How Do Angels And Demons Fight?

[Kan]

 

The universe is a physical place.

Jesus as God made all things, whether visible or invisible to us.

Heaven is a physical place within the universe as our earth is.

Angels are physical beings which may or may not be seen by men, according to the will of God.

 

The battles are real and physical, involving all efforts an angel can use, including weapons. ...

The Bible says differently:

 

Ps 104:4 [The LORD] maketh his angels spirits; his ministers a flaming fire...

 

Judg. 13:20 For it came to pass, when the flame went up toward heaven from off the altar, that the angel of the LORD ascended in the flame of the altar.

 

Angels can take physical form when coming into our physical realm, but only as garments. Only the race of Adam has flesh/physical form by its own nature. Angels in their own natures are clothed with spiritual "substances," including fire/light and spirit, depending on the which of the three heavens the Creator created them to dwell in.

 

 

I am guessing that your understanding of matter defines what you think about spiritual things God has created.

Matter is a hologram compared to other forces and physical states in the universe, the idea that spiritual things are wisps of a ghost land is a pagan one that does not ring true in the Bible. God is far more real than His creation, so when He is described as a Spirit it is not suggesting a ghost, but something stronger than matter. It was the Spirit which worked in the creation. Matter is an effect and a product of things far stronger, and enduring, but never a puff of nothing like a ghost.

The Bible calls earthly things temporal and changeable, but the spiritual things eternal. The city of God has stones and crystals which cannot be broken. 

What you and I think is physical and solid is in fact light and full of space. It's like a couple of balloons bouncing off each other, they think it is a solid event, but in fact they are just bubbles of air. How does the balloon compare to the person holding it? Can the balloon understand what the being is that holds it? No. Neither do we understand how real God is, but we have interpreted the material world as solid, and the spiritual as a waif, when it's the other way around.

[Kan]

 

To describe the power of just one angel of God, in the Old Testament, a confederate army was intending to invade Israel, numbering 185,000 soldiers.

While they slept and guarded their camp, the angel was sent to slay them all in one night. The angel had to do it in such a way that none would wake up and cause a commotion and fleeing from the very large site. So he had to plan every strike, killing up to eight men per second for over 8 hours. When he was done, none were left.

A bit of poetic licence here? Have you considered instantaneous death? Is not God all powerful? 

 

 

Then why did God lead the people through the sea instead of snapping them to the other side? God is all powerful, but He works through the natural.

[OakWood]

I'm keeping it simple. I believe that they do fight physically (but when I say physically I mean in spiritual bodies in the spiritual realm of course). They are immortal but can still feel pain, hurt each other, carry weapons and even capture and bind each other.

[missmuffet]

http://www.gotquestions.org/spirit-world.html

[OneLight]

I have come to accept that how I perceive the spiritual world would become very unrealistic unless I related it to something I already understood, the physical world.  When I consider how they would battle each other, all I have are stored memories to rely on to create a mental image.  I could also use my imagination, yet I understand also that the probability of my imagination being correct is less than my change of winning the lottery.

 

In a nutshell, we will never know until we are one ourselves ...

[WilliamL]

 

 

Heaven is a physical place within the universe as our earth is.

Angels are physical beings which may or may not be seen by men, according to the will of God.

 

The battles are real and physical, involving all efforts an angel can use, including weapons. ...

The Bible says differently:

 

Ps 104:4 [The LORD] maketh his angels spirits; his ministers a flaming fire...

 

Judg. 13:20 For it came to pass, when the flame went up toward heaven from off the altar, that the angel of the LORD ascended in the flame of the altar.

 

Angels can take physical form when coming into our physical realm, but only as garments. Only the race of Adam has flesh/physical form by its own nature. Angels in their own natures are clothed with spiritual "substances," including fire/light and spirit, depending on the which of the three heavens the Creator created them to dwell in.

 

I am guessing that your understanding of matter defines what you think about spiritual things God has created.

Matter is a hologram compared to other forces and physical states in the universe, the idea that spiritual things are wisps of a ghost land is a pagan one that does not ring true in the Bible. God is far more real than His creation, so when He is described as a Spirit it is not suggesting a ghost, but something stronger than matter. It was the Spirit which worked in the creation. Matter is an effect and a product of things far stronger, and enduring, but never a puff of nothing like a ghost.

The Bible calls earthly things temporal and changeable, but the spiritual things eternal. The city of God has stones and crystals which cannot be broken. 

What you and I think is physical and solid is in fact light and full of space. It's like a couple of balloons bouncing off each other, they think it is a solid event, but in fact they are just bubbles of air. How does the balloon compare to the person holding it? Can the balloon understand what the being is that holds it? No. Neither do we understand how real God is, but we have interpreted the material world as solid, and the spiritual as a waif, when it's the other way around.

 

Way too much guessing about what I believe.

 

The heavenly realms are not physical, in the common English understanding of the word. So when you say, "Angels are physical beings," I have to disagree. That does not mean I believe they are not substantial forms within their own realms, of even greater potential power than forms native to our own realm, or that they cannot take physical form when descending into this one. But their essential natures are not physical, as ours are.

Edited February 15, 2015 by WilliamL

[WilliamL]

 

Just how do they battle each other? 

Looking back, I realize I never answered this part of the question. Consider these Scriptures:

 

Rev. 19:15 And out of his [Christ's] mouth goeth a sharp sword, that with it he should smite the nations...

Eph. 6:17 And take the helmet of salvation, and the sword of the Spirit, which is the word of God...

 

The sword of the Spirit in the spiritual worlds is the Word of the Lord. They will fight with the power of their words: the truths of the Word will battle the lies of the Deceiver. Words have power to cast down and destroy, whether used in righteous or in unrighteousness. When spiritually portrayed, they can appear as swords or other weapons of human warfare.

 

To add to this thought, I had the following image come into my mind:

 

When Jesus cast out demons with his word, that word acted as a sword that cut the snares and nets with which the demons attached themselves to their hosts, through which they were drawing out life from them. Because evil ones are cut off from the Lifegiver, they must use all their wiles to steal life from other living beings. So to wield the sword means, in spirit, to cut away lies and deceptions. In the most extreme case, the Sword of the Lord will be used to sever "the silver cords" of the peoples warring against the Beast, thus cutting myriads off from their life with a stroke.

 

When Scripture speaks of the rod/staff, however, this is the image of the shepherd's staff, by which the shepherd either guides sheep in the proper direction by tapping on their right or left flanks; or smites them on the rear end to get them going when they are being stubborn; or smites them on the head to make them stop heading in a harmful way. Therefore, when the Lord comes "to rule all nations with a rod of iron," this is a metaphor of His coming rule that will brook no compromise in his laws.

[1x1is1]

Perhaps angels one on one would be a tie.  But when you have two against one, the two wins.  You know, 2/3 of good angels vs the 1/3 that fell.  Or does the archangel Michael have certain options available to him that normal angels do not?

 

As other posts have mentioned, if God equipped humans with the ability make the devil flee by invoking the Name of Jesus, then maybe the battles in Heaven consist of words.  Or, since there is so much singing in heaven, then maybe the songs containing the purist lyrics will overcome.  

 

I like all the possibilities brought up in here. You folks make my day.      

[Marilyn C]

I guess I'm thinking of the "war in heaven" passages, (and to a lesser extent, the ones about Danial's prayers being hindered for weeks until the archangel Michael came to help). Can they somehow physically fight each other even though they are spirits? Can they be wounded and suffer pain?

 

I know the fallen angels will indeed suffer torment in the Lake of Fire - so it makes me wonder.

 

Just how do they battle each other? 

Hi Tinky,

 

Interesting question. My thoughts are that the `fighting` aspect is a picture of what we see in our world however in the spiritual world the authority of God is the key. Now because God has not wrapped it all up yet, then there is an aspect that demons have a certain amount of power - re: Matt. 4, when Satan tempts the Lord. And we know that Jesus now has all power & authority but has not as yet exercised this to put down these different powers.

 

Thus when we read about demonic powers in God`s word as regards the Body of Christ, then we are to bring those - thoughts, influences that trouble us under Christ (2 Cor. 10: 1 - 6)

 

`...casting down arguments & every high thing that exalts itself against the knowledge of God, bringing every thought into captivity to the obedience of Christ.....` (2 Cor. 10: 5)

 

When dealing with other people we are to rebuke those demons, influences over people, however it is always that persons will that needs to choose to follow Christ.

 

So these are examples of us against principalities & powers, but you asked concerning angels against angels. And this is really the same, as it is the word of God, His authority that He gives for that particular assignment in line with His purposes. Angels are eternal beings, so it is not a matter of destroying the `flesh,` but of who has the OK of God for that specific matter.

 

Thus we see in Revelation 12: 7 - 12 that Michael & his angels `fought` against the Devil & his demonic angels & cast them to the earth. Why? Because that was God`s word, His authority for what was to take place.  Satan`s power was gradually being reduced - from the 3rd heaven, near God`s throne, where he had great power & glory, to the Universal area where he had power as the `Prince of the power of the air,` to being cast to the earth, till then bound for a 1,000 years till then cast into the lake of fire.

 

Down, down, down, being reduced in power & authority & being exposed for the liar, deceitful, cruel, controller he is.

 

So `God`s authority` is the key in regard to His purpose, a step at a time.

 

Blessings, Marilyn.

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

[Guest]

if God equipped humans with the ability make the devil flee by invoking the Name of Jesus,

 

then maybe the battles in Heaven

 

consist of words.  

 

 

Yet Michael the archangel, when contending with the devil he disputed about the body of Moses,

durst not bring against him a railing accusation,

but said, The Lord rebuke thee. Jude 1:9