"Turn or Burn" Is Not My Gospel

[Blood Bought 1953]

5 hours ago, Melinda12 said:

Well, how do we think God deals with the likes of Hitler and the other truly evil people?  

 

We pass people on the street  every day that are just as evil as Hitler.....Hitler had the Power to perform his griZzly deeds..... Members of hate groups that exist today all over the globe would do what he did and worse if they had the Power to do so as Hitler did.....think KKK and Aryan Nation members ....

Hitler is roasting in Hell right now,not because of his sins....Jesus paid the price for ALL sins....Hitler lacked that one think that lets one benefit from Christ’s Finished Work Of the Cross....Faith in Jesus Christ as Savior...

 

[wingnut-]

On 5/13/2019 at 7:40 PM, Blood Bought 1953 said:

 

Interesting......fear of the reality of Hell and  the conviction by the Holy Spirit That I deserved it ,was my personal motivation..... the horror of seeing myself as wretched and lost made for a frightful night, yet it turned out to be the best thing that ever happened to me.....It was the only way to rescue me from the Satan inspired “ fool’s paradise” that told me that even though I had my flaws , I was “ good enough” to get to Heaven.Wow. Hard to believe I was that blind.

Sometimes I wonder if one can really be a Christian without going through the horror that I went through ....to be driven to that “ woe is me” moment that Elijah experienced ( or was it Isaiah?....too lazy to look it up right now...lol) Why should my Christian experience be any different from others- especially something that had the impact to divide and change my life to such a great extent.I think what I have described is true Repentance.If repentance means to “ have a change of mind”, I sure had one.I can’t provide Scripture to support my theory so I tend not to stress it very much.........any thoughts?

 

 

I think each person is different, and God deals with each person differently.  Some require a heavier hand, and some continue to torment themselves over the smallest of infractions even after they have been forgiven the offense.  I don't think it is possible to put us all in one box, just as a parent of multiple children would tell you that each child required a unique approach, so it is with God's children.  Those are my thoughts, for what it's worth.

God bless

[Guest]

4 hours ago, Blood Bought 1953 said:

 

We pass people on the street  every day that are just as evil as Hitler.....Hitler had the Power to perform his griZzly deeds..... Members of hate groups that exist today all over the globe would do what he did and worse if they had the Power to do so as Hitler did.....think KKK and Aryan Nation members ....

Hitler is roasting in Hell right now,not because of his sins....Jesus paid the price for ALL sins....Hitler lacked that one think that lets one benefit from Christ’s Finished Work Of the Cross....Faith in Jesus Christ as Savior...

 

Indeed i agree. We each choose how we act and where we go therefore. Eternity of love in heaven or burn in hell. To me it is clear. Our choice. God on one side, devil on the other. If you choose not to choose christ then by default you choose hell. Jesus was crystal clear about it. 

[JustPassingThru]

5 hours ago, Tigger56 said:

As for scripture...  I would recommend you go back and look back over all the scriptures dealing with death and resurrection. It should be a fun study for you and it would save me the time from going over everyone of them. But if you still desire me to do this for you let me know.....  Thanks.

Sorry bro, it doesn't work that way...

If you are going to present a new revelation that refutes 2000 years of Church history, ...but even more important that that, you go against the very Word of Jesus Christ:

AndG2532 theseG3778 shall go awayG565 intoG1519 everlasting G166 punishment:G2851 butG1161 theG3588 righteousG1342 intoG1519 lifeG2222 eternal. G166  Matt 25:46

Please notice what He said, the words everlasting and eternal have the same Strong's number G 166

Here's the meaning of those two words:

G 166
αἰώνιος
aiōnios
Thayer Definition:
1) without beginning and end, that which always has been and always will be
2) without beginning
3) without end, never to cease, everlasting

Jesus said there will be an eternal, everlasting life for those that are righteous and an everlasting punishment for those that are not!

So in that case, what you are saying, since punishment is not everlasting-eternal, ...then our salvation is not everlasting-eternal.  

The responsibility of showing us Scripture to prove your hypothesis that Jesus Christ is wrong is on you.

[thomas t]

5 hours ago, Cletus said:

If all we ever preach is turn and burn people wont learn about Gods love and mercy and grace. 

Amen.

5 hours ago, Cletus said:

I think it depends on how one uses the phrase, turn or burn. 

For a Scribe or what used to be a Pharisee, John the Baptist used that language in Mt 3:7. If preachers use turn-or-burn messages it seems they lump their conversation partners together with folks John addressed in that verse?

But when he saw many of the Pharisees and Sadducees coming to his baptism, he said to them, “You brood of vipers! Who warned you to flee from the wrath to come?

Mt 3:7.

Even if Jesus preached more about hell than heaven, as you say... he did more than talking. Christian life is more than the preaching and talking. Jesus had fellowship, I mean real-life fellowship eating together, praising God together and so on. He made some dead people come back to life, healed the lame, defended the defenceless, hailed the children, and many more... and then he also came to warn people that there is a hell and you should be careful.

That was well balanced out!

But if all some people do is talking about God and quickly reminding everyone about the hell... where's the balance in it? Just scaring people isn't nice.

Thomas

 

[thomas t]

16 hours ago, missmuffet said:

Why do you not like the saying "Turn or burn"?

Hi Miss,

actually, this is not about the saying "turn or burn". I should have made it clearer. It is about Christians telling seekers "either you (instantly) follow my advice or burn eternally!"

This is not caring, in my opinion.

This kind of preaching, as I see it, also tries to establish a hierarchy "me: in heaven, No.1 - you, potentially burning in hell forever, you are the No.2"

Thomas

[Tigger56]

2 hours ago, JustPassingThru said:

Sorry bro, it doesn't work that way...

If you are going to present a new revelation that refutes 2000 years of Church history, ...but even more important that that, you go against the very Word of Jesus Christ:

AndG2532 theseG3778 shall go awayG565 intoG1519 everlasting G166 punishment:G2851 butG1161 theG3588 righteousG1342 intoG1519 lifeG2222 eternal. G166  Matt 25:46

Please notice what He said, the words everlasting and eternal have the same Strong's number G 166

Here's the meaning of those two words:

G 166
αἰώνιος
aiōnios
Thayer Definition:
1) without beginning and end, that which always has been and always will be
2) without beginning
3) without end, never to cease, everlasting

Jesus said there will be an eternal, everlasting life for those that are righteous and an everlasting punishment for those that are not!

So in that case, hat you are saying, since punishment is not everlasting-eternal, ...then our salvation is not everlasting-eternal.  

The responsibility of showing us Scripture to prove your hypothesis that Jesus Christ is wrong is on you.

Actually it can work that way... study and learn.... if that is your desire and approach it with a true Berean attitude and not the one you are showing here. You state I said the Lord is wrong. That is arrogant and hateful for I never said the Lord Jesus is wrong about anything. Rather, please understand your interpretation of scripture is wrong. I don't reveal "new revelation", it is only new to you and perhaps others. Eternal life is for the righteous, eternal punishment (the final death) is also for the evil doer. It never states eternal torment. It amazes me that so many seem to desire to believe in a God that would torment someone throughout eternity. No actually it doesn't amaze me, it saddens me. The belief in "eternal torment" is a belief that God has an eternal hate instead of eternal love and that is totally and completely wrong. Truthfully one of the greatest scriptures to go against all of your interpretations isn't necessarily going through all the Bible, it can be found in one scripture.... I John 4:16. That one scripture would be wrong if there is a God who would allow eternal torment and torture. I can't stand to see anyone or anything suffer, yet so many Christians seem more than ready to declare that upon others. 

 

[thomas t]

13 hours ago, Melinda12 said:

Well, how do we think God deals with the likes of Hitler and the other truly evil people?  

Hi Melinda,

thank you very much for your answer.

It is telling. "turn-or-burn", for you, seems to be automatically evoking Hitler. Very honest.

So what should people think who come here on this board asking questions seeking love and then someone slaps a fire-and-brimstone message into their face? They must think that the author on the Christian side confused them with Hitler, and that's the problem.

Christians prone to judge, everytimes ready to be harsh against new people keeping them off at the worst.

When will this come to an end? (I don't mean you, of course, I mean the turn-or-burn-fanatic messages.)

 

Meanwhile, on the subject level there was already BB resonding to you, so I'd like to leave your question for a while?

Thomas

[missmuffet]

7 hours ago, thomas t said:

Hi Miss,

actually, this is not about the saying "turn or burn". I should have made it clearer. It is about Christians telling seekers "either you (instantly) follow my advice or burn eternally!"

This is not caring, in my opinion.

This kind of preaching, as I see it, also tries to establish a hierarchy "me: in heaven, No.1 - you, potentially burning in hell forever, you are the No.2"

Thomas

 I know it is rather harsh and it would be best to put it in a more sensitive way but it is the truth. 

[thomas t]

22 minutes ago, missmuffet said:

I know it is rather harsh

Then leave it. If you know it's harsh, leave it.

Take Jesus as your example a bruised reed he will not break, and a smoldering wick he will not quench, until he brings justice to victory; Mt 12:20.

Hurling turn-or-burn-messages around when you can't exclude that you might hit some of these bruised reeds Jesus is talking about... is silly, I think.

It's not worth it.

Jesus never said "always keep telling what you think is true - any occasion is welcome regardless of the rest". Jesus said "make disciples". After all, context matters.

Regards,

Thomas

Edited May 15, 2019 by thomas t
typos