cherub "Idols" in God's presence

[Wildstar]

Throughout the Old Testament, God gets angry of creating IDOLS & putting them in the places of worship. But, as myself, many of us may get surprised that, God Himself tell to Moses to make cherub "Idols" on the Mercy seat. How to explain this ?

 

If they are "Idols", my question is why God asked to place Cherub models ? Why don't He place real Cherubs from Heaven, at the time His presence was on the mercy seat ?

They can become idols.  Anything can becom Idols.  But I would hope to God that anyone who believes in the God who commanded these to be made knows that he is in HEAVEN and not a decoration. 

[Pamelasv]

They were giving God glory because they were looking down at the ark. It still pointed to God, not them.

[Reformed Baptist]

Throughout the Old Testament, God gets angry of creating IDOLS & putting them in the places of worship. But, as myself, many of us may get surprised that, God Himself tell to Moses to make cherub "Idols" on the Mercy seat. How to explain this ?

 

If they are "Idols", my question is why God asked to place Cherub models ? Why don't He place real Cherubs from Heaven, at the time His presence was on the mercy seat ?

 

One needs to bear in mind a few things. 

 

Firstly the Ark and the Mercy Seat were shut away. No one saw it except the high priest and he could only see it once a year. How could they be idols if they are out of sight? 

 

Secondly we need to consider the function of the Cherubim as they are presented in scripture. It seems to me that their task is primarily concerned with guarding the honour and glory of God. For a people who lived in a time when symbolism was the main means of communication this was a powerful picture of just holy the mercy seat was. 

 

Thirdly we should also bear in mind that the Ark went missing (perhaps in the Babylonian conquest) maybe this was prevent it becoming an idol as the worship of God devolved in Judah - after all the bronze serpent had become an idol before and needed to be destroyed. 

[lavey.online]

 

Throughout the Old Testament, God gets angry of creating IDOLS & putting them in the places of worship. But, as myself, many of us may get surprised that, God Himself tell to Moses to make cherub "Idols" on the Mercy seat. How to explain this ?

 

If they are "Idols", my question is why God asked to place Cherub models ? Why don't He place real Cherubs from Heaven, at the time His presence was on the mercy seat ?

 

One needs to bear in mind a few things. 

 

Firstly the Ark and the Mercy Seat were shut away. No one saw it except the high priest and he could only see it once a year. How could they be idols if they are out of sight? 

 

Secondly we need to consider the function of the Cherubim as they are presented in scripture. It seems to me that their task is primarily concerned with guarding the honour and glory of God. For a people who lived in a time when symbolism was the main means of communication this was a powerful picture of just holy the mercy seat was. 

 

Thirdly we should also bear in mind that the Ark went missing (perhaps in the Babylonian conquest) maybe this was prevent it becoming an idol as the worship of God devolved in Judah - after all the bronze serpent had become an idol before and needed to be destroyed. 

 

Is it possible ... there any literal relationship between the "bronze serpent" & "the cherubim" models ?

 

Why I ask this is .. in Bible every element has a unique mean ... like, ... gold, silver, bronze ...

 

Cherubim is made up of gold, while the serpent is of bronze ... So I think, God wanted to tell something through these elementary selections ...

Edited January 30, 2015 by lavey.online

[Reformed Baptist]

 

 

Throughout the Old Testament, God gets angry of creating IDOLS & putting them in the places of worship. But, as myself, many of us may get surprised that, God Himself tell to Moses to make cherub "Idols" on the Mercy seat. How to explain this ?

 

If they are "Idols", my question is why God asked to place Cherub models ? Why don't He place real Cherubs from Heaven, at the time His presence was on the mercy seat ?

 

One needs to bear in mind a few things. 

 

Firstly the Ark and the Mercy Seat were shut away. No one saw it except the high priest and he could only see it once a year. How could they be idols if they are out of sight? 

 

Secondly we need to consider the function of the Cherubim as they are presented in scripture. It seems to me that their task is primarily concerned with guarding the honour and glory of God. For a people who lived in a time when symbolism was the main means of communication this was a powerful picture of just holy the mercy seat was. 

 

Thirdly we should also bear in mind that the Ark went missing (perhaps in the Babylonian conquest) maybe this was prevent it becoming an idol as the worship of God devolved in Judah - after all the bronze serpent had become an idol before and needed to be destroyed. 

 

Is it possible ... there any literal relationship between the "bronze serpent" & "the cherubim" models ?

 

Why I ask this is .. in Bible every element has a unique mean ... like, ... gold, silver, bronze ...

 

Cherubim is made up of gold, while the serpent is of bronze ... So I think, God wanted to tell something through these elementary selections ...

 

 

I don't believe so - two inanimate objects cannot have a relationship - they are after all inanimate, so how can they relate to one another?  

 

The pedant in would point out bronze is an alloy and not an element. I would also suggest you have be very careful ascribing specific meanings to inanimate things in scripture. Take gold for example, sometimes it seems to point towards kingship (Matt 2:11), other times to purity (Zech 13:9) but also simply to point to  wealth (Gen 13:2) sometimes it use is utterly negative, see for example Rev 17:4.  

 

I would suggest that this sort of speculation regarding a link is a blind alley that will lead to a dead end. However in reference back to OP the point is that the Cherubim were not created as idols and where hidden away and then taken away before they could become idols. 

[lavey.online]

 

 

 

Throughout the Old Testament, God gets angry of creating IDOLS & putting them in the places of worship. But, as myself, many of us may get surprised that, God Himself tell to Moses to make cherub "Idols" on the Mercy seat. How to explain this ?

 

If they are "Idols", my question is why God asked to place Cherub models ? Why don't He place real Cherubs from Heaven, at the time His presence was on the mercy seat ?

 

One needs to bear in mind a few things. 

 

Firstly the Ark and the Mercy Seat were shut away. No one saw it except the high priest and he could only see it once a year. How could they be idols if they are out of sight? 

 

Secondly we need to consider the function of the Cherubim as they are presented in scripture. It seems to me that their task is primarily concerned with guarding the honour and glory of God. For a people who lived in a time when symbolism was the main means of communication this was a powerful picture of just holy the mercy seat was. 

 

Thirdly we should also bear in mind that the Ark went missing (perhaps in the Babylonian conquest) maybe this was prevent it becoming an idol as the worship of God devolved in Judah - after all the bronze serpent had become an idol before and needed to be destroyed. 

 

Is it possible ... there any literal relationship between the "bronze serpent" & "the cherubim" models ?

 

Why I ask this is .. in Bible every element has a unique mean ... like, ... gold, silver, bronze ...

 

Cherubim is made up of gold, while the serpent is of bronze ... So I think, God wanted to tell something through these elementary selections ...

 

 

I don't believe so - two inanimate objects cannot have a relationship - they are after all inanimate, so how can they relate to one another?  

 

The pedant in would point out bronze is an alloy and not an element. I would also suggest you have be very careful ascribing specific meanings to inanimate things in scripture. Take gold for example, sometimes it seems to point towards kingship (Matt 2:11), other times to purity (Zech 13:9) but also simply to point to  wealth (Gen 13:2) sometimes it use is utterly negative, see for example Rev 17:4.  

 

I would suggest that this sort of speculation regarding a link is a blind alley that will lead to a dead end. However in reference back to OP the point is that the Cherubim were not created as idols and where hidden away and then taken away before they could become idols. 

 

Thanx RB

[lavey.online]

May anyone tell this ... why cherubs cover the Almighty God's presence in Zion (Heaven) ? What is the purpose of covering ?

 

" You were the anointed cherub who covers, And I placed you there. ... " - Ezekiel 28:14.

[angels4u]

May anyone tell this ... why cherubs cover the Almighty God's presence in Zion (Heaven) ? What is the purpose of covering ?

 

" You were the anointed cherub who covers, And I placed you there. ... " - Ezekiel 28:14.

Question: "What are cherubim? Are cherubs angels?"

Answer:Cherubim/cherubs are angelic beings involved in the worship and praise of God. The cherubim are first mentioned in the Bible inGenesis 3:24, “After He drove the man out, He placed on the east side of the Garden of Eden cherubim and a flaming sword flashing back and forth to guard the way to the tree of life.” Prior to his rebellion, Satan was a cherub (Ezekiel 28:12-15). The tabernacle and temple along with their articles contained many representations of cherubim (Exodus 25:17-22;26:1,31;36:8;1 Kings 6:23-35;7:29-36;8:6-7;1 Chronicles 28:18;2 Chronicles 3:7-14;2 Chronicles 3:10-13;5:7-8;Hebrews 9:5).

Chapters 1 and 10 of the book of Ezekiel describe the “four living creatures” (Ezekiel 1:5) as the same beings as the cherubim (Ezekiel 10). Each had four faces—that of a man, a lion, an ox, and an eagle (Ezekiel 1:10; also 10:14)—and each had four wings. In their appearance, the cherubim “had the likeness of a man” (Ezekiel 1:5). These cherubim used two of their wings for flying and the other two for covering their bodies (Ezekiel 1:6,11,23). Under their wings the cherubim appeared to have the form, or likeness, of a man's hand (Ezekiel 1:8;10:7-8,21).

The imagery ofRevelation 4:6-9also seems to be describing cherubim. The cherubim serve the purpose of magnifying the holiness and power of God. This is one of their main responsibilities throughout the Bible. In addition to singing God's praises, they also serve as a visible reminder of the majesty and glory of God and His abiding presence with His people.

Read more:http://www.gotquestions.org/cherubim.html#ixzz3R4UKzDAl

 

Hope this explains it?

[lavey.online]

wow ... excellent explanation ...

 

" The cherubim serve the purpose of magnifying the holiness and power of God. This is one of their main responsibilities throughout the Bible. In addition to singing God's praises, they also serve as a visible reminder of the majesty and glory of God and His abiding presence with His people."

 

But I have some doubts on covering God's presence ...

 

1. If a cherub wants to cover God's presence, it must go very near to Him ... it means, coming very close to His presence ... Don't you think it is dangerous to come close near the Almighty God, when He is at His FULL GLORY. Doesn't the cherubim burnt & become ashes ?

 

2. Why God does not allow the real cherubim to cover His presence in the "Mercy Seat", under the tabernacle. Why He wanted to make 'idols' like cherubim ?

[Ezra]

If they are "Idols", my question is why God asked to place Cherub models ? Why don't He place real Cherubs from Heaven, at the time His presence was on the mercy seat ?

It is incorrect to equate the cherubim on the mercy seat with "idols". An idol was a image of a false god which could be viewed by everyone and worshipped by everyone.  The cherubim were within the most holy place, which could only be approached by one individual and only once a year -- on the day of atonement (Lev 16:17).  As to why there were no real cherubim in the most holy place, it is because there was something even greater in that place -- the presence of God Himself -- in His Shekinah glory (Exod 40:34).

Edited February 8, 2015 by Ezra