question that has been preventing me from investigating Christianity f

[gdemoss]

Greetings Alex!

You asked why you are held accountable for something someone else did. I am held accountable because I was in Adams loins when he sinned. I was then born into this world after his fallen image which means I require a savior to restore me unto God. I was already created and present inside my father Adam when he sinned and I fell right along with him. I would have eaten of the fruit if it were I who had been there just like anyone else.

You asked why angels don't suffer from Satans fall. The angels were not in Satan when he sinned but rather had there own separate existence. Those who have followed his lead will suffer the same consequence.

Our problem is our opinion. Our opinion is that which is referred to as the eyes of the understanding that were opened in Genesis as a result of Adams disobedience. The very fact that man has the ability to judge God unrighteous for his own perdicament is his folly.

God is for you not against you. All you need to do is receive the truth.

[Cog]

Woo I need to proof read. iniquity of the father, not inequity*, sorry And to follow up, if your question is then: Why do we have original sin (iniquity of the father), I think it is to show us that we are all in one body together and what goes around comes around. You know the use of scapegoats and doing unto the least of them, etc. That is my understanding of the lesson of iniquity, anyways.

[john14:6]

Alex,

The angels had a choice to follow satan or to remain with God. Those who chose to follow satan chose to rebel, sin, against God. Those angels who did not rebel against God did not sin.

Can you honestly say that you have never sinned?

John

Edited July 14, 2014 by john14:6

[ayin jade]

 

 

I don't think anyone has been able to answer this part yet:

 

Why did other angels not have to share punishment for what Satan did? But yet, I am supposed to accept the punishment for what Adam/Eve did? How does this make any sense?

 

Angels are responsible for their sins or lack of sin. 

 

Just like you are condemned for your sins and only your sins. Not your father's sins. Not adam's sins. Yours. 

 

You are accepting the punishment for your sins alone. Unless you turn to Jesus. Then He bears the burden of your sins. 

 

Fallen angels do not have the option of getting saved by Jesus. You are ahead of things there.

 

I am not condemned for only my sins. It is obvious that Adam and Eve's sins are very condemning to the entire human race. Now everyone has to restore their relationship with God or they will go to hell. If Adam and Eve hadn't sinned, their wouldn't have to be any relationship to restore or any reconciliation to happen. Their sins seems pretty condemning to me.

 

 

Seems clear to me 

 

John 8

24 Therefore I said to you that you shall die in your sins, for if you do not believe that I AM, you shall die in your sins.

[Paradox]

God approves and accepts who you are otherwise you would not be alive. If you like this and accept it you will live with Him forever. This does not mean that the child who never sees the sun is rejected, far from it, what is the resurrection for anyway, if not to bring back lost lives small and great?

 

And you are not lost or condemned because you have doubts and questions either. God has infused this temporary life with millions of good things which come your way every day. So that if you exercise an ounce of faith, you are on the path to victory over every weak thought. This will take some discipline. Hebrews 12.

 

The life you have, the healing that goes on, the heartbeat, the emotional comforts in life, are there for you by Jesus Christ the representative of humanity to God. He brings them to you, because He purchased your sins before you committed them.

 

You are not condemned because you were born into a dis-functional world. and you are not guilty of anyone else's sin. You can only be guilty if you insist on having sin put back onto your record in heaven.

 

"Whatsoever is not of faith is sin"  "Without faith it is impossible to please" God.

 

Why do we suffer dis-functions from the actions of Adam?

Real cause and effect. God lives with it and will not manipulate circumstances, otherwise nature becomes contrived or a lie. God can work with results and be completely victorious, so can you by faith in Him.

[other one]

 

Alex, that is a really fundamental question that  a lot of people ask.

 

One thing to keep in consideration is that Paul tells us that the saints (saved people) will judge the Angels...    I don't know for sure when God made that decision, but it seems to me that it would have been from the beginning.    

 

You say that you think that humans were supposed to be some perfect things and live forever, but I would disagree.  God made us totally incapable of judging anything for we didn't even know good from evil (right from wrong) and knowing that we would judge the angels I find it rather impossible to think that he didn't know Adam would eat of the fruit and looks like it was his goal all along.....    It was Satan himself that introduced the ability to be judges.

 

While you didn't have a choice in their decision, you did inherit the result of it, for we are all born with an inborn knowledge of what is right and wrong..   Some people pay attention to it and others don't.    Remember that Adam and Eve ran around naked before they ate of the fruit and realized it was wrong to do so after they ate.....     it wasn't that Adam and Eve were perfect, it was that they really didn't know any better.....   and you do.

 

So, the real difference is that people today really do know when they are doing something not right, but some get to the point that they really don't care enough to even think about it.

 

You are going to spend eternity somewhere and it's your choice where you spend it.   Jesus came here and made a way for you to be with him throughout eternity if you choose to do so.   It's really not difficult to do.

 

As for punishment for choosing not to.......     well all I can say is that you have been informed before hand and if you choose to go to hell,, it is.....   well your choice.

 

I like your response but you did not completely respond to my 2nd paragraph at all. So I have bolded it for everyone since it is not being commented on much.

 

I thought I did.

 

 

From what I understand, God originally planned humanity to be perfect and to live with him in harmony forever. How was the life God destined for me and you altered because of a careless decision someone else made? Romans 3:23 says because one man sinned we all fall short of the glory of God. When Satan/Luficer/The Devil sinned did all angels fall short of the glory of God as well? That isn't the case. So why is it humans are the only part of creation that this weird concept seems to apply to? Why did other angels not have to share punishment for what Satan did? But yet, I am supposed to accept the punishment for what Adam/Eve did? How does this make any sense?

 

God never planned for humanity to be perfect in this life......   Adam and Eve were not perfect even before they ate of the fruit....   it was just that they didn't know any better.    They ran around naked before they ate of the fruit but didn't know it was wrong......   remember that God never told them that they were wrong in not being covered......   they discovered it themselves.

 

And you are not being punished for their sins, but your own...   It is because of their eating of the fruit that the knowledge of good and evil was passed down to the rest of us....    but heaven or hell is simply your choice; it's as simple as that.  and even if you don't think it's fair.....   it's reality.

[alexhasquestions]

Greetings Alex!

You asked why you are held accountable for something someone else did. I am held accountable because I was in Adams loins when he sinned. I was then born into this world after his fallen image which means I require a savior to restore me unto God. I was already created and present inside my father Adam when he sinned and I fell right along with him. I would have eaten of the fruit if it were I who had been there just like anyone else.

You asked why angels don't suffer from Satans fall. The angels were not in Satan when he sinned but rather had there own separate existence. Those who have followed his lead will suffer the same consequence.

Our problem is our opinion. Our opinion is that which is referred to as the eyes of the understanding that were opened in Genesis as a result of Adams disobedience. The very fact that man has the ability to judge God unrighteous for his own perdicament is his folly.

God is for you not against you. All you need to do is receive the truth.

So the reason why I owe reconciliation to God right now is because I was in the loins of another man who sinned. That was what changed the destiny God had planned for me?

 

Silly. I will never be able to understand how you all can justify why your held accountable for something as ridiculous as that. 

[enoob57]

Hello Christian Forums,

 

The question on my mind has been bothering me for a while now. It puts me into a very confused and angry state anytime I try thinking about it. I would appreciate as many replies and thoughts on this as possible.

 

MY QUESTION:

How was I born into this crooked and corrupt life apart from my creator? Whenever I ask myself this question I am directed to Romans 5:12. This verse takes me to the story of the first two  humans in existence. I realize their stupidity, but why should their decision affect me in any way? Was I consulted before they picked a fruit off a tree? Was I secretly involved in their defiance and disobedience? How in the world am I supposed to accept the punishment for a decision that was not mine to make? How did you and I get tangled up in this mess to begin with?

 

From what I understand, God originally planned humanity to be perfect and to live with him in harmony forever. How was the life God destined for me and you altered because of a careless decision someone else made? Romans 3:23 says because one man sinned we all fall short of the glory of God. When Satan/Luficer/The Devil sinned did all angels fall short of the glory of God as well? That isn't the case. So why is it humans are the only part of creation that this weird concept seems to apply to? Why did other angels not have to share punishment for what Satan did? But yet, I am supposed to accept the punishment for what Adam/Eve did? How does this make any sense?

 

So why is it I'm sitting here now, in this incomplete state, where I have to reconcile with my creator before the end of my life or else I will be in eternal damnation? Why couldn't I live the blissful and worry-free life God intended for me to have? 

 

Thanks,

Alex

The problem with your understanding is that you judge yourself worthy to contemplate God's

righteous justice.... Here is what I mean when our greatest grandparents sinned they infected

us with the leaven of sin in their genetics >BUT< in this reason also is that we all- yes we all

were given a time from childhood where we knew we shouldn't do something but because we wanted

the pleasure or reward from that disobedience we did it! Showing our same actions as that of

our grandparents. Love must have the same freedom as the One Who is love and in that freedom

we love God because He first loved us. Love, Steven

[enoob57]

There is one other aspect to reason- if God had held only Adam and Eve accountable in their sin

then they would have had no children and we wouldn't be here discussing this... for nothing holy

can be born out from unholiness! love, Steven

[Diatheosis]

We live in a world of choosing and consequences. Our choices affect other people as well, Adam and Eve were no exception. The entity we know as Satan established and confirmed the saying ' the pride doth go before the Fall', and quite literally. It was a strategic move, but nothing God could not have anticipated in the long run.

 

As a result we do have a world where one gets to experience misery among other things. The other side of the equation is, that even we get to drink the cup of sin and rebellion before God to the fullest many a time, the greater is our appreciation of His grace. Who has been forgiven much, loves much as well. Thus our understanding and love for God is totally on a different level, once you are saved, experience the amazing gift of salvation, God will never again be something self-evident.

 

In addition, God can show why Satan's nonsense about Him does not hold water. Sometimes, you will get the best results with time and patience. From our point of view, the front seats in this cosmic court case get sometimes drenched as well. But interestingly, I've come to realize, by becoming broken in many ways, it is far easier to sympathize with God, so to speak.

 

See what the Creator Son went through on this planet, follow His example and rejoice for He not only showed us the way; He is the Way, the Truth, and the Life. What He was ready to suffer, the price of all of our sins, that is, proves God is with us in our suffering.

 

In the end, we cannot understand God's reasoning, only trust He does what is best for us, considering we keep ourselves close to Him, for very seldom does He force His will upon us.

 

We, who have been taught we can understand things and reason out problems by logic. But here the limits are clear. Most of the times we even do things we know are not logical. The only real lasting solution for the split situation we are in, is the Peace we receive in Christ. Not as a religious concept, but alive experience.

 

God bless.