Saturday or Sunday?

[Justin Adams]

"The observance of Sunday by the Protestants is an homage they pay, in spite of themselves, to the authority of the [Catholic] church."Monsignor Louis Segur, Plain Talk About the Protestantism of Today (1868), p. 213 

Which is the Sabbath day? 
Saturday is the Sabbath day. 
Why do we observe Sunday instead of Saturday? 
We observe Sunday instead of Saturday because the Catholic Church transferred the solemity from Saturday to Sunday." 
Peter Geiermann, The Convert's Catechism of Catholic Doctrine (1946 ed.), p.50. Geiermann received the "apostolic blessing" of Pope Pius X on his labors, January 25, 1910. 

No such law in the Bible "Nowhere" in the bible do we find that Jesus or the apostles ordered that the Sabbath be changed from Saturday to Sunday. We have the commandment of God given to Moses to keep holy the Sabbath day, that is, the Seventh day of the week, Saturday. Today, all Christians keep Sunday because it has been revealed to us by the [Roman] church outside the Bible." Catholic Virginian, Oct. 3, 1947

"You may read the Bible from Genesis to Revelation, and you will not find a single line authorizing the sanctification of Sunday. The Scriptures enforce the religious observance of Saturday, a day which we never sanctified." James Cardinal Gibbons, The Faith of Our Fathers (1917 ed.), pp.72,73 

"If protestants would follow the Bible, they should worship God on the Sabbath Day, that is Saturday. In keeping Sunday they are following a law of the Catholic Church." Albert Smith, chancellor of the Archdiocese of Baltimore, replying for the cardinal in a letter of Feb. 10, 1920. 

"Have you not any other way of proving that the Church has power to institute festivals of precept?" 
"Had she not such power, she could not have done that in which all modern religionists agree with her, she could not have substituted the observance of Sunday, the first day of the week, for the observance of Saturday, the Seventh day, a change for which there is no Scriptural authority" Stephen Keenan, A Doctrinal Catechism 3rd ed. p. 174 

How prove you that the Church hath power to command feasts and holydays? 
By the very act of changing the Sabbath into Sunday, which Protestants allow of; and therefore they fondly contradict themselves, by keeping Sunday strictly, and breaking most other feasts commanded by the same Church." Henry Tuberville, An Abridgment of the Christian Doctrine (1833 approbation), p.58 (Same statement in Manual of Christian Doctrine, ed. by Daniel Ferris [1916 ed.], p.67) 

"The Catholic Church,... by virtue of her divine mission, changed the day from Saturday to Sunday. 
" The Catholic Mirror, official organ of Cardinal Gibbons, Sept. 23, 1893. 

"Is Saturday the 7th day according to the Bible and the 10 Commandments?" 
"I answer yes". 
"Is Sunday the first day of the week and did the Church change the 7th day, Saturday, for Sunday, the 1st day?" 
"I answer yes". 
"Did Christ change the day?" 
"I answer no!" Faithfully yours, "J. Cardinal Gibbons" Gibbons' autograph letter. 

Some theologians have held that God likewise directly determined the Sunday as the day of worship in the NEW LAW, that he himself has explicitly substituted Sunday for the Sabbath. 

But this theory is entirely abandoned. It is now commonly held that God simply gave His church the power to set aside whatever day or days she would deem suitable as holy days. The church chose Sunday, the first day of the week, and in the course of time added other days as holy days." 
John Laux A Course in Religion for Catholic High Schools and Academies 1936, vol.1 p.51 

Which is the Sabbath day? 
Saturday is the Sabbath day. 
Why do we observe Sunday instead of Saturday? 
We observe Sunday instead of Saturday because the Catholic Church transferred the solemity from Saturday to Sunday." 
Peter Geiermann, The Convert's Catechism of Catholic Doctrine (1946 ed.), p.50. Geiermann received the "apostolic blessing" of Pope Pius X on his labors, January 25, 1910. 

"The Catholic Church changed the observance of the Sabbath to Sunday by right of the divine, infallible authority given to her by her Founder, Jesus Christ. The Protestant, claiming the Bible to be the only guide of faith, has no warrant for observing Sunday. 

In this matter the Seventh Day Adventist is the only consistent Protestant. The Catholic Universe Bulletin, Aug. 14, 1942, p.4 

"The observance of Sunday by the Protestants is an homage they pay, in spite of themselves, to the authority of the [Catholic] church."Monsignor Louis Segur, Plain Talk About the Protestantism of Today (1868), p. 213 

Exodus 20: 8-11, 
(8) Remember the Sabbath day to keep it holy. (9) Six days shalt thou labor and do all thy work: (10) But the Seventh day is the Sabbath of the Lord thy God: in it thou shalt not do any work, thou, nor thy son, nor thy daughter, thy manservant, nor thy maidservant, nor thy cattle, nor thy stranger that is within thy gates: (11) For in six days the Lord made the heaven and earth, the sea, and all that in them is, and rested the Seventh day: wherefore the Lord blessed the Sabbath day, and hallowed it. 

Colossians 2:8 warns us to: 
Beware lest any man spoil you through philosophy and vain deceit, after the tradition of men after the rudiments of the world, and not after Christ. 

What power has claimed authority to change God's law? 
The Papacy in Rome. 
"The Pope is of so great authority and power that he can modify, explain, or interpret even Divine Laws...The Pope can modify divine law, since his power is not of man, but of God, and he acts as vicegerent of God upon earth." Translated from Lucius Ferraris, Prompta Bibliotheca (Ready Library), "Papa", art. 2. 

What part of the law of God has the papacy thought to change? 
The Fourth Commandment. 
"Catholics alledge the change of the Sabbath into the Lord's day, contrary, as it seemeth, to the Decalogue; and they have no example more in their mouth than the change of the Sabbath. They will needs have to be very great, because it hath dispensed with a precept of the Decalogue." The Augsburg Confession (Lutheran), part 2, art. 7, in Philip Schaff, The Creeds of Christendom (Harper), vol. 3, p. 64. 

"It [the Roman Catholic Church] reversed the Fourth Commandment by doing away with the Sabbath of God's word and instituting Sunday as a holiday." N. Summerbell, History of the Christian Church (1873), p. 415. 

Does the papacy acknowledge changing the Sabbath? 
It does. 
The Catechismus Romanus was commanded by the Council of Trent and published by the Vatican Press, by order of Pope Pius V, in 1566. This catechism for priests says: "It pleased the church of God, that the religious celebration of the Sabbath day should be transferred to 'the Lord's day. Sunday.'" Catechism of the Council of Trent (Donovan's translation, 1867), part 3, chap. 4, p. 345. The same in slightly different wording, is in the McHugh and Callan translation (1937 ed.), p. 402. 

Do Catholic authorities acknowledge that there is no command in the bible for santification of Sunday? 
They do. 
"You may read the Bible from Genesis to Revelation, and you will not find a single line authorizing the sanctification of Sunday. The Scriptures enforce the religious observance of Saturday, a day which we never sanctify." James Cardinal Gibbons, The Faith of Our Fathers (1917 ed.), pp. 72,73. 

How did Sunday observance originate? 
As a voluntary celebration of the Resurrection, a custom without pretense of Divine authority. 

Matthew 28:1 KJV States clearly that Christ Rose on the Sabbath Saturday!! IN the END of the Sabbath, as it began to Dawn TOWARD the FIRST day of the week, came Mary Magdalene and the other Mary to see the sepulcher. Mat 28:6 He is not here: for he is RISEN, as he said. Come, see the place where the Lord lay. 

Who first enjoined Sunday keeping by law? 
Constantine the Great. 
"The earliest recognition of the observance of Sunday as a legal duty is a constitution of Constantine in 321 A.D., enacting that all courts of justice, inhabitants of towns, and workshops were to be at rest on Sunday (venerabili die solis), with an exception in favor of those engaged in agricultural labor." Encyclopedia Britannica, 11th ed., art. "Sunday". 

By what church council was the observance of the seventh day forbidden and Sunday observance enjoined? 
The Council of Laodicea, in Asia Minor, fourth century. 
What kind of worship does the Saviour call that which is not according to God's commandments? 
"But in vain they do worship me, teaching for doctrine the commandments of men." Matt. 15:9 

[TheMatrixHasU71]

On 10/21/2017 at 12:30 PM, Abdicate said:

Sure, you've rightly defended Sunday because that's what the translations all say, including dictionaries after 200 AD. Before this time, Sabbat meant Sabbath and comes from the Hebrew word Sabbath. Returning to the originals, you will only find Sabbath. This "Sunday" believe is the highest anti-Semitic attack ever. The Sabbath was not instituted in the Law but at Creation. Using the free TheWord.net Textus Receptus search of "σαββα" and all its word forms, you'll find that of the 64 instances 100% of the time when it speaks of the resurrection, it's translated "first day of the week" without the Greek words "first" or "day". The other times it's 100% translated "Sabbath". It is so blatant that of all the occurrences in Matthew (9), only once, Mat 28:1 is Sabbat translated "first day of the week" without the word "day". This "first" is referring to Lev 23:15! It's called Counting to Omer. And in Luke, of the 19 times Sabbat is used, twice is it translated "week", 18:12 and 24:1. As to 18:12, the translators are applying "fast twice on Sabbath" to mean two days a week. Are there not 3 meals a day? Why can't it be "I fast twice on the Sabbath"? Well, it certainly can. As to 24:1, the translation can correctly be "now one Sabbath, at deep dawn..." So again, in John with 11 Sabbat words, 9 are translated Sabbath and two "first day of the week" verses 20:1 and 20:19. In Acts, the 10 instances of Sabbat, only once is it translated "first day of the week" and that is 20:7, which by the other 9 instances blatantly misinterprets the word. Paul keeps talking about going into the Synagogues to preach "on the Sabbath" until this verse... why the change? Because he's meeting other Christians so they must keep up the lie which is again so translated in 1 Cor 16:2, but it still says Sabbat! You've been fed a traditional, anti-Semitic lie. I used to believe it too, and it's still in my chronological study, until I did my own homework. The facts are very clear and undeniable to those willing to entertain what they mean instead of maintaining tradition, just like the Jews who missed His coming and remain willingly blind today.

Sorry you are just wrong about all of this. The greek for week, εβδομάδα, is not the same as the word for Sabbath and the Greek passages literally translate as the first day of the week. Not the last day, the Saturday Sabbath. 

Do you also deny the verse which says

 

Colossians 2:16 

Let no man therefore judge you in meat, or in drink, or in respect of an holyday, or of the new moon, or of the sabbath days:

 

This is an attack against legalism where we are called not to judge one another for, amongst other things, which day we observe. So if you want to do Saturday. or some other day even, that is your right. The problem that many have here is the way the SDAs and a few others judge others who rightfully choose Sunday as is ordained by God and the bible. 
I dont judge you for choosing Saturday. I am against those who judge us for choosing Sunday

 

Also this....

Acts 15:20 | View whole chapter | See verse in context

But that we write unto them, that they abstain from pollutions of idols, and from fornication, and from things strangled, and from blood.

 

No mention whatever of observing the Saturday Sabbath here.

[OneLight]

***  I know this will be confusing at first, but I merged the two SDA threads about the Sabbath into this thread.  ***

[Justin Adams]

16 hours ago, Giller said:

The actual feast of firstfruits was on the first day of the week.

Lev 23:9-11
(9)  And the LORD spake unto Moses, saying,
(10)  Speak unto the children of Israel, and say unto them, When ye be come into the land which I give unto you, and shall reap the harvest thereof, then ye shall bring a sheaf of the firstfruits of your harvest unto the priest:
(11)  And he shall wave the sheaf before the LORD, to be accepted for you: on the morrow after the sabbath the priest shall wave it.

The morrow after the seventh day sabbath was the first day of the week, and that is when Jesus got resurrected.

Then from that day of wave sheaf you counted 50 days which brings you to the day of Pentecost, which is also on the first day of the week.

Lev 23:15-16
(15)  And ye shall count unto you from the morrow after the sabbath, from the day that ye brought the sheaf of the wave offering; seven sabbaths shall be complete:
(16)  Even unto the morrow after the seventh sabbath shall ye number fifty days; and ye shall offer a new meat offering unto the LORD.

Let scripture speak for itself.

It is to count from the day of wave sheaf unto the day after the seventh sabbath which brings you to the 50th day.

7 sabbaths pass, to get to the 50th day.
 

 

[other one]

1 hour ago, shiloh357 said:

Actually, it was talking about servile work, or any work for purposes of enriching one's self.  The Rabbis concocted 39 categories of "work"  but those are not really binding from a biblical standpoint.  Nothing Jesus did violated the biblical Sabbath restrictions.   But He violated rabbinic restrictions several times in the Gospels.

That is not what my Bible says Shiloh.  Says any work.  And Jesus didn't correct them.. Rabbi's shouldn't matter.  They make all kinds  if things to suit themselves.

 

 

[Justin Adams]

2 minutes ago, Justin Adams said:

It is to count from the day of wave sheaf unto the day after the seventh sabbath which brings you to the 50th day.

7 sabbaths pass, to get to the 50th day.

Yes, I may not have mentioned that the graph is not quite spot on.
The priest waves the sheaf indicating OK guys, you can work now. This is at the beginning of the first day after the Sabbath. Yeshua had already been to the father because he told the ladies not to touch him when he met them near the tomb. Then a little later it was OK to do so. They started out for the tomb just as the first day was beginning, it was a fair distance. However, just prior to the Sabbath's end Yeshua had already risen.
He was raised towards the end of the Sabbath. Exactly three days since He was killed on the afternoon of Nisan 14 when the Passover Lamb was slaughtered as well.

[Justin Adams]

1 hour ago, Giller said:

 

But the new day (first day), was not eliminated, for the first day of the week , weekly sabbath never existed under the old covenant, therefore not being one of the ordinances that God blotted out, which is mentioned in Colossians.

Actually, I think you will find that the fathers and the early church recognized it as the 8th day. Being the new life in Yeshua. Not the 'first day' per se. Has connotations to the circumcision and not calendar days. Being circumcised in heart and not in bodily members. Origen and a bunch of other writes refer to this 8th day. That it has been twisted to try to make the Sunday into a Sabbath (like the Romans decreed) but it never was and if you read about this it is quite clear, and a very lengthy treatise.

[Guest shiloh357]

1 hour ago, other one said:

That is not what my Bible says Shiloh.  Says any work.  And Jesus didn't correct them.. Rabbi's shouldn't matter.  They make all kinds  if things to suit themselves.

Jesus didn't do any work that violated the Sabbath.  The context is talking about secular work having to do with servile work.  Even that can be seen in English, but you have a habit of not really putting much stock in the Bible when suits you to reject what it says, so I am not surprised at your response.   

Jesus was 100% obedient and was guiltless at all points.   If Jesus violated the OT law, that would put him at odds with God the Father since it was God the Father who gave the law.  Jesus did nothing to displease the Father, as that would be sin.   And if you are prepared and willing to argue that Jesus sinned, you have a very heretical view of Jesus.

[other one]

My Bible says no work and Jesus said he was working..... You can make up things to suit your theology if you wish.....

[Justin Adams]

2 minutes ago, Giller said:

Those in and of themselves were pagan, but the bible does not speak of these days, it speaks of the first day of the week, and the 7th day of the week.

So if your focus is solely as sunday being pagan, then so is saturday.

Sabbath is the 7th day. Saturnalia (Saturday) is pagan and so is SUN-day, the first day of the week.If you are refering to the 'eighth day' then as I said before, it is a concept, not a day.

If you might read the following it will help as there is not enough room here for long quotes.

[http://sabbath.org/index.cfm/fuseaction/Library.sr/CT/BOOK/k/955/Sunday-Lords-Day-Not-Traceable-to-Apostles.htm]