Which day is the Sabbath and is it still valid today?

[Qnts2]

Is the Noahide covenant Biblical or Kabbalistic

 

The Noachide covenant is biblical. There were actually two covenants. The better known one was made with all living creatures and people, which is that God will not destroy the earth with a flood again.

 

The one I am referring to is the list of commands that God gave Noah.

 

Genesis 9:1

9 So God blessed Noah and his sons, and said to them: “Be fruitful and multiply, and fill the earth.^[a]2 And the fear of you and the dread of you shall be on every beast of the earth, on every bird of the air, on all that move on the earth, and on all the fish of the sea. They are given into your hand. ³ Every moving thing that lives shall be food for you. I have given you all things, even as the green herbs. ⁴ But you shall not eat flesh with its life, that is, its blood. ⁵ Surely for your lifeblood I will demand a reckoning; from the hand of every beast I will require it, and from the hand of man. From the hand of every man’s brother I will require the life of man.

⁶ “Whoever sheds man’s blood,

By man his blood shall be shed;

For in the image of God

He made man.

⁷ And as for you, be fruitful and multiply;

Bring forth abundantly in the earth

And multiply in it.”

 

From Judaism, the Rabbis studied the laws through out the OT. They list 7 laws for the Noachide covenant in the Talmud but their list includes laws implied or given prior to Noah. Some question the Rabbinical 7 laws of Noah from the Talmud. But, even without that entering the discussion, Noah is the father of all people so whatever laws were given to him, and his children would apply to all Gentiles. Unless they are Christians. Not that the laws given to Noah are absent from the New Covenant as we know the New Covenant does not allow murder, but the New Covenant includes other laws, and better blessings including the promise of salvation which is missing from the commands and blessing given to Noah.  

 

When Jesus lived on the earth, He kept all of the law from all of the convenants perfectly. He even went thru temptations from Satan, like Adam and Eve and did not fail. Therefore, Jesus fulfilled all mans broken covenants, paying the price for sin,  in order to make available and offer the New Covenant.

 

Adding the seven laws of Noah as defined by the Rabbis:

1) to establish courts of justice;

2) not to commit blasphemy;

3) not to commit idolatry;

4) not to commit incest and adultery;

5) not to commit bloodshed;

6) not to commit robbery; and

7) not to eat flesh cut from a living animal

[other one]

I hope you know that Rabbi's teach things out of the Kabbalah (basically Babylonian and Egyptian Mysticism).

 

I don't personally consider Rabbinical teachings as necessarily being Biblical teachings.   I certainly do not consider Jewish Mysticism as something we should go along with.

 

That's why I asked if those laws themselves were from the Bible...  

[Qnts2]

I hope you know that Rabbi's teach things out of the Kabbalah (basically Babylonian and Egyptian Mysticism).

 

I don't personally consider Rabbinical teachings as necessarily being Biblical teachings.   I certainly do not consider Jewish Mysticism as something we should go along with.

 

That's why I asked if those laws themselves were from the Bible...  

 

The laws of Noah are not out of the Kabbalah. They are listed in the Talmud. Those are two entirely different sets of books.  

 

The Talmud does have some things which are similar to the Kabbalah but most of the Talmud has nothing to do with the Kabbalah. Most of the Talmud contains Rabbinical discussions/debates on scripture and how to interpret what was said and how to keep the Mosaic law. There are discussions on the Noachide laws to understand what applied to Gentiles.  

 

The Kabbalah is studied by the ultra-orthodox and by some orthodox. I grew up in a synagogue and family which rejected the Kabbalah. I later started reading the Kabbalah (prior to knowing Jesus) and found that I agreed with my family and also rejected it. It reads more like a mix of Judaism and far east religions.  

[Qnts2]

Just for reference, from Rabbinical Judaism.

 

Babylonian Talmud

Sanhedrin 56a

 

Our Rabbis taught: seven precepts were the sons of Noah commanded: social laws; to refrain from blasphemy, idolatry; adultery; bloodshed; robbery; and eating flesh cut from a living animal

 

While laws were definitely given to Noah, I have searched to find these seven laws. Some are very clearly in scripture, and some can come from implication.  But, I have not yet figured out the 'social laws/court system' and where they got that.  

[Guest shiloh357]

Just for reference, from Rabbinical Judaism.

 

Babylonian Talmud

Sanhedrin 56a

 

 and eating flesh cut from a living animal

 

 

Kinda makes you wonder what was going on back then....

[Guest Judas Machabeus]

I've always been taught the sabbath is Saturday but we celebrate the Lords day which is the day he rose from the dead. Which would be Sunday.

[Macs Son]

Hi Pat you say they were observing The Sabbaths. I see it a little different. The Jews always gathered on the sabbath as was their custom to read and hear the Law of Moses. The Apostles were not there on the Sabbath to keep the Sabbath they were there on the Sabbaths preaching against Moses Law so in the preaching against Moses Law they were not observing the Sabbaths as some think.

Acts 21: 21, 25

21And they are informed of thee, that thou teachest all the Jews which are among the Gentiles to forsake Moses, saying that they ought not to circumcise their children, neither to walk after the customs.

25 As touching the Gentiles which believe, we have written and concluded that they observe no such thing, save only that they keep themselves from things offered to idols, and from blood, and from strangled, and from fornication.

Hi Coheir,

I'm just catching up here. Yes, I believe the Jews had both the commandments and ordinances; the ordinances being observing the Day of Atonement, the Passover, circumcising on the 8th day, etc. The ordinances and customs merely foreshadowed Christ and Paul taught that as well, as I posted this passage before.

Colossians 2:16

So let no one judge you in food or in drink, or regarding a festival or a new moon or sabbaths, which are a shadow of things to come, but the substance is of Christ.

So the things that pointed to Christ are done away with; Christ rose on the 8th day in triumphant resurrection first fruits of the newness of body we too shall inherit when He comes to raise us; the atonement was paid on His cross; We have passed over from death to life - the curse has turned to blessing; all these ordinaces, two of which were Sabbaths are no longer needed. Now the Lord proclaimed that the Day of Atonement, which was only a foreshadowing to Christ, was forever.

Leviticus 16:31

“It is a sabbath of solemn rest for you, and you shall afflict your souls. It is a statute forever.

But we as Christians remember this day as the Lord's Crucifixion - Good Friday whereas the Jews observe the foreshadowing of Christ in Yom Kippur.

The difference in Sabbath vs. Sabbaths is that the first Sabbath in the ten commandments was not a foreshadowing of Christ but a reminder of when the Lord rested from creation. The commandments; Thou shall not take the Lord thy God's Name in vain, honor thy father and mother, do not commit adultery, do not steal, do not murder I simply do not believe were ever done away with but that God wrote them in our heart.

Jeremiah 31:31-33 "Behold, the days are coming, says the LORD, when I will make a new covenant with the house of Israel and with the house of Judah— not according to the covenant that I made with their fathers in the day that I took them by the hand to lead them out of the land of Egypt, My covenant which they broke, though I was a husband to them, says the LORD. But this is the covenant that I will make with the house of Israel after those days, says the LORD: I will put My law in their minds, and write it on their hearts; and I will be their God, and they shall be My people.

Now Matthew Henry writes of this

... for Christ came not to destroy the law, but to fulfil it; but the law shall be written in their hearts by the finger of the Spirit as formerly it was written in the tables of stone. God writes his law in the hearts of all believers, makes it ready and familiar to them, at hand when they have occasion to use it, as that which is written in the heart, Prov. 3:3. He makes them in care to observe it, for that which we are solicitous about is said to lie near our hearts. He works in them a disposition to obedience, a conformity of thought and affection to the rules of the divine law, as that of the copy to the original. This is here promised, and ought to be prayed for, that our duty may be done conscientiously and with delight

Jesus also said:

Matthew 5:17-19

“Do not think that I came to destroy the Law or the Prophets. I did not come to destroy but to fulfill. “For assuredly, I say to you, till heaven and earth pass away, one jot or one tittle will by no means pass from the law till all is fulfilled. “Whoever therefore breaks one of the least of these commandments, and teaches men so, shall be called least in the kingdom of heaven; but whoever does and teaches them, he shall be called great in the kingdom of heaven.

And John

1John 2:6

He who says he abides in Him ought himself also to walk just as He walked.

1John 1:7

But if we walk in the light as He is in the light, we have fellowship with one another, and the blood of Jesus Christ His Son cleanses us from all sin.

So I think the crux of this really comes down to is this:

Is the commandment to keep the Sabbath the only commandment to be excluded from the ten commandments, so that we only have 9?

That to me is a very big question and one that I believe we need to totally understand in the light of Scripture.

May God Bless, Pat

[Guest shiloh357]

The difference in Sabbath vs. Sabbaths is that the first Sabbath in the ten commandments was not a foreshadowing of Christ but a reminder of when the Lord rested from creation. The commandments; Thou shall not take the Lord thy God's Name in vain, honor thy father and mother, do not commit adultery, do not steal, do not murder I simply do not believe were ever done away with but that God wrote them in our heart.

 

That is a false dichotomy.   The Sabbath as stated in the ten commandments is the same Sabbath mentioned in Exodus 31:13-17. The Sabbath day is mentioned in different contexts.   It is a sign between the children of Israel and God.  It is unique among the ten commandments in that way.  The Sabbath is a sign between the children of Israel under the Mosaic Covenant.

 

There are special annual Sabbaths, but all of them point to Jesus in one fashion or another, just like the Sabbath day in the ten commandments.  It shows that you really haven't studied out the significance of the Sabbath day if you can't accept that it foreshadows Jesus.

 

The Sabbath day belongs to the Old Testament economy and pertains to God's relationship with Israel, for ever.  For that reason, it is not problematic for us as Christians to see only nine of the ten commandments as applicable to the Church.   It isn't a question of it being done away with.  It's just that it isn't a part of the NT economy.

 

You are free to keep the Sabbath day if you wish, but you have no business and no right to tell other believers that Sabbath day observance is compulsory upon them.   All genuine followers of Jesus should reject that aspect your claims out of hand.

[tff]

 

There are many arguments about which day is the Sabbath day and whether it is still valid or not today. Any opinions? I use the Bible KJV and only texts from the Bible must be provided please to prove your point.

Tff, please forgive me for misquoting you. You said that we can be deceived by satan if we do not keep the 10 commandments, especially the Sabbath. I disagree with this, but we do need to walk in obedience to His Spirit, and His voice always agrees with Scripture.

When we are born again we receive the commandments written on our hearts. It is our desire to please God, and He has shown us some examples how to do this in the 10 commandments. Romans 8 also tells us how to do this by setting our minds on Christ and walking in the Spirit.

1 John 3:23 And this is His commandment: that we should believe on the name of His Son Jesus Christ and love one another, as He gave us commandment..

It still concerns me that you do not believe that Jesus on earth was no longer God while in human flesh. You say that He was only a man. Christians believe that He was fully and perfectly both God and man. Perhaps after you become more familiar with all of the Bible, you will also come to understand this.

Matt. 14:33 Then those who were in the boat came and WORSHIPPED Him, saying "Truly You are the Son of God".

Matthew 2:11 And when they hd come into the house, they saw the young cchild with Mary His mother, and fell down and WORSHIPPED Him.

Jesus allowed people to worship Him while he was a man on earth, showing that He was God while on earth as both God and Man.

In the book of John, every time He claimed to be God the Jews would try to stone Him to death.

John 8:58 Jesus said to them, "assuredly I say to you, before Abraham was, I AM." Then they took up stones to throw at Him;

EX 3:14 And God said to Moses, " I AM WHO I AM." And He said, "Thus you shall say to the children of Israel, I AM has sent me to you.".

I AM is the name that God called Himself to Moses, and it is the name the Jesus called Himself while one earth as God-Man.

John 10:30 I and my Father are One. 31. Then the Jews took up stones to stone Him.. 33.. For good works we do not stone You, but for blasphemy, and because You, being a Man, make Yourself God.

The Jews understood and Jesus was telling them He was God in human flesh.

Matthew 1:23 Behhold, the virgin whall be with child, and bear a Son and they shall call His name Immanuel," which is translated, "God with us."

Philippeans 2:7 but made Himself of no reputation (stripped Himself), taking the FORM (shape of guise) of a bondservent, and coming in the LIKENESS of men.

8. And being found in the APPEARANCE as a man---

Notice that none of these verses say that God's Son, the Word, ever gave up being God. He left His home with Father God to take on the shape and form, the guise of a man, but He never ceased to be God. He left His position and status to become very lowly. He was somewhat limited because He became fully man. But He never ceased to be fully God.

Blessings,

Willa

 

Thanks Willa for your explanations.

The question comes up in my mind now, why would the Biblen quote that Jesus was man on this earth and not man-God?

The other huge problem is now that if Jesus was God on this earth, how is it possible that He died on the cross as God cannot die?

The Bible also teach us the following:-

1.     That Jesus died on the cross as man. 1 Tim 2:5; Luk 23:47; Mark 15:39

2.     That Jesus gave up His Godliness when He became man. Joh 17:5

3.     If He was God, why would He sit on His own right hand side? Heb 10:12; Luk 22:69

4.     If He was God, why did He resurrect Himself and how would He do it, If Jesus-God was not dead, the crucifixion would be a bluff ? 1 Cor 6:14

5.     If He was God, why did He keep the Commandments? Joh 15:10; Joh 14:15,21

6.     If He was God, why did He have to give up His deity to become man on this earth? Why did He not stay as God? 1 Tim 2:5; Joh 1:14

7.     Jesus said Himself that if we love Him we would obey the Commandments, which INCLUDES the Sabbath commandment? He would not refer to the 

        Commandments of God whilst silently keeping quiet about the Sabbath Commandment. Joh 14:21

8.     Jesus spoke to God referring to Himself as the Son of God, and not God. Joh 17:1

9.     Jesus said that He also kept the Word of God, referring to the Commandments, ALL of them. Joh 8:55

10.    Jesus said Himself that He had flesh and bones after His resurrection, meaning He was man, as God does not have bones and flesh. Luk 24:3

11.    The Bible quotes that Jesus is sitting as High Priest next to God and not as God. Heb 8:1

12.    The Bible teaches the transition of Jesus from Man to High Priest and not God to God. Heb 5:5

13.    Why would Jesus pray to God, asking Him to give Him back His Godly status that He had before the world was, if He had deity status on this earth?

         Joh 17:5

 

There are too many questions if we want to believe that Jesus was God on this earth, as you can see from some of them above. If He was God on this earth, He could NOT have died on the cross as God CANNOT die. That makes the whole Salvation Plan of God Null and Void. Satan will have a huge manouvering tool on judgement day to use to convince the unsaved that Jesus was a bluff on this earth as He pretended to die as MAN on the cross whilst He was in fact God on the cross. Can you for one moment imagine what God's reaction will be if He had to find out from Satan that His Salvation Plan had a flaw in it. The fact also that blood poured from His body when He was pierced with a sword also proves that He was MAN and NOT God. Before He was crucified, He went on His knees praying to God. Why would He pray to God or Himself if He was God on this earth? Maybe you can shed some light on my questions.

Edited September 12, 2014 by tff

[Wildstar]

There are many arguments about which day is the Sabbath day and whether it is still valid or not today. Any opinions? I use the Bible KJV and only texts from the Bible must be provided please to prove your point.

I am of the freewoman, the bondwoman has been thrown out.

 

The law and the sabbath is of no effect.  Jesus was the result of the law and our inability to keep from that fate.