 That is, They which are the children of the flesh, these are not the children of God: but the children of the promise are counted for the seed.

Hi @Mario Gallegos What studies have been done to substantiate this being something "the majority of baby Christians do"?. Your statement touches on an interesting theological and philosophical point—how personal revelations can evolve into structured doctrines and, eventually, organized religions. In terms of logical fallacies, the statement could be examined for generalizations. Here are a couple of possible concerns: Hasty Generalization – The phrase "the majority of baby Christians" assumes that this pattern is widespread without providing specific evidence. While it may happen, it doesn't necessarily apply to everyone. Causal Fallacy – The claim suggests a direct cause-and-effect relationship: revelation leads to doctrine, which leads to religion. While these elements can be connected, the process is often more complex, with cultural, historical, and interpretive factors influencing religious development.